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The Health Care System's So FUBAR, We Should Do France-Style Single Payer System
invite response
2017 Jan 19, 1:12pm 3,757 views 20 comments
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Doctors really are probably the least objectionable part of our system.
Insurance conglomerates, Big Pharma (Americans pay some 280% more for meds than next highest-cost nation, and 480% more than French), and device makers are all way more interested in keeping things as they are.
Karl Denninger/The Market Ticker has been going on about our healthcare & the math that will end it in a pile of shit.
APOCALYPSEFUCK_is_ADORABLE says
Doctor's would just end up shooting their patients in the face and stealing their wallets.
Their wallets are empty! ASSHOLES CAN'T PAY CASH!
How many are Republican FAILURES?
- we'd be way better off with a French style healthcare system, as a nation (
Vraimont!
http://ec.europa.eu/economy_finance/publications/economic_paper/2015/pdf/ecp549_en.pdf
FNWGMOBDVZXDNW
2017 Jan 19, 2:03pm
Obamacare was the Democrat's first step in the move to single payer. We'll see what we get now that it is being dismantled.
Booger
2017 Jan 19, 2:25pm
Instead of coming up with new ways to pay for it, how about coming up with some cost controls.
RWSGFY
2017 Jan 19, 6:24pm
France as a country is FUBAR and you want to adopt pieces of their shit?
Anyone here, right, left or center, can claim whatever they wish, but what they claim and wish does not comport with the fact that The United States of America has more monies appropriated towards health care per person than any other nation, by a wide margin, yet American Citizens have incredibly expensive cost of care out of pocket (even after massive government subsidies to insurance, pharma , device maker, etc.), pay massively higher prices for treatments, routine care, prescription meds, surgeries, etc., and even more, in terms of health indexes, Americans are largely unhealthy when their rate of infant mortality, heart disease, cancer, diabetes, and other chronic medical conditions are weighed against other developed nations (and even many emerging ones!).
The FACT IS; The U.S. Health Care System is RIGGED against consumers (there's not even transparency, as in price tags, on medical care, so consumers don't even know how much many procedures and meds will even cost!), and RIGGED for insurance, pharma, device makers, et al.
It's a horribly broken fuckup of a system and it's pathetic that it's been tolerated this long.
People can wail & moan dogmatic cries about 'socialized" this and "government" that, but the clear facts and statistics prove that Americans are being raped financially in terms of cost of care, and in many cases, quality of care, in contrast to the superior, far more efficient systems in places such as France (where the system is infinitely more simple, with transparent pricing, and 1/10th as many administrators, brokers, billers, and other parasitic drain middlemen that drive costs sky high without any improvement in care).
-'continued--
The same knee replacement in France that's done in the U.S. costs about 1/3 as much (it's 1/5 as much in one of the most advanced hospital's in the world in Thailand, by the way, where medical tourists go to see world-class doctors and surgeons and specialists, and have even the most complicated procedures done for a literal fraction of what those same procedures cost in the U.S.), is done in modern, clean, advanced settings, by extremely competent physicians and nurses, there's clarity and transparency in billing, and there are NO BANKRUPTCIES BECAUSE OF FUCKING INDIVIDUAL OR FAMILY MEDICAL COSTS.
The U.S. system is a patchwork, leaky, rickety, sinking barge of a system where corruption and scheming rigs the price of everything from a fucking Tylenol to a pacemaker to a knee replacement to a stent procedure to the cost of epipens and basic, necessary meds like insulin (that's been used since the 1950s for fucks sake) which has seen its price increase 40x since the year 2000 (it's not liquid gold, hard to produce, R&D intensive medication - it was amortized way more than 30 years ago, and the prices are kept high by big pharma companies buying generic drug makers in order to stave off price competition).
Strategist
2017 Jan 19, 8:00pm
The same knee replacement in France that's done in the U.S. costs about 1/2 as much (it's 1/5 as much in one of the most cava few hospital's in the world in Thailand, by the way, where medical tourists go to see world-class doctors and surgeons and specialists, and have even the most complicated procedures done for a literal fraction of what those same procedures cost in the U.S.), is done in modern, clean, advanced settings, by extremely competent physicians and nurses, there's clarity and transparency in billing, and there are NO BANKRUPTCIES BECAUSE OF FUCKING INDIVIDUAL OR FAMILY MEDICAL COSTS.
