patrick.net

leo707 says

Indicate that the book was written for men. Why not "Your Spouse's Parents" and "Your Spouse?"

Because it really is the wife who wants the house much more than the husband, in general. Sure, there is overlap in gender roles, but the roles remain quite clearly distinct. The overlap does not make the fundamental differences irrelevant.

I was guessing before when I said that the pressure to buy is 2/3 from women and 1/3 from men, but after finding that article showing that 21% of sales are to single women and only 10% to single men, I'm pretty certain that I guessed right.

We should not let political correctness blind us to the reality in front of our eyes. I once had a debate with a coworker who claimed that there was no difference at all in capabilities between women and men. Zero. She did not have a good answer to the fact that there is no overlap at all in the world's records in weightlifting in the same weight class, for example.

We are animals and necessarily have the gender differences of animals. Not that they have to dominate everything, but they cannot be wished away or simply ignored either.

Got the book, and I am reading it now. My favorite concept is still...you rent the money, or rent the space. And at this point in my life, renting the space is much better for me...and is just as equally, my "home"!

happycamper says

Got the book, and I am reading it now. My favorite concept is still...you rent the money, or rent the space. And at this point in my life, renting the space is much better for me...and is just as equally, my "home"!

Please send me feedback on how to improve the next edition!

One thing I need to do is add a disclaimer saying I know it's not always the wife who is the one who wants to buy...

Please send me feedback on how to improve the next edition!

Also, don't forget to write a review on Amazon.

happycamper says

My favorite concept is still...you rent the money, or rent the space.

Yes, and even if you own outright without any debt, you're still renting the space via the opportunity cost and risk of loss. You're giving up alternative uses of and income on the money, and taking on the risk of falling equity. That's a little subtle for most people to get though.

Yes, and even if you own outright without any debt, you're still renting the space via the opportunity cost and risk of loss. You're giving up alternative uses of and income on the money, and taking on the risk of falling equity. That's a little subtle for most people to get though.

Agreed. Even if you pay off the mortgage, there is still the matter of taxes, ins., repairs, etc. and hoa fees, it you are lucky enough. So, you are correct...even if you "own" , there are still costs involved, not to mention the alternative uses of $$ and risk of falling equity you mentioned. Really, there is no such thing as owning it free and clear when you look at it from a broader perspective.

There is a fallacy here. This 'owning outright' all depends on
1. What would it rent for
2. How much cash paid
3. Get a HELOC but avoid using it unless you are super smart about it

If you do 1 and 2 well then,

4. You have an investment that earns income and will also gain value over time

If you do 3 right, then
5. You have liquidity.

Investing in the stock market is very risky and there is no box left to move into if you don't get it right.
Maybe use the worthless certificates to build a nest?

KILLERJANE says

4. You have an investment that earns income and will also gain value over time

Not necessarily. House prices in Amsterdam are the same as they were 350 years ago, in terms of years of work to buy a house.

And prices in Japan have been falling for what, maybe 22 years now?

But yes, I agree you have to look at what it would rent for and how much you have to pay for it. If the rent is high and the price is low, sure, then it's a good deal and you should buy it. See http://patrick.net/calculator.php

KILLERJANE says

4. You have an investment that earns income and will also gain value over time

Not necessarily. House prices in Amsterdam are the same as they were 350 years ago, in terms of years of work to buy a house.

And prices in Japan have been falling for what, maybe 22 years now?

But yes, I agree you have to look at what it would rent for and how much you have to pay for it. If the rent is high and the price is low, sure, then it's a good deal and you should buy it. See http://patrick.net/calculator.php

Ironic, you read my mind just now reading another thread on both issues! Japan is the PERFECT example.

you're still renting the space via the opportunity cost and risk of loss. You're giving up alternative uses of and income on the money, and taking on the risk of falling equity.

PRECISELY.
You do realise you are now going way over the heads of many around here.

You just have to be smart and cover your bases and have a back door plan. That goes for many areas of life.

Vicente says

Any chance of this being an iBook?

If not I'll order the dead-tree version on Amazon.

Well darn, it's harder than I thought. iBooks demands a brand new ISBN for the digital version, which would cost me $125 (what a scam!)

And they're demanding I give them a credit card number to sell my own book, nothing to do with my getting a new ISBN. Weird and slightly disturbing.

And they won't accept my PDF file, but require that I figure out how to reformat it to the ePub format.

Finally, it looks like you can just read Kindle books on the iPad:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/feature.html?ie=UTF8&docId=1000490441

So maybe I should just recommend that if people want to read the electronic edition that they use the free Kindle reader for iPad?

Quigley says

When my wife makes the mistake of belittling me or talking down to me, even if she has a point about something, I get mad! If she nags at me like I'm a child that needs to be told again and again, I get mad, and nothing productive is accomplished.
On the other hand I think that women are set off more by the presence of or lack of shown love. If I refuse to help my wife with something, that to her, shows lack of love and she gets upset. If I don't compliment or dote on her and make her feel like I want to be with her, again lack of love = meltdown. If I, heaven forbid, make a disparaging comment about her person, that is just asking for an estrogen bomb! Forgetting birthdays, anniversaries, v-day etc are all manifestations of a lack of love.

sounds like you married the wrong girl!

