patrick.net

The case fatality rate in the US is about 1.8% in the US. "Cases" are people who were sick enough to go see a doctor, a minority of infections.

The infection fatality rate in the US is about 0.3%, about six times less. Only about 1 in 6 people get sick enough that they see a doctor, and of that minority, only about 1.8% of those actually die.

And even those stats are irrelevant to most people, given the strongly exponential skewing of deaths towards the elderly and the obese.

It's pretty much a nothingburger if you take a step back from the hysteria. OK, it's about 3x worse than the flu, but were you likely to die of the flu this year? Nope.





It's a nothingburger in India too, but that doesn't sell papers or get people to give up all their rights and give the government unlimited power. They have to hype it or you wouldn't even know it's a thing at all.

anniecoyote says

I was in a hospital emergency room with my spouse for his issue (leg infection) and overheard the person in the next room through the curtain. She was there after her recent 2nd jab, maybe 50-60-ish person, couldn't see without being too obvious, a little overweight.

When fat people are considered normal, I wonder what a "little overweight" means.

ThreeBays says

zzyzzx says

Cherry picking and misrepresenting facts is fun. If you take this at face value, you are easily manipulated.

Solid line-by-line deboonking. We're proud of you.

ThreeBays says

Cherry picking and misrepresenting facts is fun. If you take this at face value, you are easily manipulated.

I know, right?

I heard that some people are getting the jab in spite of the fact that it is not very effective at best, and deadly at worst. And we have no idea of the long term effects as human trials are will be finished in 2023.

ThreeBays says

Hundreds of millions of individuals have had the vaccines without issues. Even so, we do not yet understand long term effects.

Like where's Tiffany. ThreeBays says

Everyone should make their own decision about getting vaccinated

Agreed.

Though I know if we don't stop the slippery slope slide we are on we won't be able to travel without the vaccine passport IF the world opens back up.

ThreeBays says

Truth -

Vaccines like Pfizer & Moderna have been shown highly effective against symptomatic disease with 95-100% protection in clinical trials, and 97% measured in Israel's population.

Studies show Pfizer vaccine is very effective at preventing infection altogether, with 1 dose shown to reduce spread in UK households 50%, and 2 doses shown to reduce asymptomatic infection by 94% in Israel.

US county policies are predicated on spread, hospitalization, and ICU usage. By significantly reducing spread and symptomatic infection, vaccines are enabling schools and businesses to open to higher capacities sooner.

Taking the vaccine enables ease of travel, for example CDC recommends that un-vaccinated individuals get tested and quarantine for 2 weeks when traveling, and vaccinated individuals need not take special precautions. Masking guidance is also eased in vaccinated individuals.


Current vaccines have been authorized under "Emergency Use Authoriz...

An experimental biological agent is completely unnecessary for a virus for which 81% of the population have some sort of (cross) immunity against, except for a small part of people at high risk and frontline healthcare workers who may not want to pass it onto their high risk patients.

zzyzzx says

Do as I do.

Ignore what is laughably called "mainstream media" in the United States.

Part of their strategy is to make outrageous claims to get people to endlessly argue about the falsity or correctness of the claims. Just realize it's bullshit, and don't argue with the morons that don't realize it at this point.

Onvacation says

Though I know if we don't stop the slippery slope slide we are on we won't be able to travel without the vaccine passport IF the world opens back up.

https://archive.is/zcsdl

https://humansarefree.com/2021/05/european-database-of-adverse-drug-reactions-for-covid-19-vaccines.html


CORONAVIRUSHEALTHCAREVACCINES8,430 DEAD & 354,177 Injuries: European Database Of Adverse Drug Reactions For COVID-19 ‘Vaccines’

ThreeBays says

less than 20% of the at-risk population getting infected before vaccination took over. Lockdowns + vaccination saved a majority of lives.

Around 20% you say? Interesting coincidence....

ThreeBays says

FuckCCP89 says

Around 20% you say? Interesting coincidence....

It's not. Enlighten us...

Here you go: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41590-020-00808-x.pdf

ThreeBays says

Yes... except that some of the age groups show 47% antibody rates... so no.

People that get asymptomatic covid still develop antibodies.

ThreeBays says

Cherry picking and misrepresenting facts is fun.

ThreeBays says

Lockdowns + vaccination saved a majority of lives.

1) nope, still almost 600,000 died supposedly of Covid even though there were lockdowns. Lockdown states like New York fared far worse with Covid death rate than non lockdown states like Florida despite the sunshine state being jam packed with oldsters.
2)vaccines have killed a bunch of people. I thought “every life mattered?” Estimates for vax deaths run into the tens of thousands.
3)masks don’t work.

