patrick.net

GNL says

You didn't tell me if your phantom house is 2 levels above ground or not. Total square footage is NOT RE 101. It's a grey area at best.

I've said it was a ranch for a while. That's never changed. Above grade is 100% for fact different and is the first MLS square footage you'll see. An appraiser sees. A bank sees. Your brokers don't know what the fuck they're talking about whatsoever.

Eman invests in residential real estate. Commercial residential is no different than a buyer of a single family home. Square footage is above grade. That's not debatable. Can brokers lie and include below grade square footage. Yes. They should and will likely get fined or lose their license at some point. You're questioning something you know nothing about. You photograph houses from brokers too dumb to be able to do it on their own in the 20 minutes it takes. I'd suggest getting advice from smarter people.

If they list anything over a year worth while, they can save $10k easy doing it in house and not hiring you. Your customers are morons and they're shaping your perspective that you have no clue about. But whatever. I've clearly triggered you. I know what I'm talking about and you don't. Enjoy the rest of your night. Above grade square footage is the rule nationwide. Fact. Ask them what a bedroom is. You'll get 50 different answer from 50 different shitty real estate brokers. You don't know the industry just because you take photos for bums that are likely doing typical shady RE bull shit.

Talk to me when you've got your license. Until then you know dick about real estate. Let it soak in. You work for people that don't have the ability to take photos of a property yet you trust them to know what they're talking about. Really, think about it. You have the easiest job for a bunch of bimbos and nit wits, but trust their word on RE. You're not right in the head.

Only a moron would take their own photos, draw floor plans, do 3D and create property pages. You were a do it yourselfer. I assume that's why you didn't succeed at RE. Would a Realtor clean the home also? Why not? Because it's retarded, that's why.

You think it's the unsuccessful Realtors that hire tour professionals? Really? LOL.

You don't run/own a business. No education that I can tell. Nope, you hide behind the success/skirt of your sheep wife's "$300K/yr" career yet still saving for the lifetime dream of owning a 2,200 square foot townhouse. That's some funny shit right there. I'm a lowly photographer and own a home bigger than that. LMAO. Even my 23 year old daughter (at the time) and husband bought a home bigger than that.

GNL says

Only a moron would take their own photos, draw floor plans, do 3D and create property pages.

You just shot yourself in your own foot. It takes 20 minutes to do all of that. Oh and I did the accounting, the taxes, managed 20+ brokers, $50m/yr in sales, health insurance, legal issues and more than you'd ever understand. A good year for you is probably $200k in sales. You get your write offs and $20 lunches as "meals with clients" at BWW and think you're big time.

You don't know me and my experience. It's beyond real estate. Let me know when you were the guy behind the curtain that created a $30M valuation company. We just spent $35k over the weekend in San Diego. That's your annual budget best case. You don't know me and you don't know what I do. I've done many things in my life. More than most 70 year olds. You don't know me. Yet judge. You're not the smartest person in the room and that is becoming clearer with every comment.

GNL says

My 27 year old daughter and husband are worth more than you. LOL

Nice typical poser pivot btw. From 2,200 to 4,400. LMAO

you two gonna compare penis sizes next? whip em out boys!!!

seriously wtf with this snobbish shit of house size. none of that matters before god.

FortwayeAsFuckJoeBiden says

GNL says

My 27 year old daughter and husband are worth more than you. LOL

Nice typical poser pivot btw. From 2,200 to 4,400. LMAO

you two gonna compare penis sizes next? whip em out boys!!!

seriously wtf with this snobbish shit of house size. none of that matters before god.

You are correct. I've had a great day giving wookie the business though. I'd bet he has a 2 incher. I'd be mad too if I had to use tweezers to jack off. Wookie is a braggert. I've never bragged about anything on pat.net. Possessions mean almost nothing to me.

