patrick.net

The only time they are granted the dignity of 'due process' is when they are so dangerous they must be imprisoned for life and they aren't just dropped off in their point of origin.

Ceffer says

The only time they are granted the dignity of 'due process' is when they are so dangerous they must be imprisoned for life and they aren't just dropped off in their point of origin.

This thread and due process, christ. Not you Ceffer. He wasn't in the country legally and not a citizen. Due process is not necessary.

The one cat can cite law, but it doesn't matter. There are other laws that allow Trump to do what he did. Move on. Anyone upset by this should be deported to Antartica. Get over it. He was a wife beating gang banger. Due process my ass as a big time tax payer. Get him out 5 years ago.

DeficitHawk says

a matter of immigration laws.

Why do you want foreign gang members that entered illegally in the United States?

DeficitHawk says

Thats just the result of an election.

I'm curious. Are you vaxxed?

DeficitHawk says

I am a leftist on this forum

And it is appreciated.

We usually scare your kind away.

Nobody's defending "Maryland Man" anymore.

Due process:
"Abrego Garcia already had a hearing at which the judge found evidence that he was an MS-13 member. It was not only based on his being arrested with MS-13 gang members and wearing clothing associated with the gang. It was also based on a confidential source connected to the gang. After losing at his hearing, Abrego Garcia then lost on appeal."

Gang Member:
“Per the Prince Georges County Police Gang Unit, ABREGO-Garcia was validated as a member of the Mara Salvatrucha (MS13) Gang. Subject was identified as a member of the Mara Salvatrucha MS-13, “Chequeo” from the Western Clique a transnational criminal street gang. This information was provided by tested source who has provided truthful accurate information in the past. See Prince Georges County Police Department (Gang Sheet).”

Human trafficer:
“On Dec. 1, 2022, Abrego Garcia was stopped by the Tennessee Highway Patrol for speeding. Upon approach to the vehicle, the encountering officer noted eight other individuals in the vehicle. There was no luggage in the vehicle, leading the encountering officer to suspect this was a human trafficking incident. Additionally, all the passengers gave the same home address as the subject’s home address. During the interview, Abrego Garcia pretended to speak less English than he was capable of and attempted to put the encountering officer off-track by responding to questions with questions. When asked what relationship he had with the registered owner of the vehicle, Abrego Garcia replied that the owner of the vehicle is his boss, and that he worked in construction…

The encountering officer decided not to cite the subject for driving infractions but gave him a warning citation for driving with an expired driver’s license. Abrego Garcia’s driver’s license was a MD “Limited Term Temporary” license. The encountering officer gathered names of other occupants in the vehicle but could not read their handwriting. The officer did not pursue further information due to no citation being issued.”

https://jonathanturley.org/2025/04/24/npr-abrego-garcia-was-living-quietly-in-maryland-before-he-was-deported/

https://x.com/amuse/status/1915442214051684588

It just gets better as left pushed it's Idiocracy.

I think Trump may be lighting up the corrupt judiciary on purpose like a christmas tree on a pinball machine for future actions.

He can trace their comms and orders to look up their hierarchies to the real bosses. So, many provocations for these captured judges to rat themselves out? Hmmmm. One would hopium.

Finally, an arrest, however paltry. Don't stroke out fans.

https://www.coffeeandcovid.com/p/it-begins-saturday-april-26-2025

Speaking of removed judges, remember New Mexico Judge Juan “Joel” Cano, who let a 23-year-old Tren de Aragua gang member live for free in his guest house? The FBI arrested him yesterday, too, along with his wife, ‘Nancy.’ You won’t believe what they charged the now-former judge with.

In March, HSI (Homeland Security Investigations) arrested Venezuelan illegal alien and guesthouse resident Cristhian Ortega-Lopez, who is suspected of being in Tren de Aragua — a notorious, ultra-violent criminal gang that’s basically the Venezuelan version of MS-13. They nabbed him at Judge Cano’s home, where the family had both put him up and given him assault weapons to play with.

When FBI arrested him, they found Ortega had multiple cellphones. Afterwards, agents realized that one phone was missing. They realized this after Ortega told them. (They’d offered to let him make a phone call and gave him the phones they’d seized; Ortega said the one he wanted to use wasn’t there.) So this week, they returned to the Cano household with a new search warrant.

