patrick.net

I rent to many Sec 8 folks. they can be as good a people as anyone. some times they are even on best behavior .do not judge.

The downside is if you want to make them leave. They'll may make trouble.

Trouble...like how?

033 says

So what is the downside with having section 8 tenants vs. other tenants?

You'll have to define what "other" means.

In a nutshell, renting to section 8 tenant is very similar to renting to low income households. From the perspective, if your rental attracts low income households, it is green since there is no difference anyway and you get guaranteed rents. If you rental attracts mid to high end households, the landlord will not care for it at all.

Let's say I'm renting out a SFR at 2400.
The voucher comes to me at 1800. If these people don't come up with 600, can they just skate with excuses?
Or can you UD them just like a non-sec 8 tenant?

you got to stop trouble before it starts, when i sign these folks i do it with a model 60 in my jeans to wheres they can see it an my weatherby MK V magnum rifle loaded in a rack on the wall behind my desk. there is a CONVERSATION what goes on where i do not have to say a word. i have never had a problem,

but kindness is your best alliy always. i provide my people with fresh jug of spring water every rent day and i charge half rent on they birth months. i am good to my people iand if you do same i GAURANTEE you not to have problems when they come or go.

pet policy is also important. no big dogs. turst me on this one. i learned by mistake

033 says

So what is the downside with having section 8 tenants vs. other tenants?

If you're slumlording, Section 8 isn't a bad way to do it. A large portion of rent gets paid by Uncle Sam and is guaranteed. The tenants are screened for the program, and there is some incentive not to be a thug because you will get kicked out of the Section 8 program if you are. This doesn't mean you don't need to screen tenants yourself, obviously. The problem is that lots of the Section 8 recipients are single mothers, and while the mothers and their kids generally behave, sometimes the boyfriend is the one who doesn't behave. You should make sure the lease limits the number of people who can live there without notice to you because Section 8 recipients often try to move someone else in (e.g. relative).

You can't slumlord it fully though. You must keep the property in livable condition. As the article mentions, the landlord must voluntarily submit the property to inspections. If you do not maintain the property adequately, the tenant can report you, and your property can be de-certified. Your tenants may have better access to Legal Aid, so they are better able to sue over the landlord's violations of landlord-tenant law than the typical tenant. Those free lawyers will also sue for attorney's fees if the statute allows it.

Your tenants will generally be good at working the system, although some are just down on their luck. If you are lucky, you will get a long-term tenant who pays rent like clockwork (especially if the tenant is an immigrant). If not, you'll have a revolving door of bums. I've heard some interesting stories about Section 8 landlording over the years. It can be a challenge in some ways.

One thing you may want to do is "fortify" your property against Section 8 tenants. You should focus on having durable materials that you don't care whether they are beat to hell after your tenants leave. Everything should be cheap to fix. You might have additional wear because there could be somewhat frequent turnover. I hate to say it, but you sort of want to make the house into a durable prison cell.

For example, you may even want to tile your floors (instead of carpet) and maybe even tile part way up the walls. Much easier to replace a few broken tiles, patch a few drywall holes, and hose off the rest of the tile rather than to replace destroyed carpet and destroyed drywall more than once a year. You want the cheapest fixtures you can find and ones that are relatively easy to fix if possible. You may even want to use Lexan windows instead of glass because you will get some broken windows otherwise. You may want to pave over the yard because the tenant will make it into a mudhole otherwise (hiring your own gardener works for a very nice property but will kill your margins for Section 8).

corntrollio says

ne thing you may want to do is "fortify" your property against Section 8 tenants. You should focus on having durable materials that you don't care whether they are beat to hell after your tenants leave.

this is true. damn good avdise. i have one unit near to me here tat has all concrete floors and walls. all the inside doors are sheet metal. no bath tub in the head, just a room with a drain in teh middle of the floor for grey watter what feeds back into the garden and utility sink and the toilet are prison isssue stainless steel, had to do that after one old boy took to cleaning his fish int the tub. big mess. salton sea fish at that. desgustin. the kitchen counters are 2 stainless steel cadaver tables i bought from the hospital supply butt together. unused okay! i snipped out a space for a drop in sink which is all brass. cabinets are military footlockers bolted to the walls lights in the place are barn lamps heavy duty. glass is all triple thick glass brick. door is from a walk in freezer. no lawn, all rocks and glass

indestructible. cleans up nice. way to go. i wood like to get all my place bout to where this one is.

i must confess to you that i have never had a real problem or attitude but for one fellow and his four bull terriers and it was not his fault really. long story but strong pet policy is a must as offten these folk ex cons and are not able to purchase a firearm and so they use vicsious dog breeds

the one house is really low maintainance . it actually does look good. photos are the daughter department. i will ask her tomorrow

I have been a section 8 renter for 10 years and have never left my property in poor condition. I have a credit score in the mid seven hundreds and great rental history. During the years I have met several responsible people on section 8. Please don't doom every person that receives the subsidy and lock them into renting in the slums.

i must agree with Ms Carolyn. the majorty of Sec 8 renters i have rented to are warm and trustful but some times at first they think you are gonna judge them so they got there defense up, if your wise to that and you disarm them by letting them know you do not judge them it goes a long way. remember also some were left hi n dry by hustling husbands and some are simpley trying to re build after losing they job or a sickness that leff them unable to work like they used to. be sensitive. they are good people.