FortwayeAsFuckJoeBiden says

GNL says

My 27 year old daughter and husband are worth more than you. LOL

Nice typical poser pivot btw. From 2,200 to 4,400. LMAO

you two gonna compare penis sizes next? whip em out boys!!!

seriously wtf with this snobbish shit of house size. none of that matters before god.

Haha. I grew up in a fucking mansion just about. It's like living in a museum. If your house is worth money and it's an investment, fine whatever, but it's not more comfortable or better living in a large place.

You kind of have to own a large place when you have winter, because of cabin fever, but I would never want to live in my childhood home again. It was a beautiful home with a ton of upkeep. The simpler the life, the better.

The bigger it is, the more you have to worry about, the more you have to repair. Even heating and cooling is a problem, because of differential expansion rates which I bet most people are ignorant about. It pulls out nails over time. My father had a building supply business, our house was put together with screws, not nails.

That house will last for at least another 100 years, but man, there's still upkeep. It's not like it just degrades, you repair or else.

The house I grew up in was "space age" too. In the foyer, there was a button for EVERY LIGHT in the house, controlled by relay. Super advanced for 1960. Don't make the mistake of integrating "new technology" in your home. Can't even buy parts to replace it.

richwicks says

The simpler the life, the better.

Amen

@Patrick, I edited at 102. Is that better? I feel handcuffed. Wookieman is hurting my feelings. :)

WookieMan says

You just shot yourself in your own foot. It takes 20 minutes to do all of that.

Haha, as if I didn't already know you don't know what you're talking about. You funny guy, I like you.

GNL says

richwicks says

The simpler the life, the better.

Amen

People that want large homes, and don't have one, don't know what they are getting into. Just vacuuming it sucks. There were rooms we were basically forbidden to go into, because my parents didn't want to have to maintain it. In the living room, which was different from the family room, we had picture windows, like 12 feet by 5 feet. Impossible to replace now. Great view. Very expensive to heat in the winter, and blindingly hot in the summer. God forbid they ever break, you can't get that size glass anymore.

It's a white elephant. My father ran a business, he HAD to look successful, that's the price he paid. Nothing cozy or comfortable about it.

Beautiful home though. I feel sorry for the poor bastards that own it now. They sold it to their best friends that always liked it. Those poor devils.

I can't tell you how many huge homes I've gone into that were either 1. Falling apart or 2. Had the original green carpet. In amazing old $$ neighborhoods. People love to put on airs. Both of my mother inlaws own big homes and I guarantee we will be watching those homes crumble all around them.

I have a Realtor friend in Florida. He's not very successful. You know why? Because he's like you, no one is as smart as him and he just can't keep his insecurities from fucking up business deals. He readily admits this.

GNL says

I can't tell you how many huge homes I've gone into that were either 1. Falling apart or 2. Had the original green carpet. People love to put on airs. Both of my mother inlaws own big homes and I guarantee we will be watching those homes crumble all around them.

I almost think Eichler homes are the best option.

You kind of have outside inside, you heat it and illuminate it, and I think rooms should be small and minimal.

You want to be out of the elements, but you still want to be within nature.

Given unlimited money, I'd build a structure that simply is mostly glass, and within it grass and flowers and maybe shrubs, and some small bedrooms. The trick would be to minimize maintenance, heating and cooling. You want space, but carpet everywhere sucks, and hard floors are hard, uncomfortable.

Indoor garden? I know people with Eichler homes. You have to deal with bugs, but you don't need to clean the indoor garden. The majority of space should be that indoor garden. I'd put the kitchen and family/living room right in the indoor garden, and just have minimal space for the bedrooms. I'd go further than Eichler did.

But then... You need to keep the goddamned plants alive... I don't know how practical it is.

Sounds interesting. Never heard of it although I have seen some pretty cool indoor/outdoor spaces.

GNL says

I have a Realtor friend in Florida. He's not very successful. You know why? Because he's like you, no one is as smart as him and he just can't keep his insecurities from fucking up business deals. He readily admits this.

I'm going to give your friend some advice.

Drop your ego.

