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The NRA are Idiots


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2012 Dec 21, 3:29am   49,127 views  113 comments

by David Losh   ➕follow (0)   💰tip   ignore  

I have long support the 2nd Amendment, but never contributed to the NRA. They have a very narrow agenda that is contrary to good gun ownership.

Today they proposed putting armed police in all schools saying the only way to stop a bad guy with a gun is by having a good guy with a gun. Then the statement went on to say we need a national data base of the mentally ill.

I think they should have come out strongly with a gun education program, a gun training program, with a call for exploration of the term, and requirements for a militia.

We can have a more secure gun policy in this country, but it has to start with the people involved. Today's statement was just absolute nonsense.

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7   marco   2012 Dec 21, 4:48am  

One = National Association Of Rodents

The other = National Rodent Association

(It's important to understand these basic differences..)

8   Tenpoundbass   2012 Dec 21, 5:15am  

Butch says

Japan has 1 death per 1.5 million people while the U.S.A. has 10 in 100,000 people. The facts are there. No dispute.

I like how everyone talks about how Japan doesn't have any guns.
They never had guns, they went straight from Feudalism to the Modern era with out ever having guns.

But they did once have a warrior class, that would have been their gun owners when the modern era arrived.
You great students of History remember how they got rid of all of the Samurai right?

That would be the only way we would get rid of our gun culture as well.
By prying the guns from the fingers of the NRA card members. They weren't lying, this is serious stuff.

9   FortWayne   2012 Dec 21, 5:31am  

What's wrong with having police in schools? When I was young our school always had 2 police officers on site.

You want crime to spread? Get rid of all of the police.

10   Tenpoundbass   2012 Dec 21, 5:38am  

FortWayne says

What's wrong with having police in schools?

Well if you had that then the people paying a million dollar to live in the Good school districts will feel quite stupid. If the police got rid of Ray Ray and Darell who have been holding the learning institutions hostage while they hold street code court. Then all of the schools became environments conducive to learning. It goes against the Liberal agenda to have law and order in the schools.

11   Tenpoundbass   2012 Dec 21, 5:39am  

FTR anyone that thinks the NRA are idiots for coming up with a new way to create a new demand for guns, should turn that finger inward.

12   FortWayne   2012 Dec 21, 5:40am  

CaptainShuddup says

Well if you had that then the people paying a million dollar to live in the Good school districts will fell quite stupid. If the police got rid of Ray Ray and Darell who have been holding the learning institutions hostage while they hold street code court. Then all of the schools became environments conducive to learning. It goes against the Liberal agenda to have law and order in the schools.

It always surprises me how the left has no problem taking, taxing, and spending millions of dollars to provide security to government employees and their personal property, but as soon as it comes to spending a penny on protecting children they start playing the "we won't pay for that" card.

13   MisdemeanorRebel   2012 Dec 21, 5:42am  

CaptainShuddup says

Also when these tragedies come, they never want to look at productions they've made like "Natural Born killers" or Video games that were created like "Assassins Creed".

Try Beowulf, or Odysseus. Full of gratuitous violence. Same shit, different era.

The biggest players of video games are Japanese and Swedes, also the least violent in reality.

Violent Crimes have substantially decreased over the past couple of decades as the sales of video games, inc. the most violent ones, have exponentially increased.

14   Tenpoundbass   2012 Dec 21, 5:46am  

thunderlips11 says

Try Beowulf, or Odysseus. Full of gratuitous violence. Same shit, different era.

It's not the stories it's the graphic depiction. If you don't think there's a huge difference in writing on a papyrus "Then Odysseus smite the Cyclops" and a HD 3D personalized avatar graphically cleaving someones head off with beautiful shading and rendering realistic blood gushing in 1080dp, with the ability to pause and pan around different perspectives. Then there's really no debate here.

15   leo707   2012 Dec 21, 6:00am  

CaptainShuddup says

It's not the stories it's the graphic depiction. If you don't think there's a huge difference in writing on a papyrus "Then Odysseus smite the Cyclops"...

