patrick.net

So again what value did he create for the US in these big business transactions? I would like to see some good arguments.

American in Japan says

Looking forward to comments to this post, by those with more information...

How many jobs has Obama destroyed, since he's been in office?
Is that to much information?

This would be a great argument if Obama was this great bastion of job creation. This would be a great argument if Obama supporters based their support on Obama on results instead of Liberal endocrine.

when talking about jobs and Obama, the correct reference is how many did he save?

http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/graph/?g=95I

jobs were still in free-fall when Obama took over from the Bush crew.

same graph with deficit-spending overlaid:

http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/graph/?g=95K

The answer is simple: Jesus, Joseph Smith and some outer space dude who visited Jackson County, MO gave it to him. Jeesh. LDS forever!

You must believe or you will die. All hail Kolob:

Figure No. 1 from Joseph Smith Hypocephalus published as the Facsimile No. 2 in the Book of Abraham.

Getting back to the original question. I make a point of it because I keep reading time and time again about Romney being a major job creator (and entrepreneur)...

American in Japan says

I make a point of it because I keep reading time and time again about Romney being a major job creator (and entrepreneur)...

What you hear are people (his campaign), saying it, again and again.

Where they've failed is in providing an illustration of how that's done. In other words, if Romney did create a new research wing or services group, and expanded sales and hirings, x many times, then it would make for a good story. It would be type of feel-good story for the times.

If Romney can't come up with a true feel-good turnaround story then it's implict that he's just another Robber Baron, as his detractors seen to be depicting him.

If you remember 2008, even John McCain made fun of his *business* skills, as his CEO experience was in firing a bunch of people. Romney laughed that one off but instead, he should have learned from it and tried to find a way of deriving a positive, out of his private equity work.

Unfortunately, it isn't just people in his campaign. Millions of Americans are parroting this without thinking. Most (but not all) are in Red States....

American in Japan says

I am bringing this up, since I hear many Americans (not in Japan, though) saying how Romney is an entrepreneur who has created many jobs for Americans...

I have done just a bit of research, but I am not convinced that this is true.

what do you consider research.. it certainly wasnt good. A child half your ages better understand this.

If you are correct, what exactly do VC do ? dont they get millions from each investor and allocates it so various young firms ready to hire staff and purchase new capital equipment and lease new offices.

Why would Obama add John Doerr to his team if such people dont create new jobs.

http://www.forbes.com/lists/midas/2012/john-doerr.html

In February 2009, Doerr was appointed as a member of the President's Economic Recovery Advisory Board to provide the president and his administration with advice and counsel in fixing America's economic downturn. Forbes ranks Doerr as the 540th richest person in the world, with a net worth of US $2.2 billion.

Michael Moritz

http://www.forbes.com/profile/michael-moritz/

He was a prominent supporter of President Barack Obama's candidacy.

@thomaswong.1986

Uhh...I said "just a bit" up to that point and am still researching. I would appreciate link and sources from others as well either showing job creation or job destruction (possibly by ruined companies later declaring bankrupcy)....the synergy effect.

As little as I have up there (in the mere 20-30 min. I could spare) there is more to read than many of the political threads on Patrick.net.

Anyway, thanks for the links...

American in Japan says

I would appreciate link and sources from others as well either showing job creation or job destruction (possibly by ruined companies later declaring bankrupcy)

PWCmoneytree.com - for job creations. VentureLoop is proud to offer you 14,694 jobs across 1,381 venture-backed companies!
http://www.ventureloop.com/ventureloop/home.php

http://www.pwc.com/us/en/press-releases/2012/2012-q2-moneytree.jhtml

WASHINGTON, July 20, 2012 – Venture capitalists invested $7.0 billion in 898 deals in the second quarter of 2012, according to the MoneyTree™ Report from PricewaterhouseCoopers LLP (PwC) and the National Venture Capital Association (NVCA), based on data provided by Thomson Reuters. Quarterly venture capital (VC) investment activity climbed 17 percent in terms of dollars and 11 percent in the number of deals compared to the first quarter of 2012 when $6.0 billion was invested in 809 deals.

The number of Early stage deals reached the highest quarterly total since Q1 2001, with $2.1 billion going into 410 deals, an 18 percent increase in dollars and a 28 percent increase in deals from the prior quarter. The Internet-specific sector also saw increases during the second quarter, rising 22 percent in dollars and 31 percent in deals from the prior quarter to $1.8 billion going into 261 deals in Q2. The Life Sciences sector (Biotechnology and Medical Devices), however, experienced a decline in funding in the second quarter, dropping 9 percent in dollars and 6 percent in deals from the prior quarter to $1.4 billion going into 174 deals in Q2.