I promise I am not making this next part up.

During his FBI interview, former judge Cano —after being Mirandized— straight-up confessed that he’d found Ortega’s missing cellphone, smashed it with a hammer, and threw it in a city dumpster. Cano explained he did it because he knew it had pictures and videos of Ortega with guns— which were direct evidence of federal gun crimes and gang activity.

Cano’s confession is such an unlikely and improbable fact that you should see the allegation for yourself:

7. Specifically, Jose Cano stated that he destroyed the cellphone and further admitted that he
believed the cellphone contained photos or videos that would reflect negatively on
Ortega. Through further questioning, agents ascertained that Jose Cano destroyed the
cellphone believing that it contained photographs of Ortega holding firearms that Ortega
had uploaded onto social media platforms which would be additional incriminating
evidence against him.

It’s hard to reckon how a long-time judge would agree to talk to FBI agents at all, much less after getting his Miranda warnings and without a lawyer. Regular readers will recall that, when I first reported this story, I suggested Judge Cano should have already retained a good criminal defense lawyer. All I can say now is, he should’ve read C&C.

Cano didn’t just smash a phone; he smashed his oath, his robes, and his integrity. Yesterday, in the harsh morning light of the bright Las Cruces sun, FBI agents arrested Cano and charged him with destroying evidence to protect a defendant (18 USC §1512). The charge allows up to 20 years in prison. As a first-time offender, he’d probably only get 12-24 months, but the sentencing guidelines require enhancement for cartel involvement.

Cano is in deep doo-doo. Regardless of whatever happens in the criminal case, he admitted destroying evidence of crimes— a violation of ethics that virtually requires disbarment. New Mexico’s Supremes already barred him from ever again serving as a judge, so his law license is almost certainly a goner.

Here’s a link to the federal complaint against former Judge Cano.

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/9gj8n9ie7jwgo4q7gfwqm/Doc.-01-USA-v.-Cano-Complaint.pdf?rlkey=ufcqz8pnlh607vh4i79z8rchv&e=1&dl=0

Was it a gay thing?

RWSGFY says

Was it a gay thing?

I think MS-13 with all of the thuggery and Satanism is full of gay stuff. In Latin America, it is alleged culturally that you aren't considered gay as long as you always assume the dominant sexual position with passive homosexual/tranny partners. I would imagine in prison hierarchies, it is a similar ethic.

There's also the 'Soros Qualification' for the judge: the weakest, the weirdest, the most absurdly corrupted, the most morally culpable, the craziest, the most perverted etc. etc.

Allegedly, the FBI hired MS-13 to murder Seth Rich and then murdered the assassins. They are a ready and available gangster mercenary group.

There is still an MS-13 group in Santa Cruz living behind one of my friend's house. They get raided periodically, but they are still there I heard. How and why, I have no idea, except that it smacks of some kind of official 'protection'.

https://nypost.com/2025/04/30/us-news/kilmar-abrego-garcia-bragged-he-could-kill-his-wife-and-get-away-with-it-court-docs/

Kilmar Abrego Garcia bragged he could kill his wife and get away with it, she claimed in newly unearthed protective order request

Alleged MS-13 member Kilmar Abrego Garcia once boasted he could kill his wife and “no one could do anything to him,” according to a request for a motion for a protective order she filed in 2020.

“I also have a [recording] that [he] told my ex-mother-in-law that even if he kills me no one can do anything to him,” Jennifer Vasquez Sura, wrote in the document she filed with the District Court of Maryland for Prince George’s County on Aug. 3, 2020. ...

Ceffer says

I think MS-13 with all of the thuggery and Satanism is full of gay stuff. In Latin America, it is alleged cultrually that you aren't considered gay as long as you always assume the dominant sexual position with passive homosexual/tranny partners. I would imagine in prison hierarchies, it is a similar ethic.

Ancient Med viewpoint, btw. You can be the Legate if you are the pitcher, but not the catcher, that's a scandal.

DeficitHawk says

I participate here as the lonely moderate voice, in an experiment to see whether it is possible to bridge gaps. But I get discouraged

Looks like we lost @DeficitHawk

I wonder, Do we lose leftist posters because of cognitive dissonance?