From Beowulf.

"If Grendel wins, it will be a gruesome day;
he will glut himself on the Geats in the war-hall,
swoop without fear on that flower of manhood
as on others before. Then my face won't be there
to be covered in death: he will carry me away
as he goes to ground, gorged and bloodied;
he will run gloating with my raw corpse
and feed on it alone, in a cruel frenzy,
fouling his moor-nest." (442-450)

16   Peter P   2012 Dec 21, 6:06am  

It is the culture too. When you combine individualism with slave-morality (Nietzsche) you have an extreme form of the me-against-the-world mentality.

Alas, God is dead, we have killed him.

Real individualists respect other people as individuals.

17   boldej   2012 Dec 21, 6:09am  

What about the First Amendment? I want to see pictures of the inside of the Sandy Hook School on CNN 24 hours a day and on the front page of every newspaper!

18   Peter P   2012 Dec 21, 6:14am  

boldej says

What about the First Amendment? I want to see pictures of the inside of the Sandy Hook School on CNN 24 hours a day and on the front page of every newspaper!

That is not the freedom of SPEECH. You do not have a RIGHT to the "speech" made by others

For example, you do not have the right to see the inside of a movie theater unless you have bought a ticket.

19   drew_eckhardt   2012 Dec 21, 6:14am  

The NRA is 100% right.

Armed guards are the only way to keep people from being killed.

Feeding records of those who were determined to be dangers to themselves or others, incompetent to manage their own affairs, or involuntarily committed following due process (where they had time to contest the charges, were allowed legal representation, and the matter was decided by a judge) to the National Instant Check System is the only way to limit such peoples' purchase of firearms through legal channels.

20   Bellingham Bill   2012 Dec 21, 6:42am  

Guns . . . the cause of and the solution to all our problems.

You'd almost think the NRA was front organization for gun and ammo manufacturers.

Was there ever a National Cigarette Organization???

21   Raw   2012 Dec 21, 7:16am  

La Pierre is the most dangerous person in the country. The mother of every child that dies with a gun should slap him.
Mr. La Pierre.......The ONLY thing that will stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy who takes away all the guns.

22   drew_eckhardt   2012 Dec 21, 7:28am  

Raw says

Mr. La Pierre.......The ONLY thing that will stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy who takes away all the guns.

That's not possible.

Jamaica tried with handguns in 1974. They looked for guns with warrantless searches, created special gun courts, had secret trials, and imposed mandatory life sentences for possession.

Their murder rate skyrocketed to 60 per 100,000 following the ban.

23   FortWayne   2012 Dec 21, 8:08am  

NRA did make a great suggestion here. And it's something the left won't care to listen too when they are too busy scoring political points.

We guard our airports, we guard our banks, we have TSA, why not our children? We need a real solution to real problems in today's world, not the left wing knee jerk political reactions to score political points by instituting some sort of a ban that the left is screaming for.

24   121212   2012 Dec 21, 8:12am  

FortWayne says

We guard our airports, we guard our banks, we have TSA, why not our children? We need a real solution to real problems in today's world, not the left wing knee jerk political reactions to score political points by instituting some sort of a ban that the left is screaming for.

Our schools do not need guns, Columbine had security, made no difference. You want to scare the kids, create a greater culture of fear starting with 5yr olds?

What's wrong with you?

Ban assault rifles, stop deflecting.

Sign this petition

http://www.demandaplan.org/

The only jerk here is you!

25   Rent4Ever   2012 Dec 21, 8:16am  

Don't like the idea of armed policemen at the schools. Instead have 3-4 guns, in lock boxes at the school where 3-4 highly vetted employees are selected, trained, and licensed to have access to the guns strictly for instances of gun violence. Really not that difficult, in fact it is already commonplace at schools across the country.

