patrick.net
An Antidote to Corporate Media
1,261,196 comments by 15,059 users - Ceffer, Maga_Chaos_Monkey, Patrick online now
invite response« First « Previous Comments 183 - 222 of 289 Next » Last » Search these comments
Sounds prudent for a country in close proximity.
It is prudent for any country in the world. The logic is ridiculous.
Rew
2014 Oct 2, 1:48pm
Sounds prudent for a country in close proximity.
It is prudent for any country in the world. The logic is ridiculous.
Negative. It's about risk and not putting up a false guise of being protected.
There are few direct flights to West Africa. Anyone going or coming is already being screened and getting health advisory before they go. Ebola can lay dormant for many many days.
You advocate something that simply doesn't really matter much in terms of prevention and control at this stage. You would have to shut down travel all together to stop the spread.
Edit : People already dying of MERS here. Shall we shut down air travel to the whole mid-east? Guess how many flus are brought to the US every day from other parts of the world?
"In the past decade, the United States had 5 imported cases of Viral Hemorrhagic Fever (VHF) diseases similar to Ebola (1 Marburg, 4 Lassa). None resulted in any transmission in the United States."
That's the CDC saying that. Guess what? Lassa is more stable outside the body than Ebola!
Rew
2014 Oct 2, 2:06pm
"Nigeria appears to have contained Ebola,
Yeah, one small piece of the puzzle... when someone walks into the ER with symptoms in Nigeria, they KEEP him there...
They don't let him leave and walk among the general public for days with the virus...
Gosh. I wonder what the US will do now that we know it is Ebola and people who may have had contact show symptoms? Meh ... probably just let them go about their day.
The solution being projected by the panic mongers here seems to be "stop air travel cold and isolate anyone with flue like symptoms across the whole country".
F* that!
Oh my gosh, know what, I bet there will be another instance of Ebola in the US! I bet some people may even die! *gasp*
You going to be too afraid to live in the meantime while you are waiting for whatever to happen? Not me. I'll surf (sharks), dance in the rain (lightning), breathe (lung cancer), walk in the sun (skin cancer), eat cheeseburgers (heart disease +100 other things), and drive (crash bang boom).
If it makes you feel better CiC, just don't touch anyone, ok?
Tenpoundbass
2014 Oct 2, 2:25pm
Great now they are saying Ebola medicine is in short supply.
I sure hope the Liberals are right Like they always are. *sarcasm off
Rew
2014 Oct 2, 2:28pm
The "FEAR" with Ebola will cause your representatives in Washington to pass some emergency, area wide, quarantine Bill in the name of "protecting us"...
THAT is what you should fear, not the virus...
That will do more damage then the virus.
Then flipping act like it, Mr. "OMG! They hosed off the sidewalk we are all gonna die."
This reminds me of you back pedaling when confronted with housing data. 'Sorry I'm on the east coast and really don't care about CA.' -- paraphrased ... but you get the idea.
Lame!
Rew
2014 Oct 2, 2:30pm
Great now they are saying Ebola medicine is in short supply.
I sure hope the Liberals are right Like they always are. *sarcasm off
Since most Drs and their schools are from urban, Democratic, bastions of prosperity ... why haven't you already figured out our master plan? Drop Ebola "deep into the heart of Texas". (We have plenty of cure here in California (wink))
Rew
2014 Oct 2, 2:46pm
Then flipping act like it, Mr. "OMG! They hosed off the sidewalk we are all gonna die."
Try to act like an adult and go back up and read what I wrote again and see if you can find that type of response...
Challenge accepted. Let's recap ...
Only in America, send a clean-up crew in to mop up high contagious Ebola vomit, give them a power washer so they can blow it all over the place. Oh, and don't give them any personal protection equipment....
But, some people here feel that the authorities have everything under control and there is no chance of it spreading...
Sure.....
*
Like this?
