patrick.net

Reality says

Words convey meanings and reflect the knowledge and capacity of the person who put those words together.

Indeed, and this is an online forum where the general intent of what a person means doesn't need to be parsed in the manner that you seem intent on doing. You play silly little word games while seeming to be oblivious to the fact that much of what you're arguing is simply wrong.

Reality says

It makes a huge difference: "second class citizens" in the context of Kuwait means #2 ranking in a system that has 4-5 different ranks on the power pyramid. Western "expats" have been the technocrats running those societies on behalf of the ruling elite for a century now.

Oh, give me strength.
Reality says

And what was the topic of the paper? Apparently not the status of foreigners in Kuwait.

It's hard not to touch upon the unusual demographics and the political/economic ramifications of "foreigners" in Kuwait. "Foreigners" make up for the vast majority of the population in that country.

I'm not sure what relevance that response has to what I said. What exactly do you think your remark demonstrates and what was your paper on?

corntrollio says

Reality says

I did a research paper on that country just before Saddam Hussein invaded it.

Are you sure it wasn't a book report? Did you have to stand up in front of the class?

No. It was a term paper. I had to go through more than a dozen books to write the paper.

Reality says

corntrollio says

Reality says

I did a research paper on that country just before Saddam Hussein invaded it.

Are you sure it wasn't a book report? Did you have to stand up in front of the class?

No. It was a term paper. I had to go through more than a dozen books to write the paper.

A term paper. A dozen books. What was it on?

Bigsby says

Reality says

Words convey meanings and reflect the knowledge and capacity of the person who put those words together.

Indeed, and this is an online forum where the general intent of what a person means doesn't need to be parsed in the manner that you seem intent on doing. You play silly little word games while seeming to be oblivious to the fact that much of what you're arguing is simply wrong.

I use precise words to convey precise meanings. I do not use phrases like "2nd class citizen" to mislead people, who general do not know #2 is a high ranking in a society that has 4-5 different ranks on the pyramid.

Bigsby says

And what was the topic of the paper? Apparently not the status of foreigners in Kuwait.

It's hard not to touch upon the unusual demographics and the political/economic ramifications of "foreigners" in Kuwait. "Foreigners" make up for the vast majority of the population in that country.

I'm not sure what relevance that response has to what I said. What exactly do you think your remark demonstrates and what was your paper on?

The paper was on Kuwait. Writing a paper on Kuwait naturally had to cover its unusual demographics of 2/3 - 3/4 of the population being foreigners.

The class was on society, culture and religions of the Middle East. Each student was allowed to pick a different country and write the term paper on that country. I happened to have picked Kuwait (because someone had beat me to claiming Israel), a few months before Kuwait was invaded and became headline news day and night every day!

BTW, if you want to know what _debating_ politics would be like among real life friends, take a look at the "dislikes" dished out around here.

Reality says

The paper was on Kuwait. Writing a paper on Kuwait naturally had to cover its unusual demographics of 2/3 - 3/4 of the population are foreigners.

The class was on society, culture and religions of the Middle East. Each student was allowed to pick a country and write the term paper on the country. I happened to have picked Kuwait, a few months before it was invaded!

Hmmm, naturally...

And the demographics aren't especially unusual for the Gulf. Only 17% of the population are locals in the UAE for example.

Reality says

BTW, if you want to know what _debating_ politics would be like among real life friends, take a look at the "dislikes" dished out around here.

I'm not pressing the dislike button if you were wondering.

Bigsby says

Hmmm...

And the demographics aren't especially unusual for the Gulf. Only 17% of the population are locals in the UAE for example.

You are supporting my point that the term "2nd class citizen" is misleading in the Middle East context. Western "expats" in the Middle East command a government-sponsored privileged position.

Reality says

I use precise words to convey precise meanings. I do not use phrases like "2nd class citizen" to mislead people, who general do not know #2 is a high ranking in a society that has 4-5 different ranks on the pyramid.

That's just a nonsense as is your random selection of 4-5 different ranks on a supposed pyramid. It's obvious what is being conveyed when I said foreigners are considered second class citizens in comparison to the locals. That doesn't need to be broken down into every possible permutation. You are simply playing more of your games.

Reality says

You are supporting my point that the term "2nd class citizen" is misleading in the Middle East context. Western "expats" in the Middle East command a government-sponsored privileged position.

Privileged to whom? Not compared to the locals, which was my point. What is yours?

Bigsby says

Reality says

I use precise words to convey precise meanings. I do not use phrases like "2nd class citizen" to mislead people, who general do not know #2 is a high ranking in a society that has 4-5 different ranks on the pyramid.

That's just a nonsense as is your random selection of 4-5 different ranks on a supposed pyramid. It's obvious what is being conveyed when I said foreigners are considered second class citizens in comparison to the locals. That doesn't need to be broken down into every possible permutation. You are simply playing more of your games.

No, it is not a word game. "2nd class citizen" in the modern western context means underprivileged minority, not technocrat or nobility class just below Royalty but above the majority of the population. In the Kuwaiti context, because nearly 3/4 of the population are "foreigners," the western "expats" are second only to the (male) Kuwaiti Citizens, which only accounts for a tiny fraction of the population.

