patrick.net

http://www.youtube.com/embed/Tak9ODlBJgM

Priceless comment: "Can't believe that after the housing crash , this guy still has to dispute with these blind assholes." ;)

Everyone on this thread, me excepted, throws like a girl, is a retarded poopy-head, and is a snot-brain!

egads101 says

Peter schiff called for housing prices to crash further in 2009, 2010... and ditto the stock market.

he advised buying gold at that time.

that he has the gall to predict ANYTHING today is ridiculous, and anybody quoting him is completely fucking retarded!

http://patrick.net/?p=1117700 "OC housing market will get much worse... 2011... good fucking call!!!

http://patrick.net/?p=1187129 peter shiff:"buy gold now" 2011!

Those are just a couple of the ones you permabear twits posted on here.

LEARN HOW TO THINK!!! LEARN HOW TO DO A BIT OF RESEARCH!!!! DON'T BE STUPID FOREVER, IT IS CURABLE!!!!

You can never time the market, however; you can't dispute market fundamentals.

Peter Schiff is right on what he is saying due to economic fundamentals. You simply just can't print/borrow you way to prosperity. He doesn't know when things will go south but you can't discredit his message because he's not right on timing.

egads101 says

"we are in the early stages of a bear market... the bulk of the downside will be in the next couple of years..."

Downside as in by 2008 this will all go to shit and without massive taxpayer bailout not recover again? Seems about right.

egads101 says

Buy gold... May 2010...it is going to $10,000!!!!

That gold chart is looking much better than the Dow or REITs for that matter, and that without any bailouts to prop it up. Keep working those oracle skillz - it's a long way to the top, if you want to rock'n'roll ;)

egads101 says

"There will be a big economic crash in the very near future... buy gold!"

That is actually always prudent advice, although you can also buy other tangible, durable and portable materials that sustain their value equally well. Proven for centuries/millenia through all classes of society, this has never been a bad strategy as opposed to relying entirely on fiat or other government controlled (easy to seize), managed and/or propped up assets.

Roberto

Aside from the predictions, do you thnk 20 trillion in current debt amnd north of 100 trillion on unfunded debt is a minor problem?

sbh says

Let the market tell you what is cheap and discount any so called pundit who's investment strategy theme overrides market action. Schiff is one of these.

The topics he gets interviewed about and his views on those do not make the investment strategy of his funds though. He does not only have precious metals, his funds hold a lot of foreign but also domestic stocks, far from a one trick pony. Of course I believe I can do better though ;)

Your thinking is that although we have spent enough it wasn't on the right thongs?

Schiff would say the only true north on value is what somone willingly pays for something.

When you consider that there are, I'm guessing, 70 billion transactions a day. How could any agency possibly control something of this size?

indigenous says

Your thinking is that although we have spent enough it wasn't on the right thongs?

Schiff would say the only true north on value is what somone willingly pays for something.

When you consider that there are, I'm guessing, 70 billion transactions a day. How could any agency possibly control something of this size?

To be fair I think his answer was reasonably balanced and contained items that even opponents of too much government involvement could get on board with, For example it's better to get the government involved in the form of regulating and taxing (and in case of sex-workers protecting) marijuana and prostitution rather than staying involved in the form of criminalizing it.

Mel'l

Sorry I was adressing Roberto

I'm reading Schiff's book now.

I find it useful to argue these issues.

Ah Peter Schiff. The far-right's tribal leader.

The end is near! The end is near! Buy Gold! Buy Silver! Buy guns!

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Zero_Hedge

indigenous says

Sorry I was adressing Roberto

So was I - I think he can give reasonable responses, with reason inversely proportional to the number of insults ;)

freak80 says

Ah Peter Schiff. The far-right's tribal leader.

The end is near! The end is near! Buy Gold! Buy Silver! Buy guns!

He is far from far right, fairly liberal on social issues. Maybe you can say the far-libertarian's tribal leader ;)

mell says

Maybe you can say the far-libertarian's tribal leader ;)

Fair enough. :-)

Peter Schiff can't be wrong. He's our tribal leader. Whatever he says is The Truth (tm).

freak80 says

Peter Schiff can't be wrong. He's our tribal leader. Whatever he says is The Truth (tm).

Of course he can be wrong and he is, but he is right far more often than our resident patnet armchair "economists" and their brazen empires ;)

egads101 says

so popularity = correctness. got it.

That's how all religions work. Including Austrian economics.

mell says

trying to bend basic math and promising great economic prosperity.

What do you mean?

mell says

Inflation is rampant and a huge problem

What? Where are you living right now? Zimbabwe?

freak80 says

mell says

trying to bend basic math and promising great economic prosperity.

What do you mean?

Talking about the realities of our runaway debt, purchasing power etc. instead of saying "it doesn't matter" and hoping that some economic breakthrough will usher in a new area of prosperity. I'm not interested in the US becoming Japan and believe it may be far worse than that since - at least for a while - Japan had a decent trade surplus and was always a strong exporter.

mell says

Talking about the realities of our runaway debt, purchasing power etc.