Amazon e-mailed me today that my copy shipped. They collected sales tax, even though I placed the order last week, so I guess we're doing our part to finance the drug war, the medical-industrial complex, and Marcus. Anyway I look forward to the book :)

I'm still waiting for my own copies! I have not seen a physical copy of the final book yet.

But several people wrote me that they got their copies, so it's coming.

But several people wrote me that they got their copies, so it's coming.

Yeah, I got an email from Amazon today with tracking number. Also, with tax...

The damn sales tax thing is one reason I'm not selling it myself. The state wanted my address, bank account number, SSN, driver's license number, and much more besides, and that's just for a "seller's license", to be allowed to collect the sales tax.

Sheesh. Sales tax is the first tax that should be eliminated in favor of a land value tax. It would be the same amount of revenue, but the paperwork and harm to commerce would be far less.

land value tax is interesting.

I prefer my idea of 'why dont they just print all the money they need and eliminate ALL TAXES'.

half the federal budget is printed up money now via fed reserve buying bonds the chinese wont buy. fast forward 10 years they will be printing up 80% of the fed budget. The feds can simply cut checks to the states OR BETTER YET the fed reserve can buy up any and all gov bonds with printed money!

The damn sales tax thing is one reason I'm not selling it myself.

Reorganize PatNet as a church, you may become exempt. I'll join, especially if it scores me an exemption from ObamneyCare (currently only the Jehovah's Witnesses, Christian "Scientists," and certain Baptist sects are on the list of IRS-approved religions). One caveat though, tax exemption isn't automatic; Romney's cult has it, but Tom Cruise's cult continues to struggle. Wishing you a Happy Festivus, solstice, comet, or whatever :)

PockyClipsNow says

half the federal budget is printed up money now via fed reserve buying bonds the chinese wont buy. fast forward 10 years they will be printing up 80% of the fed budget.

If the Fed and Treasury continue on that path, the American Dollar will go the way of the Zimbabwe Dollar. Every government that discovers it can print "free" money fools itself as if it were the first to try that, and the story always ends badly. A fiat currency is like fire: an extremely useful invention when used properly, or a disaster if it falls into the wrong hands.

PockyClipsNow says

I prefer my idea

Funny -- I preface nearly every other sentence with those very words...

Quigley says

When my wife makes the mistake of belittling me or talking down to me, even if she has a point about something, I get mad! If she nags at me like I'm a child that needs to be told again and again, I get mad, and nothing productive is accomplished.
On the other hand I think that women are set off more by the presence of or lack of shown love. If I refuse to help my wife with something, that to her, shows lack of love and she gets upset. If I don't compliment or dote on her and make her feel like I want to be with her, again lack of love = meltdown. If I, heaven forbid, make a disparaging comment about her person, that is just asking for an estrogen bomb! Forgetting birthdays, anniversaries, v-day etc are all manifestations of a lack of love.
Guys might feel love for their sweetheart all the time, but she needs us to show it for it to be any good for her.

http://www.youtube.com/embed/hPIxrzmatq0

RealisticOptimist1 says

I wish this could go mainstream, but unlikely. Just this weekend I was out with friends and talk about the house next door (I rent) being up for sale for 350k with 10k in taxes was viewed as a "good price." I was trying to make a joke about it being a "bargain," but to my disappointment, they took it seriously. Keep in mind this house sold for 195k in 2001, and taxes have more than doubled since then.

This could go mainstream!

Just loan your copy to them for a while.

They'd never read it, which is why I don't even bother engaging in discussion. :/

Elliemae told me that she paid the $25 to createspace.com to have "expanded distribution" through stores and other online sellers, but all they did was undercut her price, bringing her profit to $0, so she doesn't recommend that that.

Anyone can be an online seller - so if you pay for the "expanded distribution," that means not only can bookstores order it but also the Amazon online booksellers can too - only they receive all the profit.

So, when you pull up a book on Amazon and there are a bunch of options (a few of which undercut Amazon by less than a buck and one that sells it for $60 (!), most of the time these sellers are ordering from Amazon the same way as if you ordered directly from Amazon - only they're reping the profits. Does that make sense?

I put my book up for $16.95 plus s&h; and believe me - it's a bargain considering people pay thousands out of pocket when they qualify for Medicaid, or they hire a case manager to assist with placement when they still have to make the decisions anyway - but some asshole listed it immediately for $16.19.

I learned alot about the publishing angle. Let's get real - if my book sells enough that a publisher is interested in it, I can deal with it at that time.

RealisticOptimist1 says

hey'd never read it, which is why I don't even bother engaging in discussion. :/

10K in TAXES!!!...you must be TEXAS!

elliemae says

I put my book up for $16.95 plus s&h; and believe me - it's a bargain considering people pay thousands out of pocket when they qualify for Medicaid, or they hire a case manager to assist with placement when they still have to make the decisions anyway

I agree your book is really valuable to the right crowd (people in need of good nursing home advice), but that crowd is rather sparsely dispersed through the general population. So general advertising is probably not going to be very effective, and maybe even word of mouth will be difficult because the people who need it probably don't even know each other.

