patrick.net

I rent a house and make a lot of money in the stock market since stocks have zero carrying costs and outperform housing.

The fact that you don't understand this demonstrates how stupid you are.

Dan8267 says

I rent a house and make a lot of money in the stock market since stocks have zero carrying costs and outperform housing.

The fact that you don't understand this demonstrates how stupid you are.

Florida has limited land, lots of coastline, rising population, Beautiful weather, and attracts tourists like crazy.
Properties close to the water will be worth it's weight in gold.
You will be sorry.

Ironman says

However, your job at Walmart must not really pay all that well....

You call a soon to be $15.00 per hour as not paying well?

Strategist says

Florida has limited land, lots of coastline, rising population, Beautiful weather, and attracts tourists like crazy.

Properties close to the water will be worth it's weight in gold.

Assuming it's not underwater. In any case, predicting what future markets will be hot is a fool's errand. We've reached peak baby. The population of the U.S. would be declining if not for immigration. The great migration from north to south due to air conditioning is over. The population of the U.S. isn't going to double in this century like it did in the last. People are retiring to other states and other countries. And past performance is not a predictor of future performance, especially since the market prices in expectations.

So I wouldn't bet the farm on Florida beachfront property. I'm all for buying when it makes financial sense. If there is a good deal, I will, but I'm not losing out by holding other equities that have far less carrying costs and a higher real rate of return.

Ironman says

The fact that you DON'T own a house and rent and drive a 10 year old car shows us that you lie, and don't make the money you claim you do.

Honey, I have nothing to prove to you. And Bill Gates drives a Ford Focus. Rich people buy appreciating assets and don't overpay. Poor people like you buy crap to keep up with the Jones. The fact that you don't understand this means you must be poor.

Oh, and if I did work for Walmart, it would be developing e-commerce and I'd still be making six figures. If you weren't such a coward, we could have met and compared tax returns. How much does being a NJ turnpike glory hole attendant pay?

Purely anecdotal but I have an uncle who came to Ocean County in 1990 with 300K and turned it into over 40 million and he doesn't own a single stock, but he has many businesses and real estate holdings. He lives in Somerset County now.

My parents had jobs before they came to New Jersey and they do have 401K but it makes up only about 4% of their net worth and their house makes up less than 10% of their net worth. Business and real estate have been good to them as well.

Another uncle of mine came to Ocean County in the late 90's and turned 500K into a net worth over 20 million through his investment in businesses and real estate. He earns money like the average MLB player and doesn't own a single stock.

None of them use HELOC to buy garbage to stuff in their garage either, but use it to pay of short term obligations in business. But HELOC money used WISELY can also be used to buy more properties. The rate of return may be lower than the stock market but I doubt that people who work for someone else (rank and file IT worker) and sock money into 401K can beat conservative real estate investments that are cash flow positive (not relying on appreciation) over the long haul (30 years).

Although, I do have a cousin in Boston who ha worked at GE for the last 34 years as a Mech Engineer who has over 2 million in his 401K. Wife an internist. But even they own their own home (3300 sq ft in the North Shore) and paid it off in 15 years and live frugally and comfortably pay cash for their kids educations at Northwestern and Tufts due to their frugal lifestyle. Even then, their net worth is significantly less compared to the real estate investors I mentioned above.

This guy Lawrence Roberts rents a home in Irvine but owns homes throughout Orange County and Las Vegas. But the key here is that he owns real estate, sells real estate and runs a blog.
http://ochousingnews.com/

I have yet to hear any stories about anyone who rents a home, doesn't own any real estate or profitable business and simply pumping a percentage (even 20%) of a low six figure job into the stock market (401K) as outperforming a successful real estate investor. The best case scenario is the one I mentioned about the mechanical engineer. Maybe 3-5 million tops, but not close to any of the real estate investors in terms of net worth.

If we could convince gays to porkapussy or two we could seal the borders and maintain the status quo...immigration problem solved!

Dan8267 says

The population of the U.S. would be declining if not for immigration.

Ironman says

Had you bought a house in the last 4 or 5 years, you'd have a nice appreciated asset, not to mention, instead of throwing away rent every month that you get ZERO return on the investment, you would have built up a nice chunk of equity. Plus, you'd be able to take the tax advantages of ownership, which would lower your tax bill to Uncle Sam...

Someone should start a website where he predicts that there will be a housing crash and then continues to maintain that it's still a poor time to buy an expensive home. Oh - and he should allow people to write comments - even misogynistic assholes and conspiracy theorists - about whatever the fuck they want.

The (above) example of having bought a house in the past 4 or 5 years is sweet - but I still know people who are struggling to make ends meet post recession. Sure, some of them they drank the Kool-Aid and over extended, but many of them simply lost their jobs. Many still wouldn't qualify for a loan, probably couldn't afford to take the bus to Florida much less invest in real estate. They might be able to afford the portion of the rent to the wealthy investors (above) that their Section 8 doesn't cover...

Ironman says

Like I said, you ain't the sharpest knife in the drawer even if you think so....