Not looking good for the vaxxed:

https://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=242248

https://rumble.com/vg4inv-michael-yeadon-full-interview-planet-lockdown.html

ThreeBays says

Lockdowns + vaccination saved a majority of lives.

There's no model that exists that could ever prove this. If there is choice A - No lockdowns, or choice B - lockdowns, we took choice B. You or anyone has zero evidence that choice A wouldn't have been better and maybe we wouldn't have even needed a vaccine.

This idea that the path we chose was correct assumes a ton of things. I stopped listening to anything the CDC or Fauci said in early May 2020. Started traveling. Hung out with big groups of neighbors. Didn't wear a mask. Never quarantined after trips. I'm not dead, got sick once (tested negative from a BS test), didn't go to the doctor besides my foot and that was it.

You're buying the hype. I'm not trying to be a dick, more so pointing out how big of a con job Covid is/was. I understand if you're 60+ there might be some concern. Guess what... most every boomer I know that dies is from cancer or heart disease/attack. Covid is a joke. Always has been. It's a narrative, not a disease (yes it exists).

When someone admits to taking the "vaccine":

Stop saying you “did your research” before you got the Covid-19 vaccine … because YOU ARE the research!

Deadly, experimental vaccines are a form of medical violence.

Booger says

Stop saying you “did your research” before you got the Covid-19 vaccine … because YOU ARE the research!

Bingo. And if you're under 60 you'd be an extreme, extreme anomaly if you died from it. Less than 99%

WookieMan says

ThreeBays says

Lockdowns + vaccination saved a majority of lives.

There's no model that exists that could ever prove this. If there is choice A - No lockdowns, or choice B - lockdowns, we took choice B. You or anyone has zero evidence that choice A wouldn't have been better and maybe we wouldn't have even needed a vaccine.

This idea that the path we chose was correct assumes a ton of things. I stopped listening to anything the CDC or Fauci said in early May 2020. Started traveling. Hung out with big groups of neighbors. Didn't wear a mask. Never quarantined after trips. I'm not dead, got sick once (tested negative from a BS test), didn't go to the doctor besides my foot and that was it.

You're buying the hype. I'm not trying to be a dick, more so pointing out how big of a con job Covid is/was. I understand if you're 60+ there might be some concern. Guess what... most every bo...

81% have some sort of cross immunity, so you likely came in contact with it but didn't develop any noticeable illness. To force 81% into draconian lockdowns destroying the livelihoods of many and forcing kids to stay at home, cancel school and wear masks to prevent potential (small chance, not given!) infection and illness in 20% with a chance of death around 0.01%-0.1% is not only tyrannical, diabolical and heartless, it's mathematically stupid. That is especially true when you consider the fact that there's a simple personal choice available for everyone who doesn't want to take a risk: stay at home as long as you want and fear.

mell says

To force 81% into draconian lockdowns destroying the livelihoods of many and forcing kids to stay at home, cancel school and wear masks to prevent infection and illness in 20% with a chance of death around 0.01%-0.1% is not only diabolical and heartless, it's mathematically stupid.

Bbbbut you just want to kill grandma! Every life matters!!
(Except lives ended due to vaccination. That’s necessary and right)

WookieMan says

maybe we wouldn't have even needed a vaccine.

We DON'T need a vaccine and we DON'T have a vaccine. The experimental biologic agent that the government is pushing will not end well, I fear.

ThreeBays says

And that's ignoring the fact that healthcare systems would have been overwhelmed and many more would die that could have been saved in hospitals.

Bullshit. There was never any overload aside from what happens during regular flu seasons, the Trump admin provided mobile beds and ships for the surge to leftoid governors lying through their teeth, only to go 100% unused. The bay area had no high load whatsoever ever. Also nobody was "saved" in the hospitals, they waited until people deteriorated to the max only to put them on useless ventilators. Many might not have had covid but caught it in the hospital. They never used any of the widely available proven therapeutics, not early on and not late on. They actually killed people with their inaction, but cashed in on large sums on "treatments" with ventilators and "covid deaths" in their hospitals. Simple.steroid inhalers would have been miracle drugs, as would habe been Invermectin and hcq plus zinc, selenium and high doses of vit. D. Finally Pfizer is working on an additional real therapeutic which can't come soon so that that mass vaxxing experiment and lockdown coercions finally stop.

ThreeBays says

it means the amount of death if we let the virus spread uncontrollably could be 4 or 5 times larger (i.e. over 2 million as initially modeled). And that's ignoring the fact that healthcare systems would have been overwhelmed and many more would die that could have been saved in hospitals.

Unproveable bullshit.

We never had to use the hospital ships and MASH units could have been put up wherever needed but the fact is there was no curve to flatten.

Utter bullshit.