His Knuckle tats are 110% MS-13, too. But libbies never let a preponderance of evidence get in the way of siding with the undesirable alien or criminal.

Onvacation says

DeficitHawk says

I participate here as the lonely moderate voice, in an experiment to see whether it is possible to bridge gaps. But I get discouraged

Looks like we lost DeficitHawk

I wonder, Do we lose leftist posters because of cognitive dissonance?

How do we know that posters such as these aren't "AI" bots? I think they're testing the bots out on various websites to calibrate them and make their responses seem more plausibly human authentic. Look at the breaking scandal over on Reddit, where certain subreddits were used to test "AI" chatbots.

I apply quotes to signify that I think it's a scam.

AmericanKulak says

His Knuckle tats are 110% MS-13, too. But libbies never let a preponderance of evidence get in the way of siding with the undesirable alien or criminal.

Honestly they just might be too dumb? Or brainwashed? I mean you're in a gang if most of your body is tattooed outside of some athletes. And they're probably still in a gang. I can't remember stories, but I believe a few pro athletes have been implicated in gang activity.

Onvacation says

wonder, Do we lose leftist posters because of cognitive dissonance?

It's happened here for a while, you know this. They come in and cannot defend their position. I swear, but outside that I try to tell the facts I know and see. Once they're caught with their pants down they leave. No accountably. I've been wrong here and have owned it. Either way it's just a website. Not losing sleep over it.

Left and right like their echo chambers. I don't think EV's are good. I do think renewable power (solar & wind) can be supplemental power, not primary but I don't want to pay for it. Let homeowners do it.

We lost the likes of Dan, Iwog, Nuttboxer over stupid shit. They were wrong on their ideas and left the site. They did have some good thoughts though. I don't get why you'd tuck and run. If you don't like the user, ignore is there. I have plenty...

Onvacation says

I wonder, Do we lose leftist posters because of cognitive dissonance?

No. You lose us because there is not much productive discourse that keeps us participating.

The topic of concern here is whether this person should get due process before being deported/incarcerated.

But no one really wants to talk about this subject. People just throw memes, and make fun of lefties. IF the topic wanders anywhere close to due process, it becomes some shitshow of whataboutisms where you say "whatabout this totally unrelated person/case I like that I dont think was treated fairly in the past", as if some historical occurrence of failure of due process is a good rationale to advocate for depriving others of due process in the future.

If you cant acknowledge that due process is warranted for people you dont like as well as people you like, then there just isn't much productive discussion to have with you. I may as well be talking to a rock, and there is nothing satisfying about the experience for me. That's why you lose our participation.

But if it makes you feel better, you can pretend I have to go hide in my basement due to my cognitive dissonance.

DeficitHawk says

If you cant acknowledge that due process is warranted for people you dont like as well as people you like

I think people here do - for Americans. It's not like we're killing them, just sending them back.

Maga_Chaos_Monkey says

DeficitHawk says
If you cant acknowledge that due process is warranted for people you dont like as well as people you like

I think people here do - for Americans. It's not like we're killing them, just sending them back.

Bingo. You're not a citizen. What do other countries do? Let us know Deficit which country allows you to stay there indefinitely or for many years illegally. I'll wait. This is the point.

Why do we have to give someone here illegally due process? He didn't follow the damn process.... Until you answer that it's hard to have a conversation on the topic. It's law. He didn't follow the process.

If I didn't follow gun laws and shot someone on my property, what happens? I don't get due process. I go to jail for having an illegal firearm. This isn't all that complicated. You follow law or you get booted or go to jail. Not much to it.

Maga_Chaos_Monkey says

DeficitHawk says

If you cant acknowledge that due process is warranted for people you dont like as well as people you like

I think people here do - for Americans. It's not like we're killing them, just sending them back.

Agreed. Although this is exactly what is heavily contested by liberals. There is a case that habeas corpus etc. remains intact as even for non-citizens, even enemy combatants, as ruled by SCOTUS. This is not as clear cut as it may seem to either side. However habeas corpus can be voided in case of an "invasion or rebellion" when public safety requires it. Given how many illegals have been pouring over the border every year, esp. during the xiden administration, invasion is a totally plausible scenario here and allows for deportations without due process. The border crisis has been setting for an invasion for many years now, like some European countries have been facing similar issues.

mell says

Although this is exactly what is heavily contested by liberals

Yes, it is what is contested.