It is not practical to have cops in every school for budgetary reasons nor is it a good idea for many other reasons. But having a handful of people trained and certified to use guns in this extremely rare instance is part of the answer.

26   drew_eckhardt   2012 Dec 21, 8:42am  

121212 says

FortWayne says

We guard our airports, we guard our banks, we have TSA, why not our children? We need a real solution to real problems in today's world, not the left wing knee jerk political reactions to score political points by instituting some sort of a ban that the left is screaming for.

Our schools do not need guns, Columbine had security, made no difference. You want to scare the kids, create a greater culture of fear starting with 5yr olds?

What's wrong with you?

Ban assault rifles, stop deflecting.

Sign this petition

http://www.demandaplan.org/

The only jerk here is you!

The Clinton ban ran 1994-2004.

Columbine happened in 1999 in _spite_ of the ban with one of the shooters using a so-called "Feinstein Special" as an alternative to the "assault weapon" formerly produced by its manufacturer.

27   drew_eckhardt   2012 Dec 21, 8:48am  

Rent4Ever says

It is not practical to have cops in every school for budgetary reasons

Wrong.

For the 2009-2010 school year there were 98,817 public schools in America.

At a fully burdened cost of $200K per officer (including pension, etc.) it would only cost $20 billion a year to have one present at each school during the day.

Paid for with federal money it'd only be a 0.7% increase in our budget which is a small price to pay for the children. As a country that can give people nearing the end of their lives Medicare Part D for $100 billion a year we should be able to come up with 1/5th that amount for people with their entire lives ahead of them

28   Raw   2012 Dec 21, 8:52am  

drew_eckhardt says

Rent4Ever says

It is not practical to have cops in every school for budgetary reasons

Wrong.

For the 2009-2010 school year there were 98,817 public schools in America.

At a fully burdened cost of $200K per officer (including pension, etc.) it would only cost $20 billion a year to have one present at each school during the day.

Paid for with federal money it'd only be a 0.7% increase in our budget which is a small price to pay for the children.

Schools are big. A gunman could easily come through one end, start shooting and by the time the officer gets there, a 100 kids could be dead.
If you want the success other countries have in controlling gun massacres, we have to do what they do.
And we all know what they do.

29   Raw   2012 Dec 21, 8:55am  

drew_eckhardt says

Raw says

Mr. La Pierre.......The ONLY thing that will stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy who takes away all the guns.

That's not possible.

Jamaica tried with handguns in 1974. They looked for guns with warrantless searches, created special gun courts, had secret trials, and imposed mandatory life sentences for possession.

Their murder rate skyrocketed to 60 per 100,000 following the ban.

These are cherry picked statistics. If you cherry pick enough, you could even prove the world is flat.
Lets do what the rest of the developed world does and ban these "weapons of mass slaughter" We don't live in the wild west anymore, we live in a civilized space age.

30   Raw   2012 Dec 21, 8:57am  

IDDQD says

Raw says

Mr. La Pierre.......The ONLY thing that will stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy who takes away all the guns.

... i.e. "good guy" with even more and bigger guns?

Good guys like President Obama who has the solution to a very serious problem.

31   Raw   2012 Dec 21, 9:03am  

IDDQD says

Raw says

Good guys like President Obama who has the solution to a very serious problem.

And what exactly is his solution for stopping school massacres? AWB again? Weak. He has no fresh ideas, just same old failed DiFi crap.

His solution is to start banning assault weapons.
Look at it this way....If there are no guns, no one can die with guns. Am I wrong?

32   Raw   2012 Dec 21, 9:29am  

IDDQD says

Raw says

His solution is to start banning assault weapons.

This is the old DiFi crap that already once failed to prevent school shootings. I asked about fresh ideas to stop them. Apparently he has none.

Look at it this way....If there are no guns, no one can die with guns. Am I wrong?

This is material for "Miss Universe" pageant speech, not for serious discussion.

Let's get back to question at hand: Obama's fresh and realistic ideas to stop school massacres once and for all.