And further up your rant how I was spreading miss-information, which happens to be true, about how Ebola is not a very hardy virus outside the body. And then further when you challenged the temperature and environment as essentially being good for the spread of ebola ... which I countered again with more factual things about the virus not being water born and being denatured in water relatively quickly.
Forgive me if I got the impression you were panic mongering.
Is this some misguided stab at the Obama administration/America? If it is ... piss poor job. I'll bet huge chunks of the people dealing with this are going to be Obama hating republicans too.
Edit: you just sound scared.
Tenpoundbass
2014 Oct 3, 12:38am
Fucking Africa is taking this thing more seriously than our Assholes are.
This is someone handing the folks in the quarantine home, supplies.
Note the Hazmat suit, to the untrained eye, that's looks like a Pimping hat, But it's really a high tech ebola protection forcefield. Someone should do that apartment building a favor and mail someone a bag of confectioners sugar.
Then that way, they will get a team of 200 high tech decontamination squad, to descend on that place with camera teams in tow.
Only in America, send a clean-up crew in to mop up high contagious Ebola vomit, give them a power washer so they can blow it all over the place. Oh, and don't give them any personal protection equipment....
How do guys flying around in a helicopter know that is what is happening? People power wash sidewalks all the time. Did they land and interview? Do they know this is the exact spot the guy vomited?? How would they know that?
The photo stamp says yesterday. The guy allegedly vomited 6 days ago. People walked around vomit on the side walk for 5 days in an apartment complex? Really, you're buying that? Ebola can't survive 5 days laying on the sidewalk in the dallas sun or 1 day for that matter. How do the helo guys know that the vomit wasn't doused in bleach 5 days ago? How do the helo guys know there was vomit there when they started power washing
This whole thing sounds like bullshit to me.
Rew
2014 Oct 3, 3:05am
WARNING : The photos are more viral than ebola, and CiC and Capn are now infected.
If you believe a hosed down sidewalk is a dry surface, you may be infected. If you believe random sensational photos of unknown origin, four days after an event, may be related to the original event, you may be infected. If you believe handing someone a bag containing supplies, with no personal contact, is a high risk activity for catching ebola, you may be infected.
Warning: bullshit sensationalism can live in the mind, unchecked, in people with compromised critical thinking. Refrain from reading the internet if you are a dumb-ass. If you suspect you are a dumb-ass, please do not post or participate in any content generation on the internet. You can infect others with your asshattery.
(If that is over line, or considered a personal attack, sorry. I just cannot tolerate persons who claim they are being objective and the true keeper of truth and facts, yet can regurgitate this bs so willingly and so fast. Total crap.)
Rew
2014 Oct 3, 3:34am
I think you are too far gone for this to be effective CiC.
http://www.phac-aspc.gc.ca/lab-bio/res/psds-ftss/ebola-eng.php
You don't understand the other posters here..
Come on mr pouty pants. Turn that frown upside down.
HydroCabron
2014 Oct 3, 3:38am
At least this issue has a foreign name. That means conservatives will take it seriously.
How about a foreign name for coal power plants, which kill over 10,000 people a year? Preferably something Arabic sounding. We could bring conservatives and liberals together to solve that problem!
Vicente
2014 Oct 3, 3:54am
At least this issue has a foreign name. That means conservatives will take it seriously.
If I ever get to name a really deadly virus my candidates are:
Jesus Loves You
Fluffy Bunny
Glaxo SmithKline
Goldman Sachs
Fun for the whole family!
Dan8267
2014 Oct 3, 5:44am
More Republican lies. I'm heavily against Obamacare, but I would never lie like Crazy does. With Obamacare, there are many winners and loser. Some people benefit like those who have per-existing conditions, and some people get ripped off like the young and healthy. To say that no citizen is benefiting from Obamacare is just an outright lie.
People who make such outrageous lies do so because they are such pathological liars that they can no longer distinguish between plausible lies and lies that are batshit crazy.
Peter P
2014 Oct 3, 5:58am
Some people benefit like those who have per-existing conditions, and some people get ripped off like the young and healthy.
