patrick.net

Thomas added some links with some info. I have yet to be persuaded, but at least he made more effort than others on the Romney bandwagon.

thomaswong.1986 says

the debt you referring to are Capital Equipment investments for purchases of new and upgrades to steel milling equipment. This should have been obvious to you.

Was the 36 million dividend Bain took out of GST the year GST borrowed 125 million part of the purchases and upgrades? Why should Bain be pulling that kind of money out of the money borrowed for upgrades? What about the 44 million in pension underfunding? That also ended up at Bain.

To the OP:

The same way anyone makes vast fortunes: by being a criminal sociopath.

People who get money and power in this world are generally the ones willing to do *anything* to get it.

That's why good government is impossible.

thomaswong.1986 says

eck some include Japans export dumping policies, we pretty much closed many tech plants in Silicon Valley with many firms going bankrupt in late 80s -early 90s. Steel, Auto, and many other industries also received the same faith. Was that Mitt Romney's fault ? No!

Thomas,

For your info., it is not dumping, but jobs being shipped out to China is the problem. As a Chinese, you should know that.

http://www.obamasrealfather.com/

Its not about Romney being wealthy. Its about the complete failure of the communist in the white house.

blah blah blah

Honest Abe says

Its not about Romney being wealthy. Its about the complete failure of the communist in the white house.

No, it is rich taking over and ruling the country. And the rest of us is just fooled into thinking everything is fair. It has nothing to do with communism. It is the success of slavery system disguised in free enterprise. OK, maybe you are fooled into thinking we are not living in a slavery system. Then you can call it hoarding system.

The rich wants more. The investors invest into a company like Apple demanding it to make more money. At some point, with the demand for more profit, the companies like Apple need to shed workforce to make more profit. And perhaps ship some of the jobs to overseas LIKE CHINA. As if they are not already shipping enough jobs to CHINA. Get it, T. Wong?

Less tax=more profit for the rich.
More investment=More demand for more profit.
Demand for more profit=Ship the jobs overseas

Tell me if there is something wrong with those equations. So do you want a fair tax system or tax system that is lopsided to favor only the rich?

"Communist in the White House"

lol.

thomaswong.1986 says

– Venture capitalists invested $7.0 billion in 898 deals in the second quarter of 2012, according to the MoneyTree™ Report from

Don't confuse VC with PE, they are different animals.

And some people swear you can't get a girl pregnant from anal

How do you all feel about General Motors? They are the model Bain capital really copied. Most of GM's brand names were not created. They were gobbled up from failing companies. The workers and pensions busted. Shareholders at times lost everything.

Nobody says

homas,

For your info., it is not dumping, but jobs being shipped out to China is the problem. As a Chinese, you should know that.

Its Wongucci, not Chinese bubba! Im just a white boy! We in Santa Clara lost our MFG long ago by early 90s, and today its R&D. It certainly wasnt from competition with China, but with Japan. We shipped our jobs overseas (Singapore, Philippines, Korea, and China) due to unfair Japanese trade practice.

swebb says

Don't confuse VC with PE, they are different animals.

what they do are the same, they provide liquidity by private parties to risky ventures.

Nobody says

Less tax=more profit for the rich.
More investment=More demand for more profit.
Demand for more profit=Ship the jobs overseas

Apple's mfg is done overseas because they make nothing.. however they do use many motherboards, semiconductor, and storage devices which at one time was manufactured in the US. Since the Japanese dumped their products on the US markets back in the late 80s BELOW their own costs (labor and material) to capture US markets and bankrupt American companies. After suffer many quarter of losses and many layoffs for years..many American Semi, motherboard, and storage device makers moved their production overseas/outsourced it to Solectron/Flextroncs. That was the only course of action they had left. There was no other alternative solution. That is why Apple has mfg in China. thats were all the components are made.

We in Silicon valley were hit hard back in the early 90s. because of this. So we have are own scars from all the competition with the Japanese. Nothing new to us. Govt policies on the other hand went into opposite direction with higher taxes and more regulation making further existence of tech manufacturing difficult to say the least.

It has nothing to do with chasing profits ... to think so is to ignore history.

American in Japan says

So how did Romney make his huge fortune?

Romney is 65... many Americans, by that age, should already have a plan and sizable savings/investment accounts to which to fall back on as they get close to retirement.

Yes, your tax bill would also fall, since your cash out of investments would be taxed at lower rates from capital gain..

Nobody says

Tell me if there is something wrong with those equations. So do you want a fair tax system or tax system that is lopsided to favor only the rich?

OK! lets have it your way.. tax the Rich.. 50-90% as you like..

Now that the Govt has collected the money.. Now what.. you think your going to see
a single penny of it ? You think the Govt will somehow create a new job for you...or give out hand out.. Spread the wealth.. was this the Hope and Change the Obamatrons were voting for...

thomaswong.1986 says

Now what.. you think your going to see
a single penny of it ?