Jody, Those cadaver tables are a really good idea. Stainless is naturally antibacterial.

Is violation of pet policy/occupant policy enough to void the lease? Can't they say it was just a guest?

the table are in expensive and hold up real well. i am pleased so far. they do look good in there way.

the whole place can be washed out with a pressure wahser and Borax. no painting or hard scrubbing to be done between renters. the dude I got in there now is your body builder type. real quiet and clean lifts his weights and goes to work. best tennant i think i have had.

it was my fault on that pet policy. i messed up and was to easy on it. nightmare. never again. you learn on it as you go

033 says

Is violation of pet policy/occupant policy enough to void the lease? Can't they say it was just a guest?

Yes, not only can they say that, but you can assume they will say that. Again, remember that a Section 8 tenant will generally have access to legal aid lawyers, so it's going to be somewhat difficult to evict them for anything short of non-payment. They will always claim their sister/boyfriend was just visiting for a week or two. Their dog is "just visiting." Their excess noise was due to a birthday or anniversary celebration. They will always find a way to dispute a random policy violation.

JodyChunder says

i snipped out a space for a drop in sink which is all brass.

Why brass? Isn't brass very soft relative to other metals? Why not stainless?

JodyChunder says

the one house is really low maintainance . it actually does look good. photos are the daughter department. i will ask her tomorrow

I would love to see pictures. Your house seems even more hardcore than even some of the hardened properties I've seen that were being used for Section 8.

What did you do about appliances? The refrigerator thing sometimes gets people. On one hand, it's better to have a fridge there than to have your tenant tear up your place moving one in (and getting a crappy one that might cause water damage or mold problems), but on the other hand, they might steal it. On balance, it's probably better to have your own, even if it gets jacked sometimes because a fridge is cheap, and the damage a crappy fridge can cause is not cheap.

JodyChunder says

the whole place can be washed out with a pressure wahser and Borax. no painting or hard scrubbing to be done between renters.

Yes, this is ideal for this housing segment to the extent possible.

Could you move in an 90s fridge that's still compliant? better that than an unknown fridge plus them scraping the walls.

are w/d/dishwasher ever supplied, or is this just another way to get robbed?

corntrollio says

brass? Isn't brass very soft relative to other metals? Why not stainless?

JodyChunder says

stainless sinks take on dents and are not near so hefty like this brass one., this is solid cast brass im talking now. what we call a barn sink. its salvage but looks like new. only thing i have ever replaced in 3 years was some washers and a j pipe

no appliance. no dishwasher no microwave. got a gas magic chef oven from the forties $200 bucks and the fridge just a cheapy. if that breaks or leak, it can not hurt any thing in the house how I got it set up. the floor and all the walls are sealed concrete. no mildew.

yes and I love Mexicans an love there food but one prob i do have alot of is with plumbing in the kitchen in some rentals to Mexicans. the lards they cook with they put them down the sink and it causes real bad glogs. just a heads up im not picking on any one now it is a fact. ask a plumber some time.

JodyChunder says

pet policy is also important. no big dogs. turst me on this one. i learned by mistake

Won't the small dogs crap on the floor just the same?

JodyChunder says

the lards they cook with they put them down the sink and it causes real bad glogs.

Yeah, the only way around this is a grease trap, like people are required to have in commercial kitchens.

033 says

Could you move in an 90s fridge that's still compliant?

Compliant with what? I know people who have fridges from the mid-80s that only just replaced some of them because the fridge finally died.

zzyzzx says

Won't the small dogs crap on the floor just the same?

not had that problem that I know of but any how, the floor is not poreous to any kind of spills unless you left some naval jelly on it overnite. that is SABOTAGE tho, not normal wear tear type deal.

the reason you wanna take care on that pet policy is VIOLENT animals an EXOTIC pets. I had a good old boy who youd not tell by looking at him but collected snakes. this included MOJAVE GREENS! he would rescue them and keep them on the land. he kep 8 snakes and other little crawlies all around the place. not in cages. out in yard to.

corntrollio says

Yeah, the only way around this is a grease trap, like people are required to have in commercial kitchens.

this is good advise. also on that fridge deal ..one of my people had a fridge fall over on them. it was brand new and the seals were so good that she had to jerk like to get it open some times. well one time she jerked and the damn thing fall back on her. did not hurt her but it could have been real ugly. I rigged it up since then. word or warning.