Everybody has some pre-existing conditions. The very notion of health insurance is ridiculous. Healthcare *cannot* be handle by the market and a reasonable society will have some form of single-payer system.
Rew
2014 Oct 3, 6:15am
To say that no citizen is benefiting from Obamacare is just an outright lie.
There is an underlying agenda and axe to grind which obscures and blinds to reality and truth. Yep yep.
HydroCabron
2014 Oct 3, 6:33am
In the face of the ebola threat, we have only one option: strip millions of their health insurance.
Rew
2014 Oct 3, 6:46am
Alas. It is as I feared. CiC is ultimately too far compromised.
(You are ignoring the additional pieces there describing how they managed to get Ebola to survive for a day (that's one) ... in the dark ... and what the effects of water are, how the virus survivability outside the body is more/less survivable than Lassa, AIDS, etc. You can lead a horse to water but ...)
Peter P
2014 Oct 3, 6:47am
There are plenty of winners and losers..
Precisely, this is why everybody must participate in the system. There is no way around this. It is not an insurance-type market in the faintest sense.
Besides, having healthcare tied to employment is a terrible idea. People will be discouraged from starting their own businesses.
Tenpoundbass
2014 Oct 3, 7:00am
At least this issue has a foreign name. That means conservatives will take it seriously.
Mark my word if this thing takes off here, it will be referred to as Obala.
HydroCabron
2014 Oct 3, 7:01am
Obama should be doing more here. He should look to Reagan's massive, lightning-fast response to AIDS.
Or he could appoint a responsible conservative to handle this: someone highly constitutional, who doesn't believe in evolution, would be a perfect choice to contain a viral outbreak.
Obama should be doing more here. He should look to Reagan's massive, lightning-fast response to AIDS.
Or he could appoint a responsible conservative to handle this: someone highly constitutional, who doesn't believe in evolution, would be a perfect choice to contain a viral outbreak.
What is is with your fixation on "conservative" politicians? Sure they fucked up many things, yes, yes, yes. Now let's move on and acknowledge that this situation was severely mishandled. How the nurses did not get trained when it was clear that this was a much bigger outbreak, the missing hazmat suits, sending the patient back despite travel history and symptoms? Even your progressive leader can and does fuck things up - and this was a quite severe screw-up! When the next conservative bozo is in office again, then you can complain about their screw-ups..
Rew
2014 Oct 3, 9:40am
(You are ignoring the additional pieces there describing how they managed to get Ebola to survive for a day (that's one) ... in the dark ... and what the effects of water are, how the virus survivability outside the body is more/less survivable than Lassa, AIDS, etc. You can lead a horse to water but ...)
So, now you want to nick-pick one small item, that it can't survive in water. Well, that's a good thing since the whole population lives in a swimming pool.
We'll just ignore that it can live several hours on door knobs, surfaces, pens, cabinets, arm rests, stethoscopes and other daily touched items. Also, that it can live days in body fluids. That's not important, nobody comes in contact with those areas...
We will ignore those things when we are talking about: the general overall fit of the virus to live outside the body (which is low compared to tons of other infectious diseases) and especially ignore it in direct relation to the power washing photo you posted. Yep.
You are taking the stance that the virus is hardy and that we are unprepared. (Which sounds like fear and 'OMG! We are all gonna die' ... even if to quote you, you are just "providing updates from mainstream news media on the situation in Dallas or posting facts from government agencies". It's why you post the Huffington article now, right?)
With regard to the power washing photo : that's good old main stream media, and you are just being an echo chamber for them? Where was it taken? What outfit is doing the cleaning? Was there or was there not vomit present? Whose vomit was it? What day was it? Please show me the reported context for the photo.
You are an alarmist and you are spreading alarmist falsehoods. Plain and simple.
Rew
2014 Oct 3, 9:53am
Obama should be doing more here. He should look to Reagan's massive, lightning-fast response to AIDS.
Or he could appoint a responsible conservative to handle this: someone highly constitutional, who doesn't believe in evolution, would be a perfect choice to contain a viral outbreak.