Insurance companies should pay for patients going to other countries for surgeries. They will save money and so will we.
We should be able to buy drugs from anywhere in the world.
Strategist
2017 Jan 19, 8:06pm
I have great insurance, yet ended up paying $3,000+ as my share for a torn meniscus on my knee. The actual surgery was only 15 minutes.
I'm sure i could have gone to Thailand for less and got a vacation out of it.
Our system sucks sucks sucks.
Strategist
2017 Jan 19, 8:08pm
APOCALYPSEFUCK_is_ADORABLE says
Americans are being raped financially in terms of cost of care,
Why do you HATE! success?
Because i'm the one being raped. There is a reason why i walk funny after a routine surgery. Do you ever see the doctor walk funny?
Strategist
2017 Jan 19, 8:32pm
APOCALYPSEFUCK_is_ADORABLE says
Do you ever see the doctor walk funny?
Is there any law against you becoming a doctor?
Why do you hate FREEDOM?
Harvard told me being in the bottom 2%was not good enough. They recommended McDonald's. McDonald's recommended Burger King. :(
RWSGFY
2017 Jan 19, 8:39pm
It's a package deal: you want French HC system - you get the whole French system. If you like the latter - why not move there and live happily ever after?
It's a package deal: you want French HC system - you get the whole French system. If you like the latter - why not move there and live happily ever after?
After I get done with the feeble elderly parent responsibility that brought me very unwillingly back to the states that's exactly what I'm going to do.
Strategist
2017 Jan 19, 9:17pm
It's a package deal: you want French HC system - you get the whole French system. If you like the latter - why not move there and live happily ever after?
After I get done with the feeble elderly parent responsibility that brought me very unwillingly back to the states that's exactly what I'm going to do.
Sounds like you can hardly wait. Bon Voyage.
It's a package deal: you want French HC system - you get the whole French system. If you like the latter - why not move there and live happily ever after?
Why should Americans have to move to another country jut to get clearly superior health care?
That's like saying if you like Japanese vehicles or authentic Chinese cuisine one should move to Japan or China.
Are you saying that Americans don't have the brainpower and wherewithal to pluck better elements of other nations' systems, that clearly work better, with more efficiency and effectiveness, and bring them here, as Japan so often does?
Your statement is one of the most close-minded and narrow viewpoints I could have possibly expected.
Expand your horizons.
Insurance companies should pay for patients going to other countries for surgeries. They will save money and so will we.
It would, but there is also trend of payors becoming hospital owners in the kaiser mold
I'm sure i could have gone to Thailand for less and got a vacation out of it.
Yep, but I'd recommend banking blood ahead of time, although Thailand doesn't have the hiv rate that India has. Both have highly skilled surgeons who are probably more proficient at age 40 as a US counterpart with 25-30 yrs experience
zzyzzx
2017 Jan 20, 5:59am
APOCALYPSEFUCK_is_ADORABLE says
Impossible without COMMUNIST! tyranny that lead down the path to everyone being stuffed into ovens.
Nope. Up front pricing, negotiated drug prices, and lawsuit reform will lower medical costs greatly.
Insurance companies should pay for patients going to other countries for surgeries. They will save money and so will we.
We should be able to buy drugs from anywhere in the world
https://www.healthcitycaymanislands.com/
When these guys get up to 1000 beds, the partnership between Narayana Health and Ascension Health intend to do that, but still a few years away. Doubt US will solve problems in that time.
I'm conservative, too, on economic issues, for the most part, but ladies & gentleman, our American system of balkanized, administratively-heavy, middlemen-skimming, parasitic loss, SICK CARE health care is so fundamentally flawed, broken and hopelessly complex (with near-monopoly entities in some cases literally pricing services, procedures, devices and pharmaceuticals at whatever arbitrary price-point they decide, because there are few, disciplining free market forces at work-
- we'd be way better off with a French style healthcare system, as a nation (we'd probably achieve high quality, more efficient care, at much lower prices, in a much more logically administered system).
#WeDoNotHaveFreeMarket