JodyChunder says

one of my people had a fridge fall over on them. it was brand new and the seals were so good that she had to jerk like to get it open some times. well one time she jerked and the damn thing fall back on her.

Sounds like an unbelievable story. If it's really true, are you sure the fridge was level? That really should not happen, and it really makes me wonder if your tenant was doing something else that caused it to tip. That's not to say it's a bad idea to secure large objects, but the story sounds very strange.

JodyChunder says

the reason you wanna take care on that pet policy is VIOLENT animals an EXOTIC pets.

Yes, this can be a problem. You can still be liable for negligence as a landlord. If someone gets bitten by that violent dog, the Section 8 tenant is not the deep pocket -- you are! If you knew that there was a violent dog there and did nothing about it, you could be found negligent under certain factual circumstances. In addition, it may have some effect on your own insurance and things like that.

corntrollio says

Sounds like an unbelievable story. If it's really true, are you sure the fridge was level? That really should not happen, and it really makes me wonder if your tenant was doing something else that caused it to tip. That's not to say it's a bad idea to secure large objects, but the story sounds very strange.

yes sounded like a tall tale to me to but the fridge door did stick. all i knows i come over to fine a brand new whirlpool on its side in the kitchen and shes hollerin how it fall on her from pulling the door open. she dint try and get nothing out of it but you always worry with this kind of thing as a property manager. she gone now years ago

Jody.
Do you now totally ban animals or make it very specific what you're banning (no apbts, no poisonous animals)?

What do you find the superior tactic in terms of insurance/liability?

yeah, I have a q-tip trust house and my deadbeat father owes me fuckin rent.
Sec 8 people are so common where I live I know several and they WILL make trouble and will complain and fight tooth and nail over anything. YRMV

I worked for a housing authority and saw many different subsidized renters. You can't lump them all into one. Some are responsible, some aren't. Some are clean, some aren't.

You can evict them as long as you go thru the process legally.

033 says

Let's say I'm renting out a SFR at 2400.
The voucher comes to me at 1800. If these people don't come up with 600, can they just skate with excuses?

There are vouchers & certificates. Depending upon the type of subsidy they have, they pay 30% or more of their adjusted gross income to the landlord. If they don't pay their share, you can evict them.

So far as legal aid lawyers, etc; as a landlord you should always do stuff legally and then no worries.

Carolyn C says

I have been a section 8 renter for 10 years and have never left my property in poor condition.

The cool thing about Section 8 is that the tenants get out into the community and don't have the stigma of being low-income attached. Carolyn is an example; it's no one's biz whether she's low income or not.

Hi Elliemae,
If you get a tenant like Carolyn or convey an unspoken arrangement as Jody has, Section 8 is a good deal as long as everyone has respect. Grease trap? No big deal. Anchoring a 1989 fridge? Easy.
The bigger deal is if all the sudden a house rented to four is occupied by 14, they have pit bulls and rattlesnakes in there as well, and you're the one with no free legal aid. Plus, I have to live in the neighborhood too.
You guess wrong, and you get a Pacific Heights situation...goddamn

033 says

Jody.
Do you now totally ban animals or make it very specific what you're banning (no apbts, no poisonous animals)?

What do you find the superior tactic in terms of insurance/liability?

it is nogotiable but basiclly no dogs over thirty five pounds acepting for battered wives wich is a big problem here in VV. they need to have some protection from there nutjob x husbands. i also acept no venomous critters. no vermin also. the guy with the mojave greens fed them heself with rats. not frozen neither but live little dudes what he let rome free. the real big problem to come out tho was this boy had a buddy who was jehova witness. well he gets bit one afternoon last spring and has to go the ER and will not take a blood trenfusion on account its against his Religion. he did okay but a five day stay in the hospital come back to grab me. I payed one half of his ER bill. I had to ask Jason the snake nut to leave at the end of his lease. so far that was my worse experiance as a Property Manager. otherwise Sex 8 are not like i see described. these folks really are victims some times. unlucky in love. PTSD soldiers. its not all a bad bunch and it kinda rightly makes me mad to see some one clump them all in like that.

Depending upon who is adminstering the Section 8 voucher/certificate, the tenant might not be allowed dogs.

Sure, it could become a Pacific Heights situation - but so could any rental situation.

"Free Legal Aid" would still mean that the renter is evicted if he isn't following the terms of the lease, and of the authority administering the S8. I assisted with evictions after the tenants weren't willing to follow the terms.