So what solutions did that crazy La Pierre offer? More guns. Really? Is this a joke?
That's like trying to cure a heroine addict with a lot more heroine.

33   David Losh   2012 Dec 21, 10:37am  

The point the NRA missed was that the 2nd Amendment calls for a well regulate militia.

We called out the National Guard to fight in Iraq, but I think they would have better served as home defence.

THe NRA could have asked for militia training that would augment the police department with volunteers, They could provide gun traing, and safety, they could have offered logistical support.

They could have pointed to the National Guard as a starting point. The could have offered proactive solutions that would help safe guard out streets, schools, and neighborhoods.

Alright, you may not like the idea, but it would have established a dialog.

What I took away from today's press statement is they are giving commands, looking for monsters, and blaming every one. There was nothing positive in what they said, and then they slinked off, once again, behind closed doors.

34   anonymous   2012 Dec 21, 11:38am  

Who doesn't have a proclivity to addiction to opiates?

Obviously you've just never had the opportunity to get down like charlie brown. Pussy

35   Waitingtobuy   2012 Dec 21, 12:59pm  

I can't believe some of the idiocy here. Armed guards in schools? Seriously? What happens when a shooter targets a Chuck E Cheese? Wait, that happened. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/russell-foltzsmith/shadows_b_1693613.html

Are you going to have armed guards at every playground, little league ballpark, ice rink, and every other place kids congregate?

Drew_eckhardt, I bet you got your analogy about Jamaica from John Lott in this piece: http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2010/05/25/john-lott-kingston-jamaica-murder-gun-ban-violence-chicago-washington/

The guy is a total hack. Watched him on CNN the other night, lying through his teeth about gun violence in the UK. I can recite legitimate stats from the UK, Japan, and Australia that show gun violence falling off a cliff when strict gun control was implemented.

I have fired lots of guns in my life, family owned a rifle, and believe bolt action rifles are fine to own.

When are people going to realize the NRA is out of control, are spokesmen for the gun manufacturers, and are using people as pawns under the guise of the Second Amendment? They are literally making a killing.

36   Waitingtobuy   2012 Dec 21, 1:01pm  

Why don't we just give the $20 billion to schools directly and outlaw assault weapons and any clips over 5 rounds?

37   mell   2012 Dec 21, 2:27pm  

I thought you meant the National Realtor Association.

38   Vicente   2012 Dec 21, 3:48pm  

Waitingtobuy says

I can't believe some of the idiocy here. Armed guards in schools? Seriously?

There was a paid armed Sheriff's deputy "guarding" Columbine. Let's see how well that fantasy of perfect protection worked out shall we?

http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2000/columbine.cd/Pages/DEPUTIES_TEXT.htm

Even assuming the deputies in the immediate vicinity were in the building, how likely is it that in a large high school with 2,000 or more students they'd have been in the right positions to do the right thing at a crucial early moment?

39   Rent4Ever   2012 Dec 21, 11:13pm  

drew_eckhardt says

Rent4Ever says

It is not practical to have cops in every school for budgetary reasons

Wrong.

For the 2009-2010 school year there were 98,817 public schools in America.

At a fully burdened cost of $200K per officer (including pension, etc.) it would only cost $20 billion a year to have one present at each school during the day.

Paid for with federal money it'd only be a 0.7% increase in our budget which is a small price to pay for the children. As a country that can give people nearing the end of their lives Medicare Part D for $100 billion a year we should be able to come up with 1/5th that amount for people with their entire lives ahead of them

20 Billion dollars is 20 Billion dollars. Nothing to sneeze at. You may think that is an efficient use of those funds, but many others will not. The budgetary aspect is only part of the problem. I also do not think that simply having ONE armed person at the school is enough. There needs to be multiple people with access to firearms and their identities need to be kept hidden. In other words, the public needs to know that every public school has a handful of employees with access to firearms in the school, and they won't be wearing a hat and uniform showing the world that they are the ones with the guns. Plus it doesn't flaunt the guns presence in the school nor create the type of atmosphere that many are afraid of.