American in Japan says

job destruction (possibly by ruined companies later declaring bankrupcy)

there are many number of reasons why companies get ruined/bankrupted... heck some include Japans export dumping policies, we pretty much closed many tech plants in Silicon Valley with many firms going bankrupt in late 80s -early 90s. Steel, Auto, and many other industries also received the same faith. Was that Mitt Romney's fault ? No!

Apple nearly went bankrupt in mid 90s. Was that Mitt Romney's fault ? No!

Thanks for the links.

BTW, at least I agree Japan has had some policies of dumping of export goods.

FYI I have voted for a Republican candidate for US president twice in the past (not for G.W. though)

I think corporations have too much influence with both major parties.

JerryL2 says

I get that. But here's a challenge, find someone other than Romney, a transparent Gordon Gekko for our times.

Dude, I didn't pick Romney, the Liberal media did. They systematically went through all the candidates one by one, building each up calling them the front runner, when there was no front runner, then destroyed them in the press, then on the next. They did that to each and everyone, from Michelle Bachman to Herman Cain. All save for Ron Paul, they just riddiculed him and said, that he would be dangerous.

Dangerous because he was the son of a Bitch, well the first mother fucker to say in a long time. We need to stop getting in the worlds business and reduce our military. The Liberal press(Of all People) ridiculed conceptual Peace.

People that have never heard Ron Paul speak on single word were all running around saying...

"Ron Paul is a crazy person, he wants us to disarm and let other countries take us over. "

No Romney will do, it's about time you Liberals learn to stop meddling with democracy. Let the other candidates do their talking and let the Liberals put forth their own candidate than can win election based on their merits, instead of the Media creating these persona, out of people not deserving of these praises, while meddling with the candidates with passionate supporters. Like those supporters will ever convert to the Liberal agenda.

I aim to deliver you Romney and Ryan in November, it's best, it's for your own good, it's best for the Country.

Maybe just maybe, in 2016, you bastards will let the Democratic process be more organic.

In planet earth this is called politics.

Well on Planet earth they say "Be careful who you promote to oppose Obama, they just might elect him. No matter how awful the choice."

CaptainShuddup says

Dude, I didn't pick Romney, the Liberal media did. They systematically went through all the candidates one by one, building each up calling them the front runner

Hmm ... this sounds like a victim-o-logy conspiracy cul-de-sac .
So now, when anyone on this board disagrees with you, you call 'em a Liberal Communist/Media enthusiast and close the discussion with that. Ok Captain, this discussion is over, I don't play that game.

Romney was my local 1 term governor and at best, he was mediocre. The only reason why he'd won was because the Dems put forth Shannon O'Brien, a completely corrupt shill for the local legislature, and in Massachusetts, we don't trust having both the legislature and the governorship, controlled by the same cabal. Thus, as in the past, we voted for Weld & Cellucci, over a Dem, for that exact reason and to restore some semblance of fiscal conservativeness to the office. Both of Romney's predecessors were fine *REPUBLICAN* administrators but unfortunately, neither of them are running for President.

Thomas added some links with some info. I have yet to be persuaded, but at least he made more effort than others on the Romney bandwagon.

thomaswong.1986 says

the debt you referring to are Capital Equipment investments for purchases of new and upgrades to steel milling equipment. This should have been obvious to you.

Was the 36 million dividend Bain took out of GST the year GST borrowed 125 million part of the purchases and upgrades? Why should Bain be pulling that kind of money out of the money borrowed for upgrades? What about the 44 million in pension underfunding? That also ended up at Bain.

To the OP:

The same way anyone makes vast fortunes: by being a criminal sociopath.

People who get money and power in this world are generally the ones willing to do *anything* to get it.

That's why good government is impossible.

thomaswong.1986 says

eck some include Japans export dumping policies, we pretty much closed many tech plants in Silicon Valley with many firms going bankrupt in late 80s -early 90s. Steel, Auto, and many other industries also received the same faith. Was that Mitt Romney's fault ? No!

Thomas,

For your info., it is not dumping, but jobs being shipped out to China is the problem. As a Chinese, you should know that.

http://www.obamasrealfather.com/

Its not about Romney being wealthy. Its about the complete failure of the communist in the white house.

blah blah blah

Honest Abe says

Its not about Romney being wealthy. Its about the complete failure of the communist in the white house.

No, it is rich taking over and ruling the country. And the rest of us is just fooled into thinking everything is fair. It has nothing to do with communism. It is the success of slavery system disguised in free enterprise. OK, maybe you are fooled into thinking we are not living in a slavery system. Then you can call it hoarding system.

The rich wants more. The investors invest into a company like Apple demanding it to make more money. At some point, with the demand for more profit, the companies like Apple need to shed workforce to make more profit. And perhaps ship some of the jobs to overseas LIKE CHINA. As if they are not already shipping enough jobs to CHINA. Get it, T. Wong?

