patrick.net

Judith549 says

It's YOUR decision if you want to change how you feel!

Not really - I feel that you're trolling & that your attempt has failed. FYI, anyone can lose weight if they starve themselves.

Dan8267 says

Market price is whatever the greatest fool is willing and able to pay. Fair market price is what informed buyers who are not under pressure can and will pay.

Um, what's the logic behind someone "disliking" the above comment?

Anyone who wines about Obama, bailing out/bankrupting Chrysler and GM. Should back up and remind themselves about the crap show that Paulson and Bush did with AIG. Flat out thievery, they didn't bankrupt the company, so all the executives still got their ill gotten bonuses, and Goldman and a bunch of foreign banks got 100 cents on the dollar for their loads of craptacular credit default swaps. I and my grandchildren just got the bill.

The whole euro/Greece bailout is a huge fiasco, but in allot of ways it's working out OK. If you lend money or a buy a financial product from a bunch of numnutz's you deserve to get pennys back on the dollar. It's called capitalism and a free market. The GOP go on and on about it, and they make me play by those rules but when it comes to their .1% buddies it's all bailouts, no bid contracts, and juicy earmarks.

How fast we forget
What will Obama's 2012 campaign slogan read ?

CHANGE WE CAN BELIEVE IN - AGAIN ?

OBAMA has taken trillions from the coffers to fix real estate prices.
Is there a soul alive that ever believed that might be accomplished ?

OK, I should have said "It seems wrong to them that a black man with a Muslim name should be sleeping in the White House." I don't have a problem with it myself.

Black, white, purple, never never trust a Chicago politican
You should know this by now, they are all liars and corrupt !

unstoppable says

Anyone who wines about Obama, bailing out/bankrupting Chrysler and GM. Should back up and remind themselves about the crap show that Paulson and Bush did with AIG. Flat out thievery,

AIG is a fairly large insurance company.. which includes insurance on good chunk of the small and large transportation carriers that goes on every day.

If a company has no insurance coverage, because AIG went under, they could not do basic day to day business like making timely deliveries.

Basic food and durable goods supply chain would halt.

Other professions like doctors, lawyers, dentists, etc etc would not be able to perform their services to consumers because they had no insurance coverage... imagine what the results would be if AIG went under.

Did the light bulb go on yet ? Yes, too big to fail.

thomas.wong1986 says

If a company has no insurance coverage, because AIG went under, they could not do basic day to day business like making timely deliveries.

Large corporations don't poof disappear. They go into bankruptcy court. The business continues to operate while the courts sort it out. If they are truly too big to fail and cannot operate under a bankruptcy court then they should be nationalized and dismantled, not given an endless supply of taxpayer money. AIG should be a bad memory by now. Any company too big to fail is too big period. Obama hasn't done anything to fix the problem, if anything the too big to fail players have gotten bigger.

thomas.wong1986 says

Did the light bulb go on yet ? Yes, too big to fail.

So you're admitting that we need "socialism"?

Too big to fail = socialism
Too big to fail = corporate welfare

I have no particular fetish for "socialism." But I can't stand it when the far right complains about "socialism" but has no problem with bailouts.

TMAC54 says

How fast we forget
What will Obama's 2012 campaign slogan read ?

Change Part 2, this time it's for reals.

thomas.wong1986 says

Other professions like doctors, lawyers, dentists, etc etc would not be able to perform their services to consumers because they had no insurance coverage... imagine what the results would be if AIG went under.

We might just find out, we don't actually need all of this insurance.
What ever happened to be bonded?

TMAC-

Here's what I found on the site you referenced:

The State of the Bailout
OUTFLOWS: $601 billion This includes money that has actually been spent, invested, or loaned.

INFLOWS: $357 billion Money returned and paid to Treasury as interest, dividends, fees or to repurchase their stock warrants.

So, where exactly is the $8.5 Trillion?

tatupu70 says

So, where exactly is the $8.5 Trillion?

In the parallel universe of far right propaganda.

Obabama's approval rating is 41%. Anyone care to run that though the Spin Cycle?

The Real Gas crisis, for MILIONS of poor Americans, is going to be Obama and this Democrats own undoing.

These poor saps are going to get the picture, that the California Liberals are NOT like them, and the poor people in America and their plight, are NOT their priority. The poor want more than a monthly Walefare check. They want stability, a steady job, affordable energy prices, and low inflation. All of that other Liberals crack smoke dreaming bullshit, doesn't mean dick all to the poor ASSHOLES that the Liberals will be looking across the pews wondering will they vote for them.

