patrick.net

Call it Crazy says

guruoracle says

We already have 20% equity after buying end of January in Danville..

The 20% is your original downpayment, it's YOUR money, not equity....

NOPE... FHA 3.5% down... Now I can refinance to a LOWER interest rate and remove PMI...

So you spent ~20% to have the value of the home increase by ~20%.

That's ingenious!

I'm going to borrow a million from the bank tomorrow and then I'M GOING TO BE A MILLIONAIRE!!!

Also, FYI, there is no such thing as "below market".

RentingForHalfTheCost says

$2500 gets you close to a 1mil house if you look hard enough and are lucky enough to have great credit and no pets/smokers.

Oh shut up... show me a link to a million dollar home that rents for $2500.

BoomAndBustCycle says

RentingForHalfTheCost says

$2500 gets you close to a 1mil house if you look hard enough and are lucky enough to have great credit and no pets/smokers.

Oh shut up... show me a link to a million dollar home that rents for $2500.

Doesnt exist. he needs to change his name to Rentingforthreequartersthecost.

toothfairy says

oh really? give an example of a 1m house that rents for $2500

Mine for the last 5 years of renting. Recent sells in my new area has me thinking that I am in a 1.2m now. And guess what? No property tax, no insurance, no PMI, no worry about the market continuing to go south. I just hang by the pool and smile. ;)

RentingForHalfTheCost says

toothfairy says

oh really? give an example of a 1m house that rents for $2500

Mine for the last 5 years of renting. Recent sells in my new area has me thinking that I am in a 1.2m now. And guess what? No property tax, no insurance, no PMI, no worry about the market continuing to go south. I just hang by the pool and smile. ;)

Lucky you! Most people aren't so lucky! Look on Craigslist to see reality... I am extremely happy we bought in February! When we refinance next month PMI will be GONE and our payment will be cheaper than rent for a larger/nicer house in a better neighborhood. I was a part of Ben's blog in LA and even hosted get togethers. Due to the knowledge I gained, I was able to get a great deal and live happily! I don't have to worry about an idiot landlord raising my rent or telling me what to do. NOW is a bad time to buy as I think there is a bump going on now. I don't care if prices go down since I have a 30 year fixed and it will always be lower than rent as I don't see rents going down anytime soon as I live in a high dollar East bay neighborhood.

toothfairy says

BoomAndBustCycle says

RentingForHalfTheCost says

$2500 gets you close to a 1mil house if you look hard enough and are lucky enough to have great credit and no pets/smokers.

Oh shut up... show me a link to a million dollar home that rents for $2500.

Doesnt exist. he needs to change his name to Rentingforthreequartersthecost.

I'll find you guys a house for a small fee if you want.

www.mapliv.com and you can do it yourself. Took me about 2 weeks of searching to change my renting status

Foster City 2900 for a 1.2m house
Pleasanton 3000 for a 1.2m house

Easy as pie. In total I visited about 10 houses in 2 weekends. There were a lot of 2500/mth for houses that could sell for 1mil+. Each area I checked the redfin sales data to see the prices. You can do the same if you are such inclined. I'd rather spend my time thinking about how to spend the other half of my ownership costs each month. Life is hard.

sheltielover1 says

Lucky you! Most people aren't so lucky! Look on Craigslist to see reality... I

That is the problem. People look on craiglists one day and make up there mind. If you are serious then you search multiple site daily until you find a place that fits. They are out there. Not everyone is trying to sneak every last dollar out of their rental. Some people actually love their house and are just looking for someone to do the same.

People will spend months to years looking for a house to buy, but look for days for a rental and then cry there are none cheap. Crazy behavior for such a large financial event. Invest your money to become rich, rent a pile of crappy wood to keep yourself safe from the outside elements. ;)

RentingForHalfTheCost says

sheltielover1 says

Lucky you! Most people aren't so lucky! Look on Craigslist to see reality... I

That is the problem. People look on craiglists one day and make up there mind. If you are serious then you search multiple site daily until you find a place that fits. They are out there. Not everyone is trying to sneak every last dollar out of their rental. Some people actually love their house and are just looking for someone to do the same.

People will spend months to years looking for a house to buy, but look for days for a rental and then cry there are none cheap. Crazy behavior for such a large financial event. Invest your money to become rich, rent a pile of crappy wood to keep yourself safe from the outside elements. ;)

Life's too short to live in a shithole! You can't take the money with you! Our payment is 25% of our monthly income. Quite reasonable. I don;'t want to be under someone's thumb..

sheltielover1 says

Life's too short to live in a shithole! You can't take the money with you! Our payment is 25% of our monthly income. Quite reasonable. I don;'t want to be under someone's thumb..