What is is with your fixation on "conservative" politicians? Sure they fucked up many things, yes, yes, yes. Now let's move on and acknowledge that this situation was severely mishandled. How the nurses did not get trained when it was clear that this was a much bigger outbreak, the missing hazmat suits, sending the patient back despite travel history and symptoms? Even your progressive leader can and does fuck things up - and this was a quite severe screw-up! When the next conservative bozo is in office again, then you can complain about their screw-ups..
Mell, the secret is everyone is always unprepared for the first case, it's what you do after that matters. Read "The Hot Zone".
HydroCabron
2014 Oct 3, 10:04am
Even your progressive leader can and does fuck things up - and this was a quite severe screw-up!
Obama should be in jail, but for other things, like the bank bailout and the powers of the NSA.
You sure seem to favor presidential involvement in the administration of every hospital, down to the last podunk emergency room in buttfuck, Oklahoma. Two observations: that sounds like big government to me; and that sounds like it wouldn't work, anyway.
The only problem I have with conservative criticism of Obama on this issue is that it comes from people who believe, or routinely vote for people who claim to believe, that the world began 10,000 years ago, that science and mathematics are useless unless they "prove" the Fed is bad or that minorities are inferior, and that tax cuts do everything short of curing cancer.
To put it bluntly, the people doing much of the criticizing should shut up and have a seat over there. We gave them a chance to run things between 2001 and 2009, and implemented many of their pet policies between 1981 and the present, and it has not gone well for us.
And, by their complete hysteria on this issue, which reminds me of the collective conservative urine release over Saddam's WMD's in 2003, they remind me why they're useless for anything but comedy.
I doubt ebola is much of a threat. It's not ebola that's the problem: it's conservatives and liberals who live on fear, thrive on fear, and can't weigh risk appropriately. For some reason, possibly mistrust of the Kenyan usurper in the White House, many conservatives are choosing the path of idiotic panic here.
Even if this kills 500 people in the United States, it's a miniscule threat to public health compared to other problems which conservatives refuse to examine. The same conservatives who tell us that the government can't do anything right expect us to save them from non-existent threats. The same conservatives who tell us that Benghazi is among the greatest scandals in American history. The same conservatives who want poor people to rely on the emergency room instead of health insurance or Medicaid - a policy which increases the risk of disease for all of us.
Did the hospital fuck up? Yes. Would a fuck-up have been less likely if Obama had personally visited admitting nurses last month and warned them to be wary? Yes. Are there other threats to the United States which are more worthy of Obama's time and energy? Yes - hundreds of them.
I expect competence from my doctor, my auto mechanic, and my HVAC repair professional: slip-ups from any of them can get me and others killed. I do not, however, hold Obama (or Reagan, Bush, Clinton, Bush II) responsible for training them. This is because, unlike conservative authoritarians, I do not believe in big daddy strong father central government.
Flu will kill around 54,000 people in the United States this year. If ebola gets out of hand, it will likely kill fewer than 1,000.
Sorry, but since WMD's, I really don't trust the judgments of bible-thumper neocon-libertoonian shitheads on any issue of public importance.
If Bush were in office, you'd be using phrases like "blame game" right now to defend him.
Rew
2014 Oct 3, 10:24am
Did the hospital fuck up? Yes. Would a fuck-up have been less likely if Obama had personally visited admitting nurses last month and warned them to be wary? Yes. Are there other threats to the United States which are more worthy of Obama's time and energy? Yes - hundreds of them.
Maybe we should divert some of that spending from defense and get more serious about health care ... ooops! Too late!
Flu will kill around 54,000 people in the United States this year. If ebola gets out of hand, it will likely kill fewer than 1,000.
Sorry, but since WMD's, I really don't trust the judgments of bible-thumper neocon-libertoonian shitheads on any issue of public importance.
If Bush were in office, you'd be using phrases like "blame game" right now to defend him.
Preach on. Can I get an amen!