Wong,

Your ignorance continues to amaze me. Did you even forget the government continues to have deficit? I forgot, you are fresh off the boat.

thomaswong.1986 says

Since the Japanese dumped their products on the US markets back in the late 80s BELOW their own costs (labor and material) to capture US markets and bankrupt American companies.

Sure, Wong, Chinese would only think that price competition from China has nothing to do with the loss of jobs here in US. Oh, as far as I remember Chinese hates Japanese.

CaptainShuddup says

The Liberal press(Of all People) ridiculed conceptual Peace.

The media is owned by a few corporations. The idea that it's the "liberal media" is nothing more than right wing dogma.

A huge part of our media now, unforunately, is newscorp.

Reality. Republicans put up a bunch of clowns as prospective candidates
for the primary season. One by one Fox news and the Tea Party got excited about unelectable clowns. Finally, the only one who was nearly moderate enough to stand a chance of winning in a general election against Obama is nominated

CAptainshaddup's interpretation:

CaptainShuddup says

Dude, I didn't pick Romney, the Liberal media did. They systematically went through all the candidates one by one, building each up calling them the front runner, when there was no front runner, then destroyed them in the press, then on the next.

I guess he never learned that primaries are about appealing to your base.

Every person who has the slightest clue knows that these days most of the republican base is even more insane than the good Captain.

I guess to the truly whacko out there, Fox news runs the "liberal media."

Bellingham Bill says

when talking about jobs and Obama, the correct reference is how many did he save?

http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/graph/?g=95I

jobs were still in free-fall when Obama took over from the Bush crew.

He didn't save a single job other than his own. Only thing he did is came in and rode the bell curve while using all sorts of excuses to hand out billions to the banks and deadbeat squatters.

He prevented recovery to normalcy.

thomaswong.1986 says

OK! lets have it your way.. tax the Rich.. 50-90% as you like..

Your shortsightedness amazes me. OK, then let's do no tax for everyone. What would happen?

1. Every school will shut down leaving kids and out future without any domestic talents.
2. There will be no police to enforce the law.
3. The roads will be deteriorated.
4. FDA no longer overseas the food safety killing kids and elders who are vulnerable.
5. The research for disease will stop domestically.
6. The nuclear power plant will run without any regulation leading to major melt down and through. Well, nobody can sue the nuclear reactor manager, cause there the court is shut down.
7. The government no longer sponsors a new technology like how it did for semiconductor.

etc. etc.

The country goes into chaos and confusion. But, Thomas Wong, you don't care cause you are a Chinese. For your info., if it wasn't for the US government, we wouldn't enjoy affordable computers, GPS etc. You think the US government won't create jobs, you are DEAD WRONG, I mean DEAD Wong. But you don't care, do you?

Here is another one:

These Americans are training the Chinese workers who will replace them. (Businessinsider.com)

Illinois-workers-bain-outsourcing (guardian.co.uk)

Sensata, owned by Bain Capital, has been very profitable for Bain.

From the article:

"The Freeport workers have appealed to Bain and Romney to save their plant."

Quote:
"Mitt Romney never cared about American jobs or the middle class until he decided to run for the Presidency. Private equity such as Bain is only in business to serve themselves and their investors." --GM23

More of the same?

Nobody says

Your ignorance continues to amaze me. Did you even forget the government continues to have deficit? I forgot, you are fresh off the boat...But, Thomas Wong, you don't care cause you are a Chinese.

No I am a WHITE Native Californian, and yes, i aware of our deficit.. very aware of it. As for job losses, i have many countless times spoken AGAINST job moving to other states and overseas as we have seen hit Silicon Valley in early 90s. But it has always been those against dirty manufacturing creating dirty water dirty air and imposing EPA rules.

American in Japan says

Agree? Disagree?

Mr. Wroe pointed out that Sensata is a public company and shares are listed on the NYSE. The firm was owned by Bain Capital from the time of its spin-out from Texas Instruments in 2006 until its IPO in March of 2010. Bain Capital was not the owner of Sensata when the deal to purchase the local product line from Honeywell was consummated.

http://www.journalstandard.com/newsnow/x915676157/Chairmans-View-We-should-be-proud-to-live-in-Illinois.

Nobody says

You think the US government won't create jobs, you are DEAD WRONG, I mean DEAD Wong. But you don't care, do you

No! the govt doesnt create jobs and industries... as in the case of computers, which they already had - mainframes, they had no need for PCs. Much of that industry was created by individuals.

http://finance.yahoo.com/q/mh?s=ST+Major+Holders

Bain Capital Investors, LLC - 89,626,932 shares - 51.48%
(unless I am reading this wrong)

Government doesn't "create" jobs. It hampers job creation with laws, rules, regulations, statuates, procedures, codes and other oppressive, abusive and needless red tape created and administered by busy bodies and nincompoops.

Common sense, yes. Oppressive and abusive government micro-management, no.

Honest Abe says

Government doesn't "create" jobs. It hampers job creation with laws, rules, regulations, statuates, procedures, codes and other oppressive, abusive and needless red tape created and administered by busy bodies and nincompoops.