Less tax=more profit for the rich.
More investment=More demand for more profit.
Demand for more profit=Ship the jobs overseas

Tell me if there is something wrong with those equations. So do you want a fair tax system or tax system that is lopsided to favor only the rich?

"Communist in the White House"

lol.

thomaswong.1986 says

– Venture capitalists invested $7.0 billion in 898 deals in the second quarter of 2012, according to the MoneyTree™ Report from

Don't confuse VC with PE, they are different animals.

And some people swear you can't get a girl pregnant from anal

How do you all feel about General Motors? They are the model Bain capital really copied. Most of GM's brand names were not created. They were gobbled up from failing companies. The workers and pensions busted. Shareholders at times lost everything.

Nobody says

homas,

For your info., it is not dumping, but jobs being shipped out to China is the problem. As a Chinese, you should know that.

Its Wongucci, not Chinese bubba! Im just a white boy! We in Santa Clara lost our MFG long ago by early 90s, and today its R&D. It certainly wasnt from competition with China, but with Japan. We shipped our jobs overseas (Singapore, Philippines, Korea, and China) due to unfair Japanese trade practice.

swebb says

Don't confuse VC with PE, they are different animals.

what they do are the same, they provide liquidity by private parties to risky ventures.

Nobody says

Less tax=more profit for the rich.
More investment=More demand for more profit.
Demand for more profit=Ship the jobs overseas

Apple's mfg is done overseas because they make nothing.. however they do use many motherboards, semiconductor, and storage devices which at one time was manufactured in the US. Since the Japanese dumped their products on the US markets back in the late 80s BELOW their own costs (labor and material) to capture US markets and bankrupt American companies. After suffer many quarter of losses and many layoffs for years..many American Semi, motherboard, and storage device makers moved their production overseas/outsourced it to Solectron/Flextroncs. That was the only course of action they had left. There was no other alternative solution. That is why Apple has mfg in China. thats were all the components are made.

We in Silicon valley were hit hard back in the early 90s. because of this. So we have are own scars from all the competition with the Japanese. Nothing new to us. Govt policies on the other hand went into opposite direction with higher taxes and more regulation making further existence of tech manufacturing difficult to say the least.

It has nothing to do with chasing profits ... to think so is to ignore history.

American in Japan says

So how did Romney make his huge fortune?

Romney is 65... many Americans, by that age, should already have a plan and sizable savings/investment accounts to which to fall back on as they get close to retirement.

Yes, your tax bill would also fall, since your cash out of investments would be taxed at lower rates from capital gain..

Nobody says

Tell me if there is something wrong with those equations. So do you want a fair tax system or tax system that is lopsided to favor only the rich?

OK! lets have it your way.. tax the Rich.. 50-90% as you like..

Now that the Govt has collected the money.. Now what.. you think your going to see
a single penny of it ? You think the Govt will somehow create a new job for you...or give out hand out.. Spread the wealth.. was this the Hope and Change the Obamatrons were voting for...

thomaswong.1986 says

Now what.. you think your going to see
a single penny of it ?

Wong,

Your ignorance continues to amaze me. Did you even forget the government continues to have deficit? I forgot, you are fresh off the boat.

thomaswong.1986 says

Since the Japanese dumped their products on the US markets back in the late 80s BELOW their own costs (labor and material) to capture US markets and bankrupt American companies.

Sure, Wong, Chinese would only think that price competition from China has nothing to do with the loss of jobs here in US. Oh, as far as I remember Chinese hates Japanese.

CaptainShuddup says

The Liberal press(Of all People) ridiculed conceptual Peace.

The media is owned by a few corporations. The idea that it's the "liberal media" is nothing more than right wing dogma.

A huge part of our media now, unforunately, is newscorp.

Reality. Republicans put up a bunch of clowns as prospective candidates
for the primary season. One by one Fox news and the Tea Party got excited about unelectable clowns. Finally, the only one who was nearly moderate enough to stand a chance of winning in a general election against Obama is nominated

CAptainshaddup's interpretation:

CaptainShuddup says

Dude, I didn't pick Romney, the Liberal media did. They systematically went through all the candidates one by one, building each up calling them the front runner, when there was no front runner, then destroyed them in the press, then on the next.

I guess he never learned that primaries are about appealing to your base.

Every person who has the slightest clue knows that these days most of the republican base is even more insane than the good Captain.

I guess to the truly whacko out there, Fox news runs the "liberal media."

Bellingham Bill says

when talking about jobs and Obama, the correct reference is how many did he save?

http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/graph/?g=95I

jobs were still in free-fall when Obama took over from the Bush crew.

He didn't save a single job other than his own. Only thing he did is came in and rode the bell curve while using all sorts of excuses to hand out billions to the banks and deadbeat squatters.

He prevented recovery to normalcy.