Huh? Being indebted to a bank in not under someone's thumb, it is under their whole body while they gyrate on you. I'd rather be paying 1/2 the cost of ownership to a person with a heart. Banks only care about your money, no heart. Good luck the next 30 years, hope you can always cover the payment. ;)

Btw, most owners in the bay area live in a shithole while they are indebted to the bank.

RentingForHalfTheCost says

sheltielover1 says

Life's too short to live in a shithole! You can't take the money with you! Our payment is 25% of our monthly income. Quite reasonable. I don;'t want to be under someone's thumb..

Huh? Being indebted to a bank in not under someone's thumb, it is under their whole body while they gyrate on you. I'd rather be paying 1/2 the cost of ownership to a person with a heart. Banks only care about your money, no heart. Good luck the next 30 years, hope you can always cover the payment. ;)

30 Years? I don't think so! Because we bought so cheaply - 10 years!

sheltielover1 says

RentingForHalfTheCost says

sheltielover1 says

Life's too short to live in a shithole! You can't take the money with you! Our payment is 25% of our monthly income. Quite reasonable. I don;'t want to be under someone's thumb..

Huh? Being indebted to a bank in not under someone's thumb, it is under their whole body while they gyrate on you. I'd rather be paying 1/2 the cost of ownership to a person with a heart. Banks only care about your money, no heart. Good luck the next 30 years, hope you can always cover the payment. ;)

30 Years? I don't think so! Because we bought so cheaply - 10 years!

If I wouldn't be able to make my mortgage I would not be able to make the rent payment either - hence why we bought! LIFE is DIFFERENT for everyone!

sheltielover1 says

If I wouldn't be able to make my mortgage I would not be able to make the rent payment either - hence why we bought! LIFE is DIFFERENT for everyone!

You don't live in the bay area then, cause rent is half of ownership costs around here. If you live outside then I am in agreement with you. Hardly anyone in the bay area can pay down a house in 10 years. They will be lucky to meet all the obligations while they tick away at the 30 years. I got many at my work that can't put any money in their 401k, or company share programs because it all goes into their overpriced house. Good thinking when they could have rented the same place for 1/2 the cost and actually be accumulating wealth each paycheck.

Danville

sheltielover1 says

Danville

Funny, I searched in Danville for a rental and that is where I found the most number of overpriced houses renting for next to nothing. I had a few landlords ask me why I wouldn't rent their house when I said 'No thanks'. People are in a world of hurt with housing around here, especially in Danville.

Good for you! I will live my life and you can live yours... I AM much happier now than in my "shared" rental for more money! My landlord got $400/mo. with the next idiot! RENTS are going UP not down! Many people on this board think certain people here are in "dreamland" when it comes to the cost of rents. And I am one who agrees!

RentingForHalfTheCost says

I'll find you guys a house for a small fee if you want.

www.mapliv.com and you can do it yourself. Took me about 2 weeks of searching to change my renting status

Foster City 2900 for a 1.2m house
Pleasanton 3000 for a 1.2m house

So I took a look..

I found only one house in Pleasanton and it was renting for $2500
http://www.mapliv.com/show_post.php?id=28032184
Zillow puts its value at $350k (sold in 2008 for 500k)
http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1496-Calle-Enrique-Pleasanton-CA-94566/25080975_zpid/

There were 3 in Foster City for $2900, but only one had an address included
http://www.mapliv.com/show_post.php?id=28359723
Zillow puts it at $635k (failed to sell for $740k in both '08 and '09)

http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/850-Cabot-Ln-Foster-City-CA-94404/15614991_zpid/

zesta says

So I took a look..

Look every day for 2 weeks if you are serious. Rental properties are not like buying a place. The good ones are gone immediately. What you see hanging around are the ones you just posted. Junk. There is a completely different approach you need to find a rental as opposed to buying. Most houses for sale sit for long enough that if you search weekly or bi-weekly you will see them all. The rental I currently got lasted up on craigslist for all of 1/2 day. Yup, that would be my doing. Cash and good credit talks. ;)

sheltielover1 says

Good for you! I will live my life and you can live yours... I AM much happier now than in my "shared" rental for more money! My landlord got $400/mo. with the next idiot! RENTS are going UP not down! Many people on this board think certain people here are in "dreamland" when it comes to the cost of rents. And I am one who agrees!

Rents on 1m+ homes have been in decline and continue to be falling. I don't know how long I can enjoy the benefits of pool/spa/built in everything on a >10K lot and >2k sqft for less than 1/2 the mortgage, but I'll take it as long as they are willing. If it stops then I always have the option of downsizing or even moving. Buying in the BA is definitely not for me anytime soon. Maybe in a few years when the sellers realize the good times are actually gone to stay. Maybe.

zesta says

So I took a look..

I spent 15 minutes just to get a feel for todays deals out there. Just focused on Foster City.