Mittler is going to take you to school and show you how it's done.
Promising a better economy, not promising free hotdogs for everyone on Bingo Tuesday. But tangible results poor people can believe in.

Romney will win, even if he put this on his tour bus.

"Mittler 2012, because the other Asshole has got to go"

tatupu70 says

So, where exactly is the $8.5 Trillion?

Without any real time researching, you can find trillions. Gubmint isn't exactly advertising ALL their tricks. I consider low interest rates and money printing as stimulus or bailout assistance.
Did any of the programs cure the principal problem ?
http://www.againstcronycapitalism.org/2011/12/bailout-list-some-banks-got-over-2-trillion/

TPB says

Obabama's approval rating is 41%. Anyone care to run that though the Spin Cycle?

Not suprising. Will Mitt "Yes Man" Romney do a better job?

wthrfrk80 says

Not suprising. Will Mitt "Yes Man" Romney do a better job?

It's not about Better anymore in this petty tit for tat politics era.
Was Obama better than Bush?

Can Batman beat up Superman?

Who makes a prettier Jesus Christ, Ted Neeley or Robert Powell?

If you wasted time answering any of these questions, you should have your voting rights revoked.

TPB says

It's not about Better anymore in this petty tit for tat politics era.

Don't we want the best possible candidate for the job? I have no particular fetish for Obama, but I don't know if Romney will be all that much better. I think he'll just do the bidding of Big Business, w/o even thinking. Not that Obama has stood up to Big Business either.

TMAC54 says

I consider low interest rates and money printing as stimulus or bailout assistance.

So, the answer is you pulled that number out of your ass then, huh?

Money printing is not a bailout. When the money is actually GIVEN out to an entity, then that is a bailout. And as the website YOU provided the link to shows, the money that was actually given out is nowhere near the ridiculous amount you keep stating.

The Fed lowers the Fed funds rate during every recession. This is nothing new. They buy treasuries during every recession. It's old hat. That is not a bailout. It is SOP for fighting a recession.

TPB says

Was Obama better than Bush?

Yes.

And now it's time for a...

Flame War!

tatupu70 says

The Fed lowers the Fed funds rate during every recession. This is nothing new. They buy treasuries during every recession.

But they never bought private debt before. Now they have -- mortgage backed bonds.

tatupu70 says

The Fed lowers the Fed funds rate during every recession. This is nothing new. They buy treasuries during every recession.

But they never bought private debt before. Now they have -- mortgage backed bonds.

Agreed--that qualifies as part of the bailout in my mind. There was actually money paid out.

TPB says

It's not about Better anymore in this petty tit for tat politics era.

Well, at least you are admitting that petty vengeance is more important to you than fixing our collective problems.

TPB says

Can Batman beat up Superman?

I don't quote me on this, but I believe that Batman owns a pair of kryptonite-brass-knuckles and once used them to beat-up Superman.

leoj707 says

Well, at least you are admitting that petty vengeance is more important to you than fixing our collective problems.

Oh and you want Me, to believe Obama can fix our problems? What he's just been waiting for the right fucking moment to do all of the shit he made folks like you believe he even can, let alone has gumption to do so, in the first place.
In your mind, Obama is this great Liberal leader, that has lead this country to greatness, and Glen Beck the most revered person in the Universe has polluted my perception of Obama, that if it weren't for him and Rush Limbaugh, then Obama would have an approval rating of 100%. Oh and I'm racist is the back up plan, just in case all other sensible logic fails.

Cloud, are you still bitching about Obama and Goldman Sachs?

Because the media is in the tank for Obama.

Yep. And the largest media networks are right-leaning. So what media are we talking about?

edvard2 says

Because the media is in the tank for Obama.

Yep. And the largest media networks are right-leaning. So what media are we talking about?

Air America, oh wait...

thomas.wong1986 says

unstoppable says

Anyone who wines about Obama, bailing out/bankrupting Chrysler and GM. Should back up and remind themselves about the crap show that Paulson and Bush did with AIG. Flat out thievery,

AIG is a fairly large insurance company.. which includes insurance on good chunk of the small and large transportation carriers that goes on every day.

If a company has no insurance coverage, because AIG went under, they could not do basic day to day business like making timely deliveries.

Basic food and durable goods supply chain would halt.

Other professions like doctors, lawyers, dentists, etc etc would not be able to perform their services to consumers because they had no insurance coverage... imagine what the results would be if AIG went under.

Did the light bulb go on yet ? Yes, too big to fail.

yes AIG is important to business I get it, It needed to be bailed out and bankrupted. That doesn't mean liquidated, the world economy would have kept on going if none of the executives got bonuses and Goldman et. all got 70 cents on the dollar for their paper. It's called Moral Hazard and crony capitalism. Did the Light Bulb go on?