ThreeBays says

mell says

81% have some sort of cross immunity, so you likely came in contact with it but didn't develop any noticeable illness. To force 81% into draconian lockdowns destroying the livelihoods of many and forcing kids to stay at home, cancel school and wear masks to prevent infection and illness in 20% with a chance of death around 0.01%-0.1% is not only diabolical and heartless, it's mathematically stupid.

The estimates of becoming ill, hospitalized, or dead lined up pretty much where scientists thought they were right at the beginning of the pandemic (https://youtu.be/y6h8TIxeg1g?t=54 if you need a memory jog of 1 year ago):
- 80% will have either mild or no symptoms
- 15-20% will have pneumonia
- 4% will develop ARDS or multi-organ failure
- 1% will die

Every argument that it was a h...

Bulshit. Herd immunity was predicted by most and achieved as expected after the 2nd wave, only prolonged slightly by the lockdowns. The curve had been in freefall before any mass vaccinations started. The "scientists"predicted? That's some comedy gold here. We had predictions of deaths in the millions within the year, masks don't work, then they suddenly do. If you keep counting into eternity you may reach a million deaths eventually even though excess mortality is lower than normal now! None of the "predictions" or models were even in a remote realm of correctness.

ThreeBays says

There's little to no data on how many people have died because of the vaccines instead of with the vaccines. Don't be fooled by the bots that are trying to hurt America by spinning any anecdotes about the vaccine.

VAERS?

At this point over 3,000 people's deaths have been directly attributed to the injection of the experimental biologic agent according to VAERS. some say that the actual number of deaths and injuries from the experimental biologic agent may be 10 or 20 times as great.

By little or no data do you mean that most deaths and injury's from the experimental biologic agent go unreported?

ThreeBays says

Shaman says

1) nope, still almost 600,000 died supposedly of Covid even though there were lockdowns. Lockdown states like New York fared far worse with Covid death rate than non lockdown states like Florida despite the sunshine state being jam packed with oldsters.
2)vaccines have killed a bunch of people. I thought “every life mattered?” Estimates for vax deaths run into the tens of thousands.
3)masks don’t work.

A majority of deaths are in the over 65. If 20% or less of over 65s actually got the virus, it means the amount of death if we let the virus spread uncontrollably could be 4 or 5 times larger (i.e. over 2 million as initially modeled). And that's ignoring the fact that healthcare systems would have been overwhelmed and many more would die that could have been saved in hospitals.

There's little to no data on how many people have died because of the vaccines instead o...

Well, the # of deaths would've been FAR less if we allowed docs to prescribe Ivermectin and we pushed folks to take Vitamin D supplements. But no, they didn't because that would've taken away their FDA Emergency Authorization for the gene therapy jabs.

ThreeBays says

scientists

ThreeBays says

many 10s of arguments from your side have been proven wrong again and again and again.

Proof? No ?

OK Karl.

Now they're "warning" that they're seeing more serious cases among the younger. Ya think? Gee could it have to do with the fact that milenials gained an avg. of 40 lbs during the lockdowns with the whole population an avg of 25 lbs, netfuxxing and chilling on the couch with take out food as the gubbermint ordered instead of exercising their lungs and reducing body fat with a run in the sun most days of the week?!

mell says

WookieMan says

ThreeBays says

Lockdowns + vaccination saved a majority of lives.

There's no model that exists that could ever prove this. If there is choice A - No lockdowns, or choice B - lockdowns, we took choice B. You or anyone has zero evidence that choice A wouldn't have been better and maybe we wouldn't have even needed a vaccine.

This idea that the path we chose was correct assumes a ton of things. I stopped listening to anything the CDC or Fauci said in early May 2020. Started traveling. Hung out with big groups of neighbors. Didn't wear a mask. Never quarantined after trips. I'm not dead, got sick once (tested negative from a BS test), didn't go to the doctor besides my foot and that was it.

You're buying the hype. I'm not trying to be a dick, more so pointing out how big of a con job Covid is/was....

Didn't you take the vax?

Also what bothers me is the bot/troll/disinformation smear. Nobody here has ever said covid is a hoax or not real. I'm fine with the "vaccine"/agent as a personal choice/option. Medicine and science in general have always been evolving. Only with the lefts recent clampdown on free speech have MDs now been harassed, fired and barred as well as regular folks persecuted for engaging in healthy scientific debates around this still fairly new virus. Yet the left and government acted and coerced as if they had all the answers when they had none. When did somebody disagreeing become a Russian troll or bot?!

Onvacation says

ThreeBays says

There's little to no data on how many people have died because of the vaccines instead of with the vaccines. Don't be fooled by the bots that are trying to hurt America by spinning any anecdotes about the vaccine.

VAERS?