House on Vega sold for 1m+ just 6 weeks ago. 2000 sqft on a crappy 5200sqft lot.

http://www.redfin.com/CA/Foster-City/844-Vega-Cir-94404/home/1017319

In the same area here is a 1800 sqft house for rent for $3500 (which means you can get it for $3000).

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/pen/apa/3096625826.html

I actually think the rental house is nicer than the one that sold. Don't get me wrong, I think they are both junk and their true value is more in the 400-500K range IMHO.

Enough of me for now.

I just got done with a short-notice move and I have to say that it sucked. Having children tends to increase the amount of stuff you have, and the fortress I choose to live in is difficult to find rentals I can afford. It was stressful, involved staying up until 1:00 am every weekday night for a week to pack and move, and we still aren't all the way out of boxes yet. Truly a bad and stressful sequence for me and my family. Wouldn't have happened that way if we owned.

It's a tradeoff I will make, though, because of the other downsides of owning. I won't pretend like it wasn't a walk in the park -- it sucked.

RentingForHalfTheCost says

I actually think the rental house is nicer than the one that sold. Don't get me wrong, I think they are both junk and their true value is more in the 400-500K range IMHO.

if it rents for 3500 (or even 3000), it's worth a heck of a lot more than 400K.

zesta says

I'll find you guys a house for a small fee if you want.

www.mapliv.com and you can do it yourself. Took me about 2 weeks of searching to change my renting status

Foster City 2900 for a 1.2m house
Pleasanton 3000 for a 1.2m house

Patio Home and TownHouse?? GAG!! Both are dumps and higher than my mortgage payment! You couldn't pay me enough to live in either place... Give me a real house that's not a dive in a shitty area!

RentingForHalfTheCost says

In the same area here is a 1800 sqft house for rent for $3500 (which means you can get it for $3000).

Nice assumption, ass.

guruoracle says

zesta says

I'll find you guys a house for a small fee if you want.

www.mapliv.com and you can do it yourself. Took me about 2 weeks of searching to change my renting status

Foster City 2900 for a 1.2m house

Pleasanton 3000 for a 1.2m house

Patio Home and TownHouse?? GAG!! Both are dumps and higher than my mortgage payment! You couldn't pay me enough to live in either place... Give me a real house that's not a dive in a shitty area!

Huh? Waterfront house in prime area in Foster City, and a updated family home with pool, spa, BBQ, redwood trees, gazebo, etc. I wouldn't want you living with me, so it works both ways. ;) Both these places are more house than what people are paying over 1,000,000 of the banks money to buy. Silly stuff.

BoomAndBustCycle says

RentingForHalfTheCost says

In the same area here is a 1800 sqft house for rent for $3500 (which means you can get it for $3000).

Nice assumption, ass.

Name calling is for the fat.

This is what most rents are going for in our area:

http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/635-Glasgow-Cir-Danville-CA-94526/18433802_zpid/?utm_source=email&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=emo-savedsearch-4-address

NOT CHEAPER!!

guruoracle says

We did buy below market due to many years of research and watching the market plus some luck!

Are you the one who bought the house that needed a new foundation right next to the cemetery and freeway? Location is everything when trying to resell.

There are plenty of very good buys next to the freeway in Danville and Walnut Creek. There are also steals within 500 feet of high tension power lines in these fortresses as well. I've passed on several of these deals. Even drove out to that cemetery house, but realized how CLOSE it was to that sad place.

tatupu70 says

RentingForHalfTheCost says

I actually think the rental house is nicer than the one that sold. Don't get me wrong, I think they are both junk and their true value is more in the 400-500K range IMHO.

if it rents for 3500 (or even 3000), it's worth a heck of a lot more than 400K.

Only because we live in a country that subsidizes home ownership. You wouldn't get 400K of my money for a place I could rent for 3.5K while making 10K/mth. I'd rather keep growing my 400K cash pile than making it stagnate in a pile of aging lumber and nails. Houses are shelter, and most in the BA are not even good shelters. ;)

sheltielover1 says

This is what most rents are going for in our area:

http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/635-Glasgow-Cir-Danville-CA-94526/18433802_zpid/?utm_source=email&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=emo-savedsearch-4-address

NOT CHEAPER!!

Oh, I see your single data point. Enough said. You are correct. Rents are going threw the roof and buying now is the only option or we will all be doomed. Owners will get filthy rich! Renters will starve. I get it.

sheltielover1 says

This is what most rents are going for in our area:

http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/635-Glasgow-Cir-Danville-CA-94526/18433802_zpid/?utm_source=email&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=emo-savedsearch-4-address

NOT CHEAPER!!

Just walk down the road and rent this larger house for $800/mth less. Unless you like paying $4k/mth for some reason.