By the way, "unspoken" agreements don't count so far as Section 8 cares. The lease is approved by the authority and any breech of it by either party is terms for breaking the contract. For example, if a housing authority finds out that you've allowed an extra person to stay longer than the Section 8 agreement allows, the housing authority can terminate the subsidy. That leaves the landlord with a non-paying tenant he'll have to evict, as well as the probability that he won't be allowed to participate in the program in the future.

Yes, I've seen it happen. Not everyone gets caught, but ya never know.

Clambo,
What's a "q-tip trust house"?

JodyChunder says

zzyzzx says

Won't the small dogs crap on the floor just the same?

not had that problem that I know of but any how, the floor is not poreous to any kind of spills unless you left some naval jelly on it overnite. that is SABOTAGE tho, not normal wear tear type deal.

the reason you wanna take care on that pet policy is VIOLENT animals an EXOTIC pets. I had a good old boy who youd not tell by looking at him but collected snakes. this included MOJAVE GREENS! he would rescue them and keep them on the land. he kep 8 snakes and other little crawlies all around the place. not in cages. out in yard to.

So then you are OK with small dogs urinating and deficating on the floors?

zzyzzx says

So then you are OK with small dogs urinating and deficating on the floors?

If the homeowner isn't insulted by your offer...you didn't bid low enough!!!

no sir.

Dog pee (or cat pee) isn't a problem if the floor is underlying concrete.
If not, the smell can embed itself in the wood.

concrete slab with concrete walls. yes animals can mess up a wood floor good with pee vomit. also watch out for women in there hi heels.

033 says

Dog pee (or cat pee) isn't a problem if the floor is underlying concrete.
If not, the smell can embed itself in the wood.

I have a slab with laminate, minor flood underneath buckled the flooring. water (pee) is water, no mater the sub-flooring.

High heels are a problem too - and IMHO renters aren't as careful as are owners. Don't want to take their shoes off to preserve the floor. Best to have a good (cheap) floor that can be replaced if necessary.

EllieMae,
I've seen parquet completely destroyed by those heels (in an upscale development). Pergo, too.
Maybe the way to go is polished/distressed concrete?

033 says

Maybe the way to go is polished/distressed concrete?

you got it. vct are also good.

Jody,
Do you have to grout vct at all?

JodyChunder says

033 says

Maybe the way to go is polished/distressed concrete?

you got it. vct are also good.

Jody, where are the pics?

Re: Headline: Section 8 vouchers go to the landlord, and the feds do criminal checks on the tenants.
In this case the tenants even offered to pay for the compliance repairs:

I missed the "tenants even offered to pay for the complaince repairs" parts (the only reason why I clicked on the headline). They were behind on rent and paid some back rent after eviction proceeding started. Really, what paragraph do I find this gem in?

Re: Support system in Napa.

These folks need to be rational actors, if not for their own, then for the sake of their children. Two disabled parents and a disabled child and no family income probably means move to a lower-cost area (or state), start over fresh.

Re: What is child on disability for? Yes, this makes me a jackass, but disability payments for some learning issue is crap--so I hope that is not what my tax money is paying for. It would be better for my tax money to go to this kids and not the (where is her wheelchair, by the way) parents. Kids are not breadwinners, so unless this child has major medical expenses, he should not be getting a consolation prize/check every month (both kids look pretty normal).

I just cannot believe that there is not some job for these people to do. It is amazing what people can accomplish when they will be hungry otherwise. I feel like a complete lazy slob when I think of the story the movie The Pursuit of Happyness was based on.

Benign brain tumor that gives headaches = take pain killer. Also, I am sure these folks need to improve their diet (they should watch Fat, Sick, and Nearly Dead and hop on Mean Green).

This is what is meant by "dependency society" and they have fucked up their kids' lives, too.

If I sound harsh, then know that there was a county housing project located near my elementary school. Now due to the power of social media, I get to see how the lives of the 'project' children that I went to school with have panned out. Awful, many of those families, though kept intact, did not know how to raise kids and it turns out that just supporting people that don't know how to raise kids just repeats the cycle. Now I am even madder--the government wastes the lives of these kids. WASTES--especially the ones that die young.

Carolyn C says

I have been a section 8 renter for 10 years and have never left my property in poor condition. I have a credit score in the mid seven hundreds and great rental history. During the years I have met several responsible people on section 8. Please don't doom every person that receives the subsidy and lock them into renting in the slums.

It is the assholes that give you a bad name. Based on your post, I imagine you are the person for whom the program is made for. With a good credit score, you are living within your means, but since you qualify, then you have a legitimate income shortfall. It is the system abusers that make people want to toss out the entire program. It is also the system abusers that make landlords afraid of accepting S.8 tenants. I am glad you posted--it is nice to hear that there are those benefiting.