There is only one knife that deserves the title of "sharpest knife" in each drawer; and it's simply the sharpest as compared to the others. If Florida property values keep escalating, they're heading for an "adjustment" which can wipe out "wealth." I'm not sure if you were alive during the housing crash, but here is an article about the after effects in 2011. http://www.businessinsider.com/amazing-statistics-about-the-housing-crash-2011-3#

Ironman says

No I wasn't... I'm posting this from my pre-school classroom!

Sorry, child. I posted it from my iPhone 3.

So, let me get this right - the thread Dan posted about the strong possibility of another crash (or... "adjustment" to those people in the financial industries) was really about Dan's job and investment choices? And his choice of cars - to which I strongly object because my 15 year-old car is older and now I must buy a 10 year-old car to keep up with the Dans (cuz apparenty it's all about the Dan's) - and about liberals and Obama and bacon and the Tea Party and Donaldfuckingtrump... but certainly not about the possibility of another Florida housing crisis?

again...
elliemae says

Someone should start a website where he predicts that there will be a housing crash and then continues to maintain that it's still a poor time to buy an expensive home. Oh - and he should allow people to write comments - even misogynistic assholes and conspiracy theorists - about whatever the fuck they want.

If only there was a dude in the Bay area who would create such a site... I would peruse it for years.

Bueller.

Bueller.

Bueller.

Ironman says

But, that's not Dan, he's RICH!!!

Dan8267 says

and I'd still be making six figures.

Yes, to someone who only made minimum wage his entire life, six figures would seem rich.

Bring it on, there's no way in hell my house is worth the $275K that Zillow now says it is again.
I can give two shits about the the equity increasing on my house, due to imaginary numbers, if that means my kids will always have to live with me or always be renters or room mates in situations that they have no control over. My wish that my kids will grow up and get to participate in greatest show on earth that was the American Dream. Not the American scheme that the current Liberals and Republicans have brought us.

I would gladly cheer on my house value falling to half of what I owe. And do you want to know something. I'll still would gladly make my mortgage payments and not feel like I was robbed. I did not buy my house as an investment, and in fact when I did buy, I did so because I was tired of playing the game of waiting for hope and change.

Hope and Change comes from with in. Something your average Millennial voter realizes now.

Mr Happygoluckofus says

I can give two shits about the the equity increasing on my house, due to imaginary numbers, if that means my kids will always have to live with me or always be renters or room mates in situations that they have no control over. My wish that my kids will grow up and get to participate in greatest show on earth that was the American Dream. Not the American scheme that the current Liberals and Republicans have brought us.

You're attempting to inject reason into an asinine thread that, so far as I can tell, is about penis size.

elliemae says

I would'a been banned long ago.

I don't think so.

Related to this thread, Proof home ownership costs more than renting.

The rule of thumb I suggest is that a house should cost 100 times its rental value. It's the One Percent Rule in reverse. For example, a house that rents for $2000/month should cost $200,000.

Ironman says

Because Dan's realizing now that he missed the boat on buying, so he needs someone to comfort him... It's a good thing you came along to hold his...

elliemae says

...penis

Poor Dan. Just picturing an old fat chick giving him a handy is enough to push him off the edge. Holy Shit Ironyman! Your brilliant strategy just might work.

The problem with CIC is he actually thinks I give a shit about his opinion. No one with a brain does. It's unfortunate that he derails conversations, but no one is losing any sleep over his pathetic cries for attention. Personally, I like it when he posts something moronic. It demonstrates that social conservatives are stupid and deserve no respect. There's no greater argument for embracing liberal philosophy than people like CIC who hate it.

Dan8267 says

Related to this thread, Proof home ownership costs more than renting.

The rule of thumb I suggest is that a house should cost 100 times its rental value. It's the One Percent Rule in reverse. For example, a house that rents for $2000/month should cost $200,000.

That article is nonsense. It makes poor generalizations when there's no need to. Run the NYT rent vs. buy calculator and it will give you the right answer.

Your rule of thumb is too conservative--you will be renting when you should be buying in many, many cases. If you run the NYT, assuming 10 year stay--a $250K house should rent for $1046.

(assuming 2% price and rent growth/year and 5% return on investments)

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/upshot/buy-rent-calculator.html?_r=0

Bring on cheap insurance!!!

Fuck the homeowners, I'm a Floridian goddamn it!

Honey, that was an example of the One Percent Rule. Troll all you like. I'm happy and content, which is something you'll never be.

It's really sad that you feel the need to post nine times in a single thread in an attempt to bother me. Elliemae was right. You must have a very small dick and a very big insecurity about it. No one in the history of the Internet has ever obsessed as much over some stranger's life, residency, and car as you have.

Dan says:
"Assuming it's not underwater. In any case, predicting what future markets will be hot is a fool's errand. We've reached peak baby. The population of the U.S. would be declining if not for immigration. The great migration from north to south due to air conditioning is over. The population of the U.S. isn't going to double in this century like it did in the last. People are retiring to other states and other countries. And past performance is not a predictor of future performance, especially since the market prices in expectations.

So I wouldn't bet the farm on Florida beachfront property. I'm all for buying when it makes financial sense. If there is a good deal, I will, but I'm not losing out by holding other equities that have far less carrying costs and a higher real rate of return."