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/apa/3113077136.html

toothfairy says

BoomAndBustCycle says

RentingForHalfTheCost says

$2500 gets you close to a 1mil house if you look hard enough and are lucky enough to have great credit and no pets/smokers.

Oh shut up... show me a link to a million dollar home that rents for $2500.

Doesnt exist. he needs to change his name to Rentingforthreequartersthecost.

Here is a house that would sell close to 1mil now and you can rent it for $3k/mth. Makes absolutely no sense to buy from a financial point of view. You have to be betting on house appreciation in order to justify the 2x cost of ownership around here.

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/apa/3115586058.html

1960s fixer sells for less than 175,000 anywhere but CA.

My God if this thread does not serve as one of the most vibrant examples of the much hated numbnut-Californian with his Californian dream-math.

Luckily, there are still a few of good ones left. Like myself for example: I am a 12th generation Californian and a great man. It's like they say, Thank God for Jody.

RentingForHalfTheCost says

You wouldn't get 400K of my money for a place I could rent for 3.5K while making 10K/mth

I'm not sure I understand your logic here. It's clearly cheaper to own than rent with the above figures. You don't disagree, do you?

And your salary has no bearing to the rent vs. buy discussion. It determines your budget, but not whether you rent or buy...

KILLERJANE says

1960s fixer sells for less than 175,000 anywhere but CA.

Thinking saying and doing need to line up.

That's not really true at all. CA is very expensive, but in no way the only expensive areas of the US...

sheltielover1 says

Lucky you! Most people aren't so lucky! Look on Craigslist to see reality...

Craigslist is not reality. Craigslist rentals are overpriced. Everyone knows that. Some of those rentals have been on the market for years. I keep checking them. I rent a $900K house for $3000/mo. Another friend I know rents a $700K house for $1900/mo. Another - a $500K condo for $1600/mo. It gets even better in places like Palo Alto or Los Altos, where house prices are very high. As far as I can see, "RentingForHalfTheCost" should be everyone's user name, that is, if you are from the "Real Bay Area" ...

tatupu70 says

RentingForHalfTheCost says

You wouldn't get 400K of my money for a place I could rent for 3.5K while making 10K/mth

I'm not sure I understand your logic here. It's clearly cheaper to own than rent with the above figures. You don't disagree, do you?

And your salary has no bearing to the rent vs. buy discussion. It determines your budget, but not whether you rent or buy...

It all comes down to virtual verses real. A 1 million dollar house in the BA needs to justify the value. To me it doesn't. There is a 600K virtual component that can evaporate right before your eyes. If the fools never realize this, then I'll just sock way 1 million in cash and go elsewhere with my money. However, like the last 5 years, the next will be just as exciting.

I ask myself if I would rather have 400K of my savings into a 35 year old house on land that without irrigation would just be dead grass, verses 400K in dividends/gold/cash and the answer is the later. YMMV. I don't trust the virtual world at all, and California is mostly virtual.

dunnross says

sheltielover1 says

Lucky you! Most people aren't so lucky! Look on Craigslist to see reality...

It's not only Craigslist, but on realtor and other sites as well... At least I am not upset and angry all the time defending my position! Yes, I agree prices will probably go down this winter, but right now prices are up. After I refinance next month my payment will be lower than rent and I'll have $150k in equity. After refinancing and lowering my payment I don't really give a shit what happens to prices. A house is NOT an INVESTMENT! It is a place to live! We will pay our house off in 10 years (btw.. it's not the one by the cemetery) and be happy.. I love my house and all our friends do as well. I have gotten nothing but comments on the remodeling we have done (both from renters and owners). Everyone tells me I should not feel guilty for owning and we bought at the right time for US.

Craigslist is not reality. Craigslist rentals are overpriced. Everyone knows that. Some of those rentals have been on the market for years. I keep checking them. I rent a $900K house for $3000/mo. Another friend I know rents a $700K house for $1900/mo. Another - a $500K condo for $1600/mo. It gets even better in places like Palo Alto or Los Altos, where house prices are very high. As far as I can see, "RentingForHalfTheCost" should be everyone's user name, that is, if you are from the "Real Bay Area" ...

sheltielover1 says

sheltielover1 says

Lucky you! Most people aren't so lucky! Look on Craigslist to see reality...

It's not only Craigslist, but on realtor and other sites as well... At least I am not upset and angry all the time defending my position!

Is it just me, or do the people that come back sounding angry with their arguments, think everyone around them are angry?? Weird. When you read my posts, picture a guy smiling while he is typing. No anger here folks, nothing to see, keep it moving. I probably would be angry if I bought into the realtor bull around here back in 2005-2007 though. Again, I just smiled and ate the cookies at the open houses and took a huge dump in the guest bathrooms. ;)