I'm an engineer, I have learned almost everything I know by being wrong, and listening to somebody explain "this is why you're wrong". Ego is programmed into us, to make us fail.

Sometimes I'm NOT wrong, and somebody is still explaining why they think I'm wrong, I learn from that as well. They aren't stupid for making a mistake, they are just making a mistake, and if THEY have an ego, well, I can't teach them a thing. Accept your error as soon as possible.

I know stubborn stupid people, who will never accept they have made a mistake. I'd say 90% of people are like this.

GNL says

Sounds interesting. Never heard of it although I have seen some pretty cool indoor/outdoor spaces.

Are you talking about Eichler homes?

Basically there's an indoor area of garden, it's very pleasant, but there's bugs and so on because of it. They are usually pretty minimalistic homes. I've seen a few. They only seem to exist in California, but they can be anywhere.

There's an indoor space where plants grow. I very much like them, and I don't see why this cannot be extended to wider areas. It's nice to be "outside" when you're inside.

I can't find any decent pictures or examples of them, but they are, for me, comfortable. I don't know what the upkeep is. Basically a roof and walls are extended over dirt.

All people really want is warmth and a comfortable place to rest, and if summer could be year round, people would prefer it. That's kind of an Eichler home. They have a little small patch of a bunch of flora growing, and it doesn't matter what grows where. It's just comfortable.

Still, you need light and water, and you have to keep the plants alive. I've only been in one, I don't know what the upkeep is. It might be tremendous.

We took photos of a home years ago that had a very Asian influence. The center of the home opened above and the walls slid open as well. A large garden space was the focus. You could actually bring the outside in. Not my cup of tea. It was actually a rental for many years. I assume because it was too unique? I forget how the roof worked.

WookieMan says

We just spent $35k over the weekend in San Diego.

Yet you're still wishing on a star to afford that 2,200 square foot home. Try clicking your heels 3 times, that might work.

GNL says

Patrick, I edited at 102. Is that better? I feel handcuffed. Wookieman is hurting my feelings. :)

@GNL it's still pretty personal, but OK.

richwicks says

Don't make the mistake of integrating "new technology" in your home. Can't even buy parts to replace it.

Yes. I have witnessed this also. Not sure if true but (I assumed it wasn't high tech) a homeowner had a huge chandelier that you could flick a switch and it would come down to the floor (from 3 stories up) so you could change the light bulbs. He was having a hell of a time getting someone to even come out and look at fixing it.

Patrick says

GNL says

Patrick, I edited at 102. Is that better? I feel handcuffed. Wookieman is hurting my feelings. :)

GNL it's still pretty personal, but OK.

I'll do better in the future. I got a bit carried away. Thanks.

GNL says

We took photos of a home years ago that had a very Asian influence. The center of the home opened above and the walls slid open as well. A large garden space was the focus. You could actually bring the outside in. Not my cup of tea. It was actually a rental for many years. I assume because it was too unique? I forget how the roof worked.

Architecture used to be an interest of mine, but that was extinguished when I went to the University @ Buffalo. That's a top architecture school. I knew a guy that literally lived in his office, because when he was awake, he worked, and to even qualify for architecture there, you had to have a 4.0 GPA, and that didn't guarantee anything.

Electrical engineering is a lot easier. I don't think I'm creative enough to be an architect, and it's such a small field. My sister and parents had the same identical house, because my sister simply copied the plans of my parent's SECOND home. They were nice homes, but so weird to drive 300 miles away to end up in a duplicate. This is done all the time.

I have a complaint with building codes. There's people mixing concrete with styrofoam. This is a fragile building material, that is well insulated, and easily made stronger with resin sheets on it. It's mostly illegal in most areas, but it can drastically reduce home costs. My father sold building materials, and I'm aghast at how shitty buildings are made today. They are tinder boxes.

Our technology has progressed so much, but our government puts the brakes on everything, keeping us into the dark ages. 2x4s are obsolete in my opinion. You can just pour out a home now.