The word "the locals" is also misleading. The proper term is actually Kuwaiti Citizens or Local Citizens. The emphasis being on Citizens, whose qualification involves tracing back ancestry many generations ago to a specific date. Most non-citizens in Kuwait are actually local middle easterners born and raised in Kuwait but not Kuwaiti Citizens.

Bigsby says

You are supporting my point that the term "2nd class citizen" is misleading in the Middle East context. Western "expats" in the Middle East command a government-sponsored privileged position.

Privileged to whom? Not compared to the locals, which was my point. What is yours?

More privileged than the vast majority of the population living in Kuwait. Your "locals" refer to the tiny fraction of the population that are qualified as Kuwaiti Citizens based on their ancestors many generations ago with a cut-off date either in the early 20th century or late 19th century. The majority of population living in the gulf states are not Citizens despite them being arabs and having been in the country for many generations.

Atrocities are only publicized on a case by case basis for political expediency.

Large atrocities completely ignored if it a "pox on your house" atrocity, small atrocities made up or exaggerated if it's "I need to intervene in your country and stir up some shit for political/economic advantage."

Read in between the lines, the press has a narrow, controlled cynosure.

komputodo says

really? that's how your mind works?

Yep--because it's a dumb statement to begin with, worthy of a pithy response.

Reality says

The majority of population living in the gulf states are not Citizens despite them being arabs and having been in the country for many generations.

That's the worst nonsense I've ever heard.. The gulf states are Kuwait, Iraq, Bahrain, Oman, Qatar, Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates. Oman and South Yemen are arab states but not gulf states. How the fuck could arabs have lived in the region for generations and not be citizens. Of course they are citizens, they are arabs. There's a reason it's called the Arab Peninsula. They've lived there for thousands of years. The first recorded usage if the word arab was a record of the assyrian conquest of syria 854-856. Trust me on this, after 3000 years you really are a citizen.

Perhaps you are trying to say the Emirates states? If so what does that have to do with Kuwait?

Reality says

Expats" and "expat" chambers of commerce have been in existence since long before "retirement" became a part of life for most people.

The term expat was first used in 1962 according to 3 separete dictionaries I looked in. I'm pretty sure retirement predated it.

Reality says

I understand the term quite well, both the legal meaning of it and how the chambers of commerce overseas promote it. I worked abroad, then the "abroad" became my home country, then I have worked several different "abroads" of various durations, including some to my country of birth as "abroad" because my home country changed. You can say that I actually expatriated from my country of birth in the legal sense.

ex·pa·tri·ate
[v. eks-pey-tree-eyt or, esp. British, -pa-tree-; adj., n. eks-pey-tree-it, -eyt or, esp. British, -pa-tree-] Show IPA
verb (used with object), ex·pa·tri·at·ed, ex·pa·tri·at·ing.
1. to banish (a person) from his or her native country.
2. to withdraw (oneself) from residence in one's native country.
3.to withdraw (oneself) from allegiance to one's country.
verb (used without object), ex·pa·tri·at·ed, ex·pa·tri·at·ing.
4.to become an expatriate: He expatriated from his homeland.
adjective
5.expatriated; exiled.

Of course you expatriated from your country of birth. That's where you are a citizen. The definition of expatriate is to leave your country of citizenship. Another definition and usage of the word expatriate is to give up your citizenship. Let me clue you in on some of the terms used by everyone in world except you. Citizen, overseas, homeland, and resident. Not abroad and home country. Now I know for sure you've never travelled further than the state fair.

Reality says

No, it is not a word game. "2nd class citizen" in the modern western context means underprivileged minority, not technocrat or nobility class just below Royalty but above the majority of the population. In the Kuwaiti context, because nearly 3/4 of the population are "foreigners," the western "expats" are second only to the (male) Kuwaiti Citizens, which only accounts for a tiny fraction of the population.

The word "the locals" is also misleading. The proper term is actually Kuwaiti Citizens or Local Citizens. The emphasis being on Citizens, whose qualification involves tracing back ancestry many generations ago to a specific date. Most non-citizens in Kuwait are actually local middle easterners born and raised in Kuwait but not Kuwaiti Citizens.

More of your games. It was perfectly clear that I was talking about local Kuwaiti citizens. Your trying to twist the language used to fit your argument doesn't change what I was obviously saying. And no, the western expats aren't only second to the male Kuwaitis, they are second to Kuwaitis, which is what I said, is it not? It doesn't make any difference to the point I was making how big the population of the local KUWAITI CITIZENS is. I know how big it is and I know the make up of the population. Only one group has the real rights and privileges conveyed on it, that gets all the grants, pensions, housing rights, best government jobs, etc., etc., that has the wasta that greases the wheels over here. And those aren't Middle Easterners or Asians born here, or the foreigners that come to work here. And yes, I know fine well that being born here doesn't automatically make you a citizen. You have to google it. I'm surrounded by people born and raised here, but who aren't citizens, do not hold Kuwaiti passports, and do not get any of the aforementioned benefits, so don't think you are informing me of anything.