The only problem I have with conservative criticism of Obama on this issue is that it comes from people who believe, or routinely vote for people who claim to believe, that the world began 10,000 years ago, that science and mathematics are useless unless they "prove" the Fed is bad or that minorities are inferior, and that tax cuts do everything short of curing cancer.
The above paragraph makes you a 100% dishonest partisan hack, and dilutes any any other valid points you might have had. I wish I had used worse words to describe it. It is clear you are not interested in a constructive discussion.
You sure seem to favor presidential involvement in the administration of every hospital, down to the last podunk emergency room in buttfuck, Oklahoma. Two observations: that sounds like big government to me; and that sounds like it wouldn't work, anyway.
Don't see anyone has ever recommended it.
Maybe we should divert some of that spending from defense and get more serious about health care ... ooops! Too late!
How do you think it should be done?
indigenous
2014 Oct 3, 10:53am
Regarding the longevity of viruses, if they are not alive in the first place how can they be dead? i.e. not be a future threat?
Obama should be in jail, but for other things, like the bank bailout and the powers of the NSA.
Agreed.
You sure seem to favor presidential involvement in the administration of every hospital, down to the last podunk emergency room in buttfuck, Oklahoma. Two observations: that sounds like big government to me; and that sounds like it wouldn't work, anyway.
True, but I advocate limited powers for the government in important areas, such as war (on countries not invisible enemies), police, pandemics, response to fire and other disasters, pollution etc. A lot of Libertarians do, they are no anarchists.
The only problem I have with conservative criticism of Obama on this issue is that it comes from people who believe, or routinely vote for people who claim to believe, that the world began 10,000 years ago, that science and mathematics are useless unless they "prove" the Fed is bad or that minorities are inferior, and that tax cuts do everything short of curing cancer.
Fair point. I would have favored a levy on the 0 - 1% as a temporary measure.
To put it bluntly, the people doing much of the criticizing should shut up and have a seat over there. We gave them a chance to run things between 2001 and 2009, and implemented many of their pet policies between 1981 and the present, and it has not gone well for us.
Agreed, Bush administration was mostly a disaster.
I doubt ebola is much of a threat. It's not ebola that's the problem: it's conservatives and liberals who live on fear, thrive on fear, and can't weigh risk appropriately. For some reason, possibly mistrust of the Kenyan usurper in the White House, many conservatives are choosing the path of idiotic panic here.
Even if this kills 500 people in the United States, it's a miniscule threat to public health compared to other problems which conservatives refuse to examine.
The problem is you have no margin of error that's acceptable if you're wrong with such as disease, esp. if it mutates into an airborne version, and it has been mutating like crazy. This is not a left vs right thing IMO.
Flu will kill around 54,000 people in the United States this year. If ebola gets out of hand, it will likely kill fewer than 1,000.
Likely so, but you cannot compare the consequences of spreading flu to spreading ebola, unless you talk about a variant like a the pandemic flu we haven't seen in a long while.
If Bush were in office, you'd be using phrases like "blame game" right now to defend him.
Doubtful, I still think Bush was worse than Obama, but Obama has been closing in to a point where the differences become less significant. The biggest difference for me is the number of deaths during the Iraq war. but it is very hard to estimate a number for the current administration since they meddle and support everywhere. The Ukraine situation is becoming comparable to the Iraq fiasco, not in numbers yet, but we aren't done yet. Then there is Syria etc. Not looking good.
Rew
2014 Oct 3, 10:59am
Maybe we should divert some of that spending from defense and get more serious about health care ... ooops! Too late!
How do you think it should be done?
Looks pretty impossible with current congressional make up and when we have a population which posts things like: "Death to Obamacare, Ebola isn't covered!" on the internet.
It's kind of stunning that people can, in the same breath, criticize the national response and then attack potential roads to reform and progress.
Rew
2014 Oct 3, 11:02am
Regarding the longevity of viruses, if they are not alive in the first place how can they be dead? i.e. not be a future threat?