Government...don't get me started. As for intelligence, creativity, common sense etc, I wish I had the perfect mix of each. EE easy? I was a computer programmer for a few years. One day I woke up and said I ain't doing this for the next 30 years. One of my better decisions. I love being around people.

GNL says

Government...don't get me started. As for intelligence, creativity, common sense etc, I wish I had the perfect mix of each. EE easy? I was a computer programmer for a few years. One day I woke up and said I ain't doing this for the next 30 years. One of my better decisions. I love being around people.

I'm basically a coder now.

I'm working to connect the world. I still stubbornly believe that if you all just TALK to one another, you will end conflict.

If I have a religion, it's that.

Just talk.

We are on the most powerful communication network the world has ever seen, the envy of every civilization before us. I can TRIVIALLY store more books than you can read in your entire lifetime on a $10 USB stick. It won't function after 10 years though, NAND memory degrades.

We're in a weird area.

People don't appreciate where we are. This is a remarkable time. We're going to strip the control of history from the people who controlled it before. You have the computing power to make a nuclear simulation, so does everybody everywhere. We have given power to everybody.

In 2000 years, the people living in 4000 AD will be able to see us, how we lived, what life was like, This is like seeing Ancient Rome today.

IF we can preserve the information. That's the last step. You find me a device that can store information for 2,000 years, I'll make you rich and I'm not kidding. I've looked into "5D optical storage". If we can preserve information, it's a huge game changer. It will change our species. It will fundamentally modify us, because any asshole will be able to record history, it won't be top down anymore. We will be able to see if it's getting better or worse. You have no idea how much a terrabyte is. That's an enormous amount of information, and it costs nothing really.

You coded, do the calculation. That's a trillion characters. Let's say you can read 100 characters a second - an astounding speed, how long before you go through it all? 1,000,000,000,000 / 100 = 10000000 seconds /365 x 24 x 60 x 60 - that's 317 years.

This really is a new time.

People honestly have no appreciation for the power they have, the access to information they have. This is currently a pinnacle, and I wonder if we'll go higher. It's nuts. I can seriously do nuclear bomb simulation on my PHONE now. I can do this, that's nuts.

I know people cannot utilize this technology mostly, but some can. I can't entirely use this technology and I'm trained to do it, but somebody can.

They will not be able to withhold information anymore. Most people will make no use of it, but I know there are people that will.

richwicks says

People honestly have no appreciation for the power they have, the access to information they have.

The critical factor is being able to understand and learn (via listening, watching, or reading) the information.

Plus even if the masses have the aptitude, they need the attention span and motivation to learn and apply the information.

We can put all the tools out there, but that does not mean they can be effectively used.

.

ad says

The critical factor is being able to understand and learn (via listening, watching, or reading) the information.

Plus even if the masses have the aptitude, they need the attention span and motivation to learn and apply the information.

We can put all the tools out there, but that does not mean they can be effectively used.

Look, I'm a moron genius, and I mean literally I am.

I know there are smarter people than me, I know there will be people who will make use of the information. We are making a meritocracy, like it or not.

We're all tired of rules by idiots and aristocracy. There will be people that make proper use of the tools. Pandora's box has been opened. If we had competent moral leaders, we wouldn't have done this.

We've TRIED to play nice, we have apparently MORONS in charge - at least they pretend to be morons, we'll expose them as liars or we'll displace them with competent people. Either way, we're going to get rid of them.

Not everybody can absorb the knowledge, but some can. I don't think I'm smart enough but others are. I'm just making the tools to help them.

Want to torture yourself? Why can't every generation simply learn from and follow the advice of the generation ahead of them?

Patrick says

GNL says

Patrick, I edited at 102. Is that better? I feel handcuffed. Wookieman is hurting my feelings. :)

GNL it's still pretty personal, but OK.