Somehow you have to advertise right to the audience that is in need of nursing home info. Maybe people here have ideas on how to do that?

I'm still waiting for my own copies! I have not seen a physical copy of the final book yet.

But several people wrote me that they got their copies, so it's coming.

I got the book on 17th and finished reading the book on 17th night itself. One thing I did not like is about the spouse pressure, it is little exaggerated. My wife got mad by reading that page (btw she always tells her friends to read patrick.net before going with a realestate agent to see homes).

Overall its a great book, but a small one.

crazydesi says

the spouse pressure, it is little exaggerated

Is it better to just delete or neuter that part of the sake of political correctness and inter-gender harmony, or to keep it for the discussion and controversy value?

I believe there is truth in it, but I can also see how it can be perceived as offensive.

crazydesi says

Overall its a great book, but a small one.

Thanks. Part of the idea is not to waste any words.

crazydesi says

the spouse pressure, it is little exaggerated

Agreed. On the other hand, we live in a society where house, translated, "home" is an emotionally charged concept that has been around for a long time. That is a tough one to get past. Especially, when so much of our society promotes the concept as part of "the American dream". Personally, this bubble has created a new way of thinking for me in regards to that American dream, that perhaps I may not have been open to before.

Sheesh. Sales tax is the first tax that should be eliminated in favor of a land value tax. It would be the same amount of revenue, but the paperwork and harm to commerce would be far less.

But it also means less government control of individuals. We can't have that.

Patrick,

Placed Amazon order on the 14th for your book, eagerly awaiting arrival. BTW: . Had another line item to qualify for free economy shipping with HT order, place PayPal, etc.

I was notified SIX DAYS LATER on the 20th that the 'order shipped' with est delivery date of Sept 25.

Good God. Beware of 'Free Shipping' delays. . .

Congrats on the Book. If I ever receive it I look fwd to commenting !

ps: even though CA mail-order sales tax took effect on the 16th, Amazon, the company with a heart still charged sales tax on the order placed on the 14th. . .

Hmmm, another article seeming to show that women want that house about twice as much as men do:

http://money.cnn.com/2012/02/14/real_estate/dating_homeownership/index.htm

This also supports my point in the book that women prefer men who own houses in general -- but the study failed to examine women's preferences between men who own houses vs. men who have large amounts of cash and no debt, but are renting.

This also supports my point in the book that women prefer men who own houses in general -- but the study failed to examine women's preferences between men who own houses vs. men who have large amounts of cash and no debt, but are renting.

What about men who own small, crappy houses? ;-)

That's my "game plan" to avoid long-term serfdom.

You can call it sexist, but I think it's likely that once a woman moves into that small crappy house, it will probably get spruced up and no longer be crappy.

And if you own it outright, I'd expect that's a big plus too.

You can call it sexist, but I think it's likely that once a woman moves into that small crappy house, it will probably get spruced up and no longer be crappy.
And if you own it outright, I'd expect that's a big plus too.

Hmmm...good point. Of course if it's TOO small and TOO crappy, she might want to move to a much bigger/nicer house. Then I get stuck with 6% realtor fees and other transaction costs, PLUS I end up with a bigger/nicer place than I can really afford. Sort of the worst of both worlds.

I don't think it's sexist. For whatever reason women tend to be more status-conscious with houses, and men tend to be more status-conscious with things like sports cars. ;-)

crazydesi says

the spouse pressure, it is little exaggerated

Is it better to just delete or neuter that part of the sake of political correctness and inter-gender harmony, or to keep it for the discussion and controversy value?

I believe there is truth in it, but I can also see how it can be perceived as offensive.

I have not read it yet, so I can't really speak to whether or not it is too sexist.

I don't think that you should delete or neuter the section just for political correctness and inter-gender harmony.

However, even if the wife pressure page is correct 75% of the time for women and only 25% of the time for men, then you are making people feel unjustly pigeon holed a good deal of the time.

I don't think that it would "neuter" the chapter if it was make less of an absolute judgement on the psyches of women. But then again having not read it yet, I have no idea what the fuck I am talking about.

;)

Just downloaded the Kindle version of The Housing Trap. Thanks Patrick.

Thanks! I can see the extra Kindle sale here:

https://kdp.amazon.com/self-publishing/reports

There were three earlier today, and now there are 4:

Paper books are now at 111 sold!

Paper books are now at 111 sold!

So are you going to buy a house with your new found wealth?

Not unless it's a really good deal!

Not unless it's a really good deal!

Here is a good one for you. Half an acre of land, walking distance to the Elementary School, just down the road from the club house and golf course.

http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/7203-Saddle-Side-Boerne-TX-78015/26166175_zpid/

It's been on the market for a while as the property backs to a busy road. I've seen worse here in the Bay Area. Owner would be willing to make a deal I'd bet.