At this point over 3,000 people's deaths have been directly attributed to the injection of the experimental biologic agent according to VAERS. some say that the actual number of deaths and injuries from the experimental biologic agent may be 10 or 20 times as great.

By little or no data do you mean that most deaths and injury's from the experimental biologic agent go unreported?

lol vaers used to be THE scientific goto database for adverse reactions and deaths. Until 2021. Now the media lackeys started attacking it as "unreliable". Go figure

ThreeBays says

Onvacation says

VAERS?

At this point over 3,000 people's deaths have been directly attributed to the injection of the experimental biologic agent according to VAERS. some say that the actual number of deaths and injuries from the experimental biologic agent may be 10 or 20 times as great.

By little or no data do you mean that most deaths and injury's from the experimental biologic agent go unreported?

You're confused; VAERS records any deaths reported "with" the vaccine, and few if any have been directly "attributed" to the vaccine yet.

mell says

lol vaers used to be THE scientific goto database for adverse reactions and deaths. Until 2021. Now the media lackeys started attacking it as "unreliable". Go figure

Not at all, why are you making shit up?

...

Of course not in the same manner that nobody can prove that anyone died of covid (as opposed to with). The vaers deaths and reactions are as likely to be caused by the agent as covid caused any of those 500k deaths. No reason to dismiss these likely vaccine caused deaths and severe side effects with a straw man disclaimer. Nobody is doing a post hum autopsy on any of the presumed covid 19 deaths, they are just alleged.

I believe the vaccine is causing massive spike protein synthesis in some people, which quickly enters the bloodstream and damaged blood vessels badly. If the damage is severe enough, wound response is activated and platelets clump to keep the vessels from leaking into the body. This can block arteries. If the major arteries are blocked in this way, it can lead to strokes or heart attacks.

So it would be predictable that some people suffer heart attacks and/or strokes within days of being vaxxed.

ThreeBays says

mell says

Of course not in the same manner that nobody can prove that anyone died of covid (as opposed to with). The vaers deaths and reactions are as likely to be caused by the agent as covid caused any of those 500k deaths. No reason to dismiss these likely vaccine caused deaths and severe side effects with a straw man disclaimer. Nobody is doing a post hum autopsy on any of the presumed covid 19 deaths, they are just alleged.

Partly true. With covid they will be able to record the cause of death based on if someone had severe covid symptoms and died from ARDS or pneumonia or multi-organ failure associated with covid condition.

On the other hand VAERS will get records of people that died of heart disease or literally any ailment within a week or something of receiving the vaccine. People die of other causes on a regular basis so it is not "as likely" to be caused by the vac...

But they aren't. With covid everyone dying with covid or even without but presumed (e.g. flu/cold/bronchitis/pneumoniae) will be recorded as covid death. Especially with the incentives of doing so. The likelihood should be around equal. Everyone who wants to make a seriously informed decision has to take the numbers and crunch them to see on which side they fall. Also stocking and taking therapeutics proven mostly safe over decades vs an experimental vaccine is a no-brainer. But to each their own.

Desflurane78 says

If you don’t get vaccinated you will not be able to leave the USA for years

I'm cool with that.

If two years from now there have been no long term effects AND it has proven to be safe and effective And the FDA has approved it I will consider taking it or forging a vaccine passport to travel (Mexico City was our next planned trip that had to be postponed for the "pandemic")

But it's not about that.

The latest cold (Corona virus) has been used to institute draconian rules (not laws) that restrict our enumerated rights. Half of the argument is being censored and the general public is told that Fauci is the leading expert on viruses when in reality he is a pencil pushing octogenarian that should have resigned after he fucked up the response to AIDS 40 years ago.

The election was stolen.

The first amendment was suspended.

Hundreds of thousands of small businesses and millions of people have lost their jobs with no prospects but corporate servitude or the dole.

The rich are richer. At least I am, and I am only rich because I am free and have resources. While my accounts have surged the number of people living hand to mouth has surged along with it. By plan? Will we truly soon own nothing and be happy? Or else?

Get the jab or you can't travel.

Paranoid rant over.

mell says

Also what bothers me is the bot/troll/disinformation smear. Nobody here has ever said covid is a hoax or not real. I'm fine with the "vaccine"/agent as a personal choice/option. Medicine and science in general have always been evolving. Only with the lefts recent clampdown on free speech have MDs now been harassed, fired and barred as well as regular folks persecuted for engaging in healthy scientific debates around this still fairly new virus. Yet the left and government acted and coerced as if they had all the answers when they had none. When did somebody disagreeing become a Russian troll or bot?!

Seriously, what else do we need to know? This fact alone tells US what WE need to know.

There. Is. An. Agenda

Onvacation says

The experimental biologic agent that the government is pushing will not end well, I fear.

It's been a month now since I had my J&J shot. Not even herpes yet.