patrick.net

WookieMan says

In CA maybe. IL they're toast in 30 years if that. Hail storms. Every house here will get smashed by golf ball or bigger sized hail 1-3 times in your lifetime. It destroys clay tile.

And people say weather doesn't matter, LOL.

WookieMan says

Every house here will get smashed by golf ball or bigger sized hail 1-3 times in your lifetime. It destroys clay tile.

That happens in Germany tool. Just before I did my foreign study year in Innsbruck, there was a crazy hailstorm so you'd see all these damaged cars driving around.

The most notable hailstorm in Germany during the 1980s was the Munich hailstorm on July 12, 1984, which caused extensive damage with tennis ball-sized hailstones.

This event resulted in an estimated cost of 3 billion Deutschmark, making it the most significant loss event in the history of the German insurance industry at that time.

The storm damaged approximately 70,000 homes and 200,000 cars, and it is often remembered for the term "Munich Design," which jokingly referred to cars whose bodywork was not repaired after the storm.

Silver accounts for roughly 5–10% of the total cost of a solar panel system, depending on silver prices and panel design.

📊 Silver’s Role in Solar Costs
• Material Use: Each solar panel contains about 20 grams (0.64 ounces) of silver, embedded in the conductive paste that carries electricity through the silicon cells.
• Industry Demand: In 2023, solar PV consumed 193.5 million ounces of silver, projected to rise to 232 million ounces in 2024.
• Cost Share:
• At ~$25/oz silver, the silver in one panel costs about $16.
• With installed panel costs averaging $150–$300 per panel, silver represents 5–10% of the hardware cost.
• For a full residential system (~20 panels, $15,000–$20,000 installed), silver contributes $300–$600 of the total.

🧠 Why Silver Matters
• Efficiency: Silver is the best conductor, boosting panel efficiency compared to alternatives like copper.
• Price Sensitivity: Rising silver prices (up ~100% since 2019) put pressure on manufacturers to reduce silver content or switch to copper metallization.
• Scaling Impact: As global solar capacity expands, silver demand is becoming a bottleneck—solar now accounts for ~15% of annual silver consumption.

⚠️ Implications
• Cost Volatility: If silver prices spike, solar system costs rise disproportionately, since silver is irreplaceable in high‑efficiency designs.
• Innovation Pressure: Manufacturers are researching copper and aluminum alternatives to reduce reliance on silver.
• Macro Link: Silver’s dual role as an industrial and precious metal means solar demand directly influences global silver markets.

✅ In summary: Silver makes up about 5–10% of the cost of a solar system, with each panel using ~20 grams of silver. Rising silver prices are a growing challenge for solar economics.
Sources: International Precious Metals Institute, Resource World, MiningVisuals

$$$ seems like silver will be one of the most major cost components of solar panels $$$

Forgot one more implication:

If silver prices skyrocket, panels on top of homes will suddenly go missing like catalytic converters on cars parked outside currently do.

AD says

Innovation Pressure: Manufacturers are researching copper and aluminum alternatives to reduce reliance on silver

But...but..I was told by 'experts' that commercial graphene/buckeypaper to deal with this was just around the corner!

I don't remember solar roadways.

Seems like it could be a good idea if technically possible.

Patrick says

I don't remember solar roadways.

Seems like it could be a good idea if technically possible.

Progress is when technically possible meets profitability.
In new green deal progress is if: Pay for your guilt right now, you M*** F***.

REpro says

Patrick says

I don't remember solar roadways.

Seems like it could be a good idea if technically possible.

Progress is when technically possible meets profitability.
In new green deal progress is if: Pay for your guilt right now, you M*** F***.

Skid resistance with tires and the road. It's a non-starter from a governmental level and also the solar aspect. I'm in the know. Engineers have alway laughed at this idea.