Denatured, rendered inert, destroyed : if you want to quibble about the accuracy of "live virus" since viruses are often put in the "it's not really alive" grey zone. If that's not your angle, please clarify your question/re-phrase.
Rew
2014 Oct 3, 11:05am
if it mutates into an airborne version, and it has been mutating like crazy.
Support for that claim? I cannot remember where but I thought this one was 90+% same as the plane-jane 60s Ebola we all know and love.
Looks pretty impossible with current congressional make up and when we have a population which posts things like: "Death to Obamacare, Ebola isn't covered!" on the internet.
Do you think Obamcare was the right approach to handle the healthcare in the country? Ignore Ebola while answering this one.
It's kind of stunning that people can, in the same breath, criticize the national response and then attack potential roads to reform and progress.
I think you are confusing between a sustainable way of improving healthcare system in the country versus a rapid response required in time of an emergency.
As far as I can tell, you like a national healthcare system or a version of obamacare, but do not like national response to a pandemic like Ebola.
if it mutates into an airborne version, and it has been mutating like crazy.
Support for that claim? I cannot remember where but I thought this one was 90+% same as the plane-jane 60s Ebola we all know and love.
Note that it hasn't officially become airborne, but the more it exchanges (different kind of) hosts, the more it usually mutates.
indigenous
2014 Oct 3, 11:47am
Denatured, rendered inert, destroyed : if you want to quibble about the accuracy of "live virus" since viruses are often put in the "it's not really alive" grey zone. If that's not your angle, please clarify your question/re-phrase.
I know nothing about this. If it is not alive, how is it rendered harmless?
Rew
2014 Oct 3, 12:16pm
Denatured, rendered inert, destroyed : if you want to quibble about the accuracy of "live virus" since viruses are often put in the "it's not really alive" grey zone. If that's not your angle, please clarify your question/re-phrase.
I know nothing about this. If it is not alive, how is it rendered harmless?
The physical properties of the virus, the material it is made of, are dissolved, dispersed, broken up, so it is no longer in "Ebola" form. It cannot attach to, be consumed by, and replicated by the cells in your body. It ceases to be a virus. It is just biologic trash, dust, dirt, matter ...
indigenous
2014 Oct 3, 12:18pm
The physical properties of the virus, the material it is made of, are dissolved, dispersed, broken up, so it is no longer in "Ebola" form.
Is this done by the antibodies in the survivors blood?
Rew
2014 Oct 3, 12:25pm
if it mutates into an airborne version, and it has been mutating like crazy.
Support for that claim? I cannot remember where but I thought this one was 90+% same as the plane-jane 60s Ebola we all know and love.
Note that it hasn't officially become airborne, but the more it exchanges (different kind of) hosts, the more it usually mutates.
Cool article. Thanks.
Ebola could also mutate and become non-lethal. ;)
Rew
2014 Oct 3, 12:30pm
Do you think Obamcare was the right approach to handle the healthcare in the country? Ignore Ebola while answering this one.
I think you are confusing between a sustainable way of improving healthcare system in the country versus a rapid response required in time of an emergency.
As far as I can tell, you like a national healthcare system or a version of obamacare, but do not like national response to a pandemic like Ebola.
Right or wrong is the wrong way to think about Obamacare. It was something, anything, in the step toward healthcare reform. No, I am not a fan, but the opposition failed to present any alternatives and shape what we have today to be anything better. So, it is here, let's continue to work on it.
With Obamacare I was just happy we had healthcare on the table and were doing anything in that space. You are correct, a national rapid response to pandemic and nationalize healthcare aren't strongly linked ... but we are talking about the right species at-least ... and honestly ... before we talk about pandemic response ... there are far greater issues of urgency for the nation. Even with 1 case of Ebola in Dallas, and likely more coming.
« First « Previous Comments 183 - 222 of 289 Next » Last » Search these comments
While you dorks worry about Federal Reserve or the price of milk....
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/06/20/ebola-west-africa_n_5515140.html