Common sense, yes. Oppressive and abusive government micro-management, no.

I've always been curious, where does oppressive and abusive government micro-management start for you? What level of laws, rules, etc. if any are necessary in your judgement or is total anarchy the ideal state? We let the financial industry free of many long standing (oppressive, abusive, red tape) rules and it resulted in one of the worst economic crashes in American history. Should we eliminate all of the rules on the financial industry and see how it works out?

I fully expect another blast of am radio platitudes, but one can always hope for a reasoned answer.

bob2356 says

I fully expect another blast of am radio platitudes

The ignore feature is great for tuning out the Rushbots.

thomaswong.1986 says

No I am a WHITE Native Californian

Wong,

You claim you are a CPA and an investor, now you are claiming to be a white man. Your bullshit never stops, does it? Your comments are proving that you are an idiot and Chinese. That's enough proof to me.

Oh, and are you even aware of the history? The government did start the jobs in Silicon Valley. And don't forget it was US government who put the GPS satellite. If you say GPS didn't create jobs, you just promoted yourself to idiot from imbecile.

Gubmint is always bad. We should go back to the Antebellum South where a few wealthy plantation owners controlled everything. ;-)

A little government help?
The Federal bailout that saved Mitt Romney (Rollingstone.com)

Looks like Romney needed the government far more than the ave. American.

Nobody says

Your comments are proving that you are an idiot and Chinese.

what does my log on name have to do with my identity ?
especially coming from someone else who calls himself "Nobody"...
At least you could have been more creative using "Noah Body"

No! The govt doesnt make anything, they are a customer for many products
that private industries design and create with specific govt "performance" requirements.

American in Japan says

The Federal bailout that saved Mitt Romney (Rollingstone.com)

Bain and Company or Bain Capital was bailed out? Or was it Bank of New England?

If it was BoNE isnt that what the FDIC is supposed to do anyway ?
Its whole purpose to ensure deposits...read some of the comments in the discussions portion of the page.

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/the-federal-bailout-that-saved-mitt-romney-20120829#disqus_thread

I quote:
"The first thing they did was cutting cost by laying off workers. Then the 2nd thing what they did was to start selling all machinery, and the last thing they did was selling the walls of plant. Once all these were all completed, then they took profit before filing bankruptcy. This is how Romney accumulated his wealth. He is not a job creator for 12 million Americans. Be aware..." --Globalwatcher

The question remains: job destroyer or job creator?

American in Japan says

The question remains: job destroyer or job creator?

It seems obvious the left wing media (rolling stones) rather only focus on one or two examples yet ignore many other success stories.

Based on their criteria one would have painted entrepreneurs in Silicon Valley as job destroyer as well since only a handful actually make it in the long run.

Laid off around here... who hasnt been laid off, down sized, bankrupted if they worked in Silicon Valley for say the past 20-30 years. Its as common as the changing seasons.

Overall RS takes a pretty immature view of American business. I wouldnt trust what they say.

This is an odd statement made .."then they took profit before filing bankruptcy"... Profits ? you need more color to understand this.. and frankly its up to the Trustee to approve payments made 1 year before the filings as it relates to "related parties".

American in Japan says

Tally of Job Creation By Bain Proves Vexing (Wall Street Journal)

from the article...

"But several other experts said Mr. Abowd's method contained its own flaws, including that it fails to account for the value of guidance offered by Mr. Romney and other Bain executives. A Romney campaign official echoed that criticism, saying the method was an "unorthodox" approach that implied every passive stockholder is a job creator, giving no additional credit to firms such as Bain that actively assist companies in which they invest."

as such there are more than a few example right here in the Bay Area where you have firms who "take no equity position" but collect a fee to turn a company (many start ups) and mature their processes to become viable public companies.

many start ups which are engineering centric and ignore proper selling / accounting staffing and logistics eventually "screw up royally" ... these turn around firms come in and clean things up taking some management responsibility and hire staff in order for client corporations to behave and conduct business in a mature fashion. Example .. create accurate financial statements which will pass an audit which will be used for new round of venture capital, bank lending, possible IPO, or sold to another company. The proper treatment of revenue recognition by various young companies is a big problem around here for younger industries like Electronic Gaming and Social Networking.

Once you clean things up.. you can get funding, growth and more hirings!

>Once you clean things up.. you can get funding, growth and more hirings!

Yes, you could get more, but I doubt you will.

Also Bain Capita; still has a majority share of Sensata :

http://finance.yahoo.com/q/mh?s=ST+Major+Holders

It seems obvious the left wing media (rolling stones) rather only focus on one or two examples yet ignore many other success stories.

The Rolling Stones article is on the left but look at the others The Wall St. Journal, Rightwingnews.com, etc.

This one at least says there isn't much way of knowing whether Bain resulted in a net gain of jobs.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-06-22/romney-sheds-crocodile-tears-for-exported-jobs-o-malley-says.html

Please provide more sources of these success stories.