The most pathetic bunch of excuses I ever heard in my whole life. I don't believe, you believe your own excuses.

tatupu70 says

Your rule of thumb is too conservative--you will be renting when you should be buying in many, many cases. If you run the NYT, assuming 10 year stay--a $250K house should rent for $1046.

Feel free to show those many, many cases were a 250k house rents for 1046. Everywhere I've looked it's running somewhere close to 100 months rent.

Dan Dan Dan
The population of Florida is expanding and continues to do so. The migrations to the sun belt can only continue as people fed up with the frost belt love Florida an California
Florida is a bargain compared to California. Home prices can only go up over time

Looks like high prices to me. I was looking in Miami Beach-Hallandale Beach axis, and I found Condos within a couple of blocks of the beach that went for $150 in 2011 going for $350k+ last year. All that was done was maybe $20-40k of new cabinets and flooring and painting in a 2-3BD/1.5-2BTH

Also heard they've been building new like crazy.

bob2356 says

Feel free to show those many, many cases were a 250k house rents for 1046. Everywhere I've looked it's running somewhere close to 100 months rent.

I was surprised at the break even figure for rent on a $250K house too. Seems too low. Certainly there aren't many $250K homes renting for under $1100/month, which shows that not only is the vast majority of the country NOT in a bubble, but that buying is cheaper than renting too.

Why do liberals, who constantly flog and hysterically assert global warming, live in soon to be underwater (literally as well as figuratively) Florida at all?

Florida should be 100 percent conservatives.

I have a very success career and professional network down here as well as many friends. It's pretty much the same reason anyone stays anywhere.

But yes, part of south Florida will be underwater in the next two decades. Sections of Miami already flood with every high tide when they never use to. And yes, projections of sea-level rise do affect which areas I would consider buying property in.

Oh, an conservatives hate south Florida. It's hedonistic, full of Latinos, and very much in favor of social security due to all the old people. Conservatives prefer north Florida where it's expected that cousins marry.

Dan8267 says

Oh, an conservatives hate south Florida. It's hedonistic, full of Latinos, and very much in favor of social security due to all the old people. Conservatives prefer north Florida where it's expected that cousins marry.

Pretty Much. People from Central/North Florida think once you're past Stuart, you're as good as Dead.

Of course, they are dumber than shit. Quite a few swamp Yankees assimilate just fine into North and Central Florida, believe it or not. The West Coast and north of Stuart is just I-95 land, Denny's, Walmart, McDonalds, rinse wash repeat

thunderlips11 says

The West Coast and north of Stuart is just I-95 land, Denny's, Walmart, McDonalds, rinse wash repeat

That's the upscale parts.

thunderlips11 says

Of course, they are dumber than shit. Quite a few swamp Yankees assimilate just fine into North and Central Florida, believe it or not. The West Coast and north of Stuart is just I-95 land, Denny's, Walmart, McDonalds, rinse wash repeat

Now why would you say that, when all of the bizzaro whacked out crazzy liberal doing National Enquire shit news stories all originate from south of Daytona, and east of Orlando.
Last year I went to a family reunion in North Duval on a 20 acre spread, my Uncle even has a Deer enclosure with specimens he's collected all over the world. His enclosure is also where wild life conservationists bring injured animals to heal. So there I was a damned South Florida Yankee(yes there's such a thing) at a Higginbotham family reunine ho-down in the middle of a North Florida woods swamp. I was expecting to get flack for my long hair and my dark "spanish" wife, among a sea of White pasty faces.

But what I found was everyone stopping and asking everyone else how their Latin, Black, Indian, Gay, Adpoted biracial kids all fit into the family tree, and Aunt Dot was over there frantically with her arts and crafts box, makind the new amendments and addition to our Family Tree she had in the 5,000 sqft barn Uncle Grumppy built to host the family reunion every year.

I had a blast and so did all of the other cousins who brought their family and extended family members that may be less than White.

The Asshole all live in the city that includes me and everyone reading this post. I could promise you are all bigger assholes than the simple nicest people that live in rural areas, that you nitwits have never even once ventured into. You all are still letting "Deliverance" set your narrative for you think you would find in places like that.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Florida_School_for_Boys

And all those good folk have been circling the wagons against nosy outsiders for decades.

Sure, there are decent peasants here and there, but for everyone who hides the neighbor girl, there's 20 more who make the cutthroat sign and laugh as the train rolls by and loot the house.

"'It is my belief, Watson, founded upon my experience, that the lowest and vilest alleys in London do not present a more dreadful record of sin than does the smiling and beautiful countryside.
...
The pressure of public opinion can do in the town what the law cannot accomplish. There is no lane so vile that the scream of a tortured child, or the thud of a drunkard's blow, does not beget sympathy and indignation among the neighbours, and then the whole machinery of justice is ever so close that a word of complaint can set it going, and there is but a step between the crime and the dock. But look at these lonely houses, each in its own fields, filled for the most part with poor ignorant folk who know little of the law. Think of the deeds of hellish cruelty, the hidden wickedness which may go on, year in, year out, in such places, and none the wiser."