Patrick, it's fine. At the end of the day I know what I'm talking about. If people cannot read that's on them. I've never stated I was building a mansion. I stated the square footage that would be taxed by the government and if I were to list it after building what would be the OFFICIAL MLS square footage for appraisal purposes. 90% of brokers don't understand the rules and 100% of real estate photographers know nothing about the MLS or what is required AND know nothing about real estate. They get hired by moron agents that can't figure out a camera and how to use a website, so there's that. Basically it's a very low bar to clear that a high school drop out can do. So I don't feel bad for being smarter.

I've also stated that I'm in no rush. It's not about money. It's not about size of the home. I'm not sure how this got derailed by GNL besides pure jealously. No other way to explain it. I have an ego, but I know what I know and what I'm worth. I'm fine with people not accepting their weaknesses. I witness it daily. It's fine. If one wants to criticize others on something they know nothing about that's on them. Talking to "3 agents" is proof said no honest person ever. I had to laugh at that. I ain't losing sleep over it. But I'll call out bull shit when I see it.

FortwayeAsFuckJoeBiden says

seriously wtf with this snobbish shit of house size. none of that matters before god.

Exactly. I gave the real, official square footage. 2,200 is nothing. GNL doesn't understand above grade and below grade. Maybe they don't have basements where he lives. I wasn't bragging. I was being honest with the size of home I'm building. Take condos out of the mix and 90% of people live in a 1,600-2,200 square foot homes ABOVE GRADE. I ain't pushing anything I've been accused of.

I have no incentive to lie. Being attacked over and over though by a liar that literally knows nothing about real estate I fight back. I can take a picture of a dog and claim to know about it, but that doesn't mean I'm a breeder or know how to breed dogs. That's what we got here. We've got a real estate expert that walks through homes he knows nothing about.

For fucks sake the guy photographs homes for a living and doesn't know Eichler from Rich's comment??? Jesus Christ that disqualifies you out of the gate. I have a $2k accent Eichler sided wall around my fireplace. In IL of all places. I bought and installed it.

Also, the 80's want the term poser back. Use it correctly or don't use it at all. Enjoy your night or day or whatever. Your criticism of me has no basis in reality and you're showing a bad look. Doesn't move me, just giving a heads up.

WookieMan says

You either play the game or complain about the game

Don't you believe America is worth saving?

You literally insulted everyone in 2 entire industries. There's the Wookster for ya. His greatness is really something to behold.

WookieMan says

about the MLS or

So tiring. There is NO "the MLS". Professionals stay in their lane instead of trying to be a jack of all trades. Real estate photography, while it doesn't take a genius, is a business. Running a business, any business, is the key. But you wouldn't know that since you aren't smart enough, not gonna lie, to run your own business.

And btw, brokers are like teachers...Those who can, do. Those who can't, teach.

Those who can, SELL RE. Those who can't, become brokers.

GNL says

I just confirmed with 3 of my agents that total square footage is adjustable on our MLS.

I noticed that Zillow listings in Virginia do include total finished sqft, to include below grade finished area.

GNL says

Both of my mother inlaws

You have 2 mothers-in-law? That circumstance is a comedian's dream. And speaking of big homes falling apart, a friend of mine made a living repairing rot damage to 2-year-old homes in an upscale neighborhood. This neighborhood had lots of equity locusts from NY and CT, as indicated by the signs the builder put up in front of each home as it was being built. Apparently, these homes were built faster than the county inspector could look at them since many of the homes my friend repaired were missing code items like flashing. He replaced plenty of doors and windows that were rotted down through the 2x6 framing.

HeadSet says

GNL says

I just confirmed with 3 of my agents that total square footage is adjustable on our MLS.

I noticed that Zillow listings in Virginia do include total finished sqft, to include below grade finished area.