Cloud, I agree it's a shit show at the top, but the fact that Republican appointed justices wrote the disaster, that is the citizens United Decision, I'm voting for the dems as the lesser of two evils.

Chart posted by TMAC54:

That is pretty much consistent with this Nov 2008 article: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/11/26/MNVN14C8QR.DTL

That confuses the heck out of me. Out of the $8.5T, $5.5T comes from the Federal Reserve. I don't see a $5.5T spike in the U.S. debt in 2008. Perhaps my Google-fu is weak.

tdeloco says

I don't see a $5.5T spike in the U.S. debt in 2008. Perhaps my Google-fu is weak.

I bet I know. I remember someone linking an article throwing out huge numbers like this in the past. They are summing all of the credit extended by the Fed, but not discounting the amount paid back.

That is, if the Fed overnight loaned BOA $1B, but BOA paid it back (with interest) then borrowed another $1B a few days later and paid that back, they are counting that "cost" as $2B. Even though the cost to the budget was zero since it was paid back. (Again with interest so net cost was actually negative)

The reason why you don't see the increase in the Fed Balance sheet is because the Fed's risk at any one time was minuscule campared to the 5.5 trillion number because they didn't and wouldn't lend all of that at the SAME TIME.

I don't know the point of reporting the number other than it is just pure sensationalism.

"CHANGE WE CAN BELIEVE IN - AGAIN?"

I didn't believe it the first time. I suspect that many in the OWS movement did and that is why they won't take part in the election farce any longer. They now finally realize that both "political parties" are owned by the same moneyed special interests who don't want "Change" from the status quo they've spent so very much time and money creating.

Obama Wins! ... Ad Age's Marketer of the Year
At ANA Gathering, Marketing Pros and Agency Bigs Tap Barack Over Apple, Zappos

http://adage.com/article/moy-2008/obama-wins-ad-age-s-marketer-year/131810/

Wake up, people. THIS is the game being played:

wbblair3 says

Obama Wins! ... Ad Age's Marketer of the Year

That makes sense, Obama's image is a powerful advertisement.
Sex sells, and Obama has been fucking us for 3 years now.

TPB says

That makes sense, Obama's image is a powerful advertisement.
Sex sells, and Obama has been fucking us for 3 years now.

more T.otal P.athetic B.ullshit.

david1 says

That is, if the Fed overnight loaned BOA $1B, but BOA paid it back (with interest) then borrowed another $1B a few days later and paid that back, they are counting that "cost" as $2B. Even though the cost to the budget was zero since it was paid back. (Again with interest so net cost was actually negative)

Thanks david1. If the money came from Federal Funds, then it is loaned out, not given out. It is supposed to be paid back, though debtors can declare bankruptcy. Money given and money loaned are two completely different situations.

The thing is the banks effectively paid us back with our own money.

They would take the government money and loan it back to the state government or to Wall St. at a higher rate. IIRC there was also some really shady stuff going on where $billion would get loaned out and repaid only to be re-loaned out again on a daily basis for something like a year on end. A half assed way to be sure to lend out hundreds of billions but apparently it worked.

Anyways crap like this is why Wall St if flush with cash and pumping up equities while the rest of the country goes to shit. They're playing with our money and keeping nearly all the profits. And when things go tits up again they're all expecting to get rebailed out since TBTF is now established government policy.

So sad that people have to invent reasons to dislike Obama, or even worse: play the politics as football game, when there are plenty of real reasons already.

It's utterly naive to think that this change only happened since Obama took office. Fact is that both Democrats and Republicans have similar big government policies. Both deficit spend, both look for government to solve problems, both support subsidies for their pet project, both voted for increased government loan guarantees in the mortgage markets that supported and created the RE bubble, both support the FDA and other big government ideologies.

America and its free market economy that once existed was destroyed over a century by both parties. Sure, they give you the illusion that they are against one another but when you take a thorough look at it you see how they both support one and the same.

tts says

And when things go tits up again they're all expecting to get rebailed out since TBTF is now established government policy.

True. We should be out on the streets protesting with OWS.

TPB, "Change" has turned into "Chains". But I'm happy to see how many kids are into Ron Paul. Its been said Ron Paul is not a candidate, he's a cause. Even if he isn't elected this time around, the cause is growing stronger.

Future generations should not be chained to the moutain of debt created by "President" 0bummer or any other socio-path in an elected position...and the young people know it.

Liberalism is a mental disorder.