Guns are a deterrent for violence when 1) There are guns that can be used against the criminal 2) It is not known where the guns are and who has them. #1 prevents a certain % of wackos from even trying to do something like Newtown at a school. #2 allows for the most efficient way to stop a wacko once he's already begun in the school.

40   GraooGra   2012 Dec 21, 11:20pm  

David Losh says

We can have a more secure gun policy in this country, but it has to start with the people involved. Today's statement was just absolute nonsense.

He also heavily blamed MSM and entertainment industry for this culture of violence. I happen to agree with him on that one.

41   GraooGra   2012 Dec 21, 11:49pm  

121212 says

Our schools do not need guns, Columbine had security, made no difference.

But the Aurora shooter picked up that particular movie theater because it had a Gun Free Zone sign on it. There were other, bigger, closer to him places and he went for that one for a reason.
Even Newton shooter stopped and put a bullet into his own head only when he saw that a police is coming. He would continue otherwise.

42   GraooGra   2012 Dec 21, 11:52pm  

David Losh says

THe NRA could have asked for militia training that would augment the police department with volunteers, They could provide gun traing, and safety, they could have offered logistical support.

They could only present the idea of security for school. How you want to administer it is up to politicians.

43   GraooGra   2012 Dec 22, 12:09am  

Waitingtobuy says

The guy is a total hack. Watched him on CNN the other night, lying through his teeth about gun violence in the UK. I can recite legitimate stats from the UK, Japan, and Australia that show gun violence falling off a cliff when strict gun control was implemented.

John Lott was correct, he wrote a book, so he needed data to support it.

I found this for you from a different source.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2012-12-15/newtown-shooter-had-asperger-syndrome-and-some-us-gun-facts

At the bottom it states that:

...the homicide rate in England and Wales has averaged 52% higher since the outset of the 1968 gun control law and 15% higher since the outset of the 1997 handgun ban.

44   rrrrrrrr   2012 Dec 22, 12:10am  

The NRA dropped the ball on this one. Take the negotiating and hard line stance behind closed doors. Besides, why is the NRA the only organization expected to speak out on this topic.

Why wasn't the American Psychiatric Association expected to speak out about the failure of their profession in mis-prescribing anti-depressants and other drugs that play a role in the behavior of these psychopathic killers. A gun + a nearby school does not equate to a massacre. One missing piece of this puzzle is drug company lobbyists who guarantee a steady flow of unnecessary, dangerous, yet legal, drugs into our society.

45   Vicente   2012 Dec 22, 12:28am  

rrrrrrrr says

Why wasn't the American Psychiatric Association expected to speak out

APA is not responsible for state's issues.

Connecticut makes it nearly impossible, like many states, to commit someone until they commit murder. And even when you get through the paperwork the "loony bins" have 99% been closed down. Oh right STATE'S RIGHTS it's their RIGHT to cut services and dump the results on the community.

46   Rent4Ever   2012 Dec 22, 12:40am  

rrrrrrrr says

The NRA dropped the ball on this one. Take the negotiating and hard line stance behind closed doors. Besides, why is the NRA the only organization expected to speak out on this topic.

Why wasn't the American Psychiatric Association expected to speak out about the failure of their profession in mis-prescribing anti-depressants and other drugs that play a role in the behavior of these psychopathic killers. A gun + a nearby school does not equate to a massacre. One missing piece of this puzzle is drug company lobbyists who guarantee a steady flow of unnecessary, dangerous, yet legal, drugs into our society.

The issues are so complex. Much to the chagrin of the public, there is no one action or simple explanation to what happened in Newtown. Banning guns, committing every mentally ill person against their will, or anything in between will not stop this from happening in the future. Sometimes things just happen and there isn't an answer/explanation/solution for everything.

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