So, to give my final professional thought on this square footage disagreement...My local MLS (I won't say which one it is) automatically enters the tax recorded square footage which does not, in almost all cases, include the basement (both myself and wookie were/are wrong. I'll make a bet that only 1 of us will fess up though). Our MLS does allow the Realtor to adjust total square feet. And why not, people add on to their homes and finish their basements all the time. An agent would be an idiot imo if they did not list the TOTAL square footage of the home. Well, tax recording is done from the outside of the home. The Realtor has actual access to the home and therefore has more information (people can say whatever they want but the Realtor has more information than a drive-by dingbat does). The tax recorder does not know if the basement is finished or not so it is excluded. The Realtor can AND SHOULD adjust the total square footage if the basement is in fact finished. I'm guessing here but, in the history of my company, I'd say 90% of homes have finished basements. Think about this...your home and another home down the street are identical except for the basement. Yours is finished but both your agent and the agent for the home down the street list at the same total square feet of 1800. With the search capabilities being what they are, your home will come up side by side with the home down the street that has an unfinished basement listed at $75,000 less than your home. Now, as the seller, would you want that? Or would you want the type of Realtors we work with (you know, professional and informed) or an agent that won't use everything to their and your advantage when trying to get the max price for your home? As I said before, total square footage is a grey area and some people are more savvy that others OR it may be because of their local MLS(?).

HeadSet says

GNL says

Both of my mother inlaws

You have 2 mothers-in-law? That circumstance is a comedian's dream. And speaking of big homes falling apart, a friend of mine made a living repairing rot damage to 2-year-old homes in an upscale neighborhood. This neighborhood had lots of equity locusts from NY and CT, as indicated by the signs the builder put up in front of each home as it was being built. Apparently, these homes were built faster than the county inspector could look at them since many of the homes my friend repaired were missing code items like flashing. He replaced plenty of doors and windows that were rotted down through the 2x6 framing.

Yep, my wife's parents divorced when she was 9 and her father got remarried. Get this, she's closer to her step mother than her own mother.

2-year old homes with wood rot? No builder's warranty? I have a flipper friend we do a bit of work for. He is about 55 I'd say. Still lives in the neighborhood he grew up in. ALL of his work comes from that neighborhood. He flips enough homes to certainly made his millions.

GNL says

Yep, my wife's parents divorced when she was 9 and her father got remarried. Get this, she's closer to her step mother than her own mother.

Good to see a relationship work out.

richwicks says

GNL says

Yep, my wife's parents divorced when she was 9 and her father got remarried. Get this, she's closer to her step mother than her own mother.

Good to see a relationship work out.

Her mother is a liberal loon and has been married 3 times. She's working on #4 now. We haven't been down to visit her since the beggining of the plandemic. She worships her TV. Her step mother is a NY City Italian. Boy howdy is she a no bullshit kind of woman. I LOVE that woman.

I don’t know the practice elsewhere, but to be considered “living space” and included in the house square footage, the basement must have egress (minimum door and window sizes, or a ladder if there’s no 2nd door for the attic unit) for fire escape.

Basement, finished or unfinished, can be mentioned in the ad, but shouldn’t be included in the living square footage if it doesn’t meet the “living space” requirements. Otherwise, one is open his/herself up for liability. This is my understanding for CA real estate.

Eman says

I don’t know the practice elsewhere, but to be considered “living space” and included in the house square footage, the basement must have egress (minimum door and window sizes, or a ladder if there’s no 2nd door for the attic unit) for fire escape.

Basement, finished or unfinished, can be mentioned in the ad, but shouldn’t be included in the living square footage if it doesn’t meet the “living space” requirements. Otherwise, one is open his/herself up for liability. This is my understanding for CA real estate.

In our area, egress is for bedroom legality. But, I got to tell you, this is a grey area also depending on grandfather clauses and county and/or city ordinance.

@Wookieman,

The practice is different for different markets. I know agents/brokers didn’t use professional photographers for short sales, REOs and lower end housing.

For MY market, most people hire professional photographers for also professional stagers for their listings. For my flips, both are a must. Professional photographer costs $300-$400 including “twightlight shots”. Staging costs anywhere between $2.5-$5k depending on the size of the house. We also pay for all inspections upfront including house, termites and roof. This helps buyers putting in offers without contingencies.