Traction aside, put a plow or salt on it? A semi at 80k lbs or an even heavier load and it's destroyed. It could only be done on pedestrian walkways and that would maybe get you 1k homes powered in the southwest. It was a 15 year high schooler idea that was just that, was never realistic.

https://solarroadways.com/

https://youtu.be/qlTA3rnpgzU?si=G1HGlyUIkqYtkJlR

MolotovCocktail says

https://solarroadways.com/

https://youtu.be/qlTA3rnpgzU?si=G1HGlyUIkqYtkJlR

Yes there are retarded nut bags that think it is a good idea. Plenty of people have presented x,y and z inventions but it doesn't happen. It's a marketing scheme to make money and provide nothing. They made a 10'x10' pad for $10k and got a couple million out of it.

Solar has to be angled to provide the most bang for the buck. Throw in the elements and weight of vehicles it's a non-starter. And then government restrictions on skid resistance. Like I said, a high schooler science project idea. Not happening in 99.9% of the cases with ideas like this.

An area about the size of Georgia has been paved in the US. Seems like an awful lot of wasted energy to just heat the blacktop.

Maybe it could all be covered with roofs which tilt to face the sun and drop snow. Or maybe it's just pointless in cold climates.

Grok tells me that setting up only 1/5 of that area in the Mojave would suffice for all US electricity needs, if you could deliver it.

Concentrated Solar Failure

FreeAmericanDOP says

Concentrated Solar Failure

another R&D failure subsidized by the federal guvmint

so anything good came out of this like lessons learned to apply to a future similar or next generation renewable energy project ? could they salvage a lot of the hardware and software from this ?

or is this a total waste and failure ?

Interesting solar panel situation:
https://www.reddit.com/r/legaladvice/comments/1pokxz6/bought_a_house_with_free_solar_panels_15_years/

Bought a house with "free" solar panels 1.5 years ago. Just found out $45K is owed on the panels.

Solar panels all go away when then price goes down. Here in Idaho it's 10.5c Kwh. Panels here are rare only people from blue states moving in buy them lol. You can't pencil out those high energy prices it's impossible. I advise move away from those blue areas.

zzyzzx says

Interesting solar panel situation:
https://www.reddit.com/r/legaladvice/comments/1pokxz6/bought_a_house_with_free_solar_panels_15_years/

Bought a house with "free" solar panels 1.5 years ago. Just found out $45K is owed on the panels.

Flag right here that this is a bullshit Reddit post:

We do not know if there were any other owners between the original owner and the person that we bought it from.

And another:

Last month, we refinanced our mortgage. The lender asked for proof of ownership of the solar panels.

AD says

or is this a total waste and failure ?

Depends on the purpose of the project. If the real purpose was to grift massive funds under the guise of creating solar power, it was a success.

HeadSet says

AD says

or is this a total waste and failure ?

Depends on the purpose of the project. If the real purpose was to grift massive funds under the guise of creating solar power, it was a success.

Like the California HST.

AD says

FreeAmericanDOP says

Concentrated Solar Failure

another R&D failure subsidized by the federal guvmint

so anything good came out of this like lessons learned to apply to a future similar or next generation renewable energy project ? could they salvage a lot of the hardware and software from this ?

or is this a total waste and failure ?

Lessons? It was all fraud, they’ll do it again. Success isn’t the goal, theft is the goal. And that goal was accomplished.

There are good use cases for solar, but I doubt that solar cells are one of those cases.

Using a parabolic mirror to concentrate sunlight on the cold water input to a hot water tank sounds cost-effective.

Arranging houses to take advantage of sunlight via solar mass is an old method that works. Iranians had that worked out millenia ago. They also did clever cooling with solar-heated chimneys.

I've long thought that algae and yeast based solar cells to create and then ferment sugars into burnable alcohol might also be worthwhile.

Patrick says

Using a parabolic mirror to concentrate sunlight on the cold water input to a hot water tank sounds cost-effective.

That is a common technique out here. Virgina law requires that a rooftop solar water heater must feed into a conventional hot water tank. The purpose is to cool down the water since the rooftop system will heat the water above the 160 degrees considered safe for a hot water supply. I had an Australian friend tell me that back home there is no water heaters, as the issue there is cooling the water down (Australia is partly in the tropics).