During a massive depression, it's probably a good thing to have deficit spending until the economy recovers. Once the economy recovers, the higher tax revenues can pay down the debt.

Or at least that's how it's supposed to work in theory.

Is our purchasing power decreasing? If wages aren't keeping up with inflation, it's probably the result of increased worker productivity going almost exclusively to the top 0.1%.

Also, during the last 30-35 years, labor has lost almost all of it's bargaining power with capital.

I'm not sure how economic libertarianism will make things better.

freak80 says

mell says

Inflation is rampant and a huge problem

What? Where are you living right now? Zimbabwe?

San Francisco, CA. Almost as bad!

freak80 says

During a massive depression, it's probably a good thing to have deficit spending until the economy recovers. Once the economy recovers, the higher tax revenues can pay down the debt.

I'd add IF you have the money saved from the good times, otherwise it is always a bad idea IMO.

mell says

San Francisco, CA. Almost as bad!

I was not aware of rampant inflation in San Francisco. It hasn't made the news. I guess the lack of reporting is part of the conspiracy.

I shop mostly at Trader Joe's.

And I'm house-sitting in Santa Cruz again, which is a great way to compare bills since I buy the same stuff each time.

The big inflationary thing has been bacon, I think that went from 1lb to 12oz for the same price.

Otherwise, not seeing much inflation at TJs this past year. Well under 5%.

freak80 says

mell says

San Francisco, CA. Almost as bad!

I was not aware of rampant inflation in San Francisco. It hasn't made the news. I guess the lack of reporting is part of the conspiracy.

There is some reporting though - haven't you heard that house prices have gone up manically and only will continue to go up forever in the bay area? I'd call that reported inflation ;)

Don't forget the effects of last summer's Midwestern megadrought.

Unfortunately, precipitation extremes will get worse as the planet continues to warm.

The labor force participation rate is at 32 year low

The reason unemployment rate is lower is because fewer people are in the labor force

Even bernanke admits that the current unemployment rate overstates the health of the labor market - just another reason the fed didnt taper
All the main reasons are discussed here http://smaulgld.com/whats-next-for-the-fed-no-exit/

Bellingham Bill says

I shop mostly at Trader Joe's.

And I'm house-sitting in Santa Cruz again, which is a great way to compare bills since I buy the same stuff each time.

The big inflationary thing has been bacon, I think that went from 1lb to 12oz for the same price.

Otherwise, not seeing much inflation at TJs this past year. Well under 5%.

Anything 2% and above qualifies as significant for me and way too much (I'd shoot for 0.5%, maybe 1% max. if you have to have some). If you take a starting salary for a 20 year old and then compound those 2% and see how much they'd have to make by 40 or 50, you will see that most people lag here and wages have a hard time keeping up even with what is considered by the masters of fiat a "low" or "subdued" number. Gotta flip some stocks/shacks to stay in the game ;)

StillLooking says

So Now you are claiming strong employment and no inflation

partisans wishing to slag on things look at the participation rate and don't understand it's counting people age 65+.

http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/graph/?g=mNe

is a better indicator of employment.

Not so great, but there has been recovery, and definitely the trend of 2008-2009 has been reversed.

We're still 5M under the 2008 peak, which of course sucks, but unemployment has gotten better, not worse.

Largely thanks to the Fed, since Congress has done jack shit since 2010.

mell says

nd then compound those 2% and see how much they'd have to make by 40 or 50

My food costs $200/M. 30 years of 2% inflation would put that to $360.

Landlord is going to take a lot more than $160/mo over 30 years. Shit, that's been some annual rent increases already.

The dollar is stronger n in 2009 when he made this prediction.

Relative to what?
The dollar index?
Who does that matter to?

Dollar strength/weakness, to me, means

Strong dollar = things I buy take less dollars
Weak dollar = things I buy take more dollars

Name five things you bought in 2009 that you can buy here in 2013, with less dollars

mell says

Anything 2% and above qualifies as significant for me and way too much

That's the fed's target inflation rate.

I guess that's part of the conspiracy.

errc says

Name five things you bought in 2009 that you can buy here in 2013, with less
dollars

When in 2009? Right at the worst of the great recession? Interesting you picked that year.

LED TV
Smartphone
Bluray player
Housing
US Treasuries

Why not 2007?
Mortgage backed securities

Why not 2011?
Gold

CiC,

Would *any* amount of evidence convince you to change your views?

The whole "fed will cause (or is causing) massive inflation" meme is BS. The data proves it.

Sure, maybe the Fed should do things differently or reduce QE. But they are NOT causing severe inflation right now. It's just not happening.

CiC,

Why do you believe there is severe inflation going on? How does that belief benefit you in any way?

I can understand why people desperately cling to religious beliefs...it's a way of coping with the fear of death or loss of a loved one.

But economics isn't religion. Then again, maybe it is for some people.