I don't know about other countries. I know what USA does, what the courts have ruled on the topic, and I know what I PERSONALLY think should be the case as my opinion.

USA has long had due process for non-citizens, and I want it to stay that way. The courts have ruled this way, supreme court justices have explicitly said it. I referenced the cases above, not that anyone here would bother to read them.

I do understand the people who are in the process of arriving, or at the border are NOT granted due process, they may be turned away and not granted entry without process and that's fine with me too. There will naturally be a fuzzy line between the category of 'arriving' vs 'already here'.... and the courts will have to maintain that line in some way.

You may ask "Why does this stupid lefty think non-citizens should get due process?"... To me its simple, I dont trust the government sometimes. I dont want government to start using its power to 'disappear' political enemies.

If we normalize the procedure of deporting and irretrievably incarcerating people abroad without due process, there seems little to stop an administration I don't trust from 'disappearing' their enemies (citizens and all) and then saying "oops, our bad, well nothing can be done about it now".

I want due process so that when they come for me, at least there is a judge who will hear my case instead of direct shipment to the gulag with no hearing.

You may also ask: "What does this stupid lefty think is reasonable due process for immigration cases?"... To me, its pretty simple. A fact check on citizenship and immigration status in the presence of a judge, where a person has the opportunity to say to a judge "Hey, IM actually a citizen" or "Hey, I actually have legal immigration status". The judge reviews those facts and if the person does not have citizenship or legal immigration status, they rule with a deportation order.

One of the things the judges should watch out for is whether people are being selectively targeted for enforcement due to "something they said that the administration didn't like". That would violate our 1st amendment, even if it is an illegal immigrant.

DeficitHawk says

I want due process so that when they come for me, at least there is a judge who will hear my case instead of direct shipment to the gulag with no hearing.

Yeah but that's hyperbole though. They aren't shipped to Gulags, not even imprisoned (temporarily held), they are just sent home. If the border was secure and agent could keep it tight by almost any means necessary, then the few remaining illegals could get their due process and time to hear their cases. Not during and invasion though. This has been the tactic of the left for a while now, not just in the US, to flood the country with illegals and make everyone depend on them to secure future elections by any means necessary. People had enough and as long as this is an emergency, emergency powers will hold.

DeficitHawk says

everyone here is so extreme right.

Being anti-woke, anti-DEI, and keeping our own money is 'so extreme right'.

mell says

They aren't shipped to Gulags, not even imprisoned (temporarily held), they are just sent home

This guy was imprisoned. The people he was deported with were imprisoned. They are in a prison in El Salvador.

Its not hyperbole. It happened, in this very case that we are discussing here. "Maryland man"

DeficitHawk says

This guy was imprisoned.

By El Salvador, not us. Just because ES no longer fucks around with THEIR criminals anymore doesn't translate into the US government imprisoning them.

Reality can be such a bitch, sometimes.

MolotovCocktail says

Being anti-woke, anti-DEI, and keeping our own money is 'so extreme right'.

Im anti woke and anti dei.

As for keeping your own money... well, my user name is deficit hawk.... I think we need to balance our taxes against our expenditures to be fiscally responsible.. so we cant keep all of our own money without running up the deficit, which I oppose.

DeficitHawk says

The topic of concern here is whether this person should get due process before being deported/incarcerated.

Mr Hawk,

Do you believe that the "Maryland Man" did not receive due process?

It is my understanding that a court had already determined that he was an illegal alien.

yawaraf says

Do you believe that the "Maryland Man" did not receive due process?

I think he did not receive due process. As I understand, he was rounded up and deported without a deportation order from a judge.

I just want people to get a chance to stand in front of a judge and get a judges order before the administration carries out a deportation/incarceration. And the administration should follow the judges order.

MolotovCocktail says

By El Salvador, not us. Just because ES no longer fucks around with THEIR criminals anymore doesn't translate into the US government imprisoning them.

Oh come on. This is a BS argument. WE are in a contract with el salvador where we pay them to incarcerate the people we bring them. Are you seriously going to act like the us administration didnt want the people we brought them incarcerated and intentionally arrange for that outcome?