I get the strong impression that you are simply bullshitting. I don't believe you did a paper on this. How convenient that when I said I lived in Kuwait and was talking about the population that you suddenly said you did a paper on the area. A paper indeed. And what was that on? Kuwait and the population. Oh, what a detail free coincidence.

Anyway I'm tired of this. You aren't saying anything. You aren't telling me anything. All you are attempting to do is 'win' an argument by implying that what I am saying is wrong because I didn't use the language that YOU think is most appropriate, but which is clear enough to anyone else who isn't playing the games you are, so enough already. I've lived here for over a decade. I don't live on some Saudi style compound, I live bang in the heart of the city. I see what goes on day-to-day. I see who has the power and influence. It is the Kuwaitis, male AND female. They have the wasta, and they get the handouts, not the foreigners (or those who aren't recognized as Kuwaiti citizens before you waste your time going down that path again), so don't think you can tell me what life is like over here from your keyboard in America. You can't.

Wow! You wake up so early in the morning in Kuwait just to write a lengthy verbiage?

Bigsby says

More of your games

gsr says

Wow! You wake up so early in the morning in Kuwait just to write a lengthy verbiage?

Bigsby says

More of your games

I wake up early every day. I didn't wake up early just to write a response.

What a surprise that you popped up.

Mush lay off the kids, you fukkk

Call it Crazy says

Let's see , besides being a financial expert better than Bloomberg and the
NAHB, A pension expert, you are now a construction expert...

Wow, you're amazing!!! (which shows you know nothing about construction along
without knowing anything about the other areas I just typed).....

I have to hand it to you, you're living up to all my expectations today of
being a total asshole!!!

C'mon queenie, tell us how the blog world works......LOL

Call it Crazy says

upisdown
says

So, beyond any shadow of a doubt, you have absolutely NO idea why home
building shuts down in the winter, or at the very least to a crawl, because of
the bitter cold and freezing temps, do you?

C'mon, at least a wild guess or maybe even making something up and running
with it non-stop like you do about everything else. Hell, I'll even give you a
big hint.......moisture, or lack of.

Let's see , besides being a financial expert better than Bloomberg and the
NAHB, A pension expert, you are now a construction expert...

Wow, you're amazing!!! (which shows you know nothing about construction along
without knowing anything about the other areas I just typed).....

I have to hand it to you, you're living up to all my expectations today of
being a total asshole!!!

So, the shitbag of san fran who can't afford a house has no clue..........go figure.

Call it Crazy says

Let's see , besides being a financial expert better than Bloomberg and the
NAHB, A pension expert, you are now a construction expert...

Wow, you're amazing!!! (which shows you know nothing about construction along
without knowing anything about the other areas I just typed).....

I have to hand it to you, you're living up to all my expectations today of
being a total asshole!!!

LOL, you really are aloser, aren't you. Ypour dumbass can't buy a shit-shack, and then pretends that nobody wants to buy that same shit-shack.

Tell us how it works, or how not to be able to buy property. LOL

Ooooooooooh scary, super duper scary,...........

komputodo says

When you find a stable store of value, could you please let us know.

I have no response to this. I just think it reads well after the chart showing gold tanking a ~33% bath for anyone who bought it between one and three years ago.

Damn, that was brutal, but it sure made me laugh.

Johnson is the poster boy for deceptive body language with the fluttering eyes and bobbing eyebrows (lie attempting to appear sincere), downward gaze (shame), leaning forward in the chair (polemic intimidation) and as much double talk as he could manage. He's trying so hard to give himself an "out" in the eyes of history while remaining a crook.

Don't know about Sandy Hook, but I like Sandy the Hooker.

Here's an interesting site with photo analysis of the Boston Marathon bombing, food for thought.

http://www.davesweb.cnchost.com/

These damn feds will never tell us who did it, or why such a prolonged cover up. I bet some very big and important families would be significantly implicated.

bgamall4 says

Thanks for the links, but Sandy Hook is where it was claimed that 26 children were massacred. However, Robbie Parker is a two bit actor and there were no tears by parents the day of Sandy Hook:

Why in gods name are they doing this? What was the point of all this?

The Robbie Parker behavior is odd. The auxiliary reference showing the little girl photoshopped into the picture is also odd.

I'll look at the Sandy Hook, stuff later, too many other conspiracies to examine.

How anybody could ever believe there was NOT a frontal shot is beyond me. It took major gaslighting by the government to keep that one gunman theory viable.

Wait a minute, there' s a shot of Kennedy with his head blasted open, and you can still see who it is; But there isn't a picture of Osama Bin Laden?

Are you spoofing yourself now?

bgamall4 says

Bigsby says

Are you spoofing yourself now?

The point is, moron, that they look real. It is impossible to tell a crisis actor faking injury from a really injured person, except in this case when the crisis actors are smiling.

You do understand that when somebody is shot or injured from a blast that they will bleed, have missing body parts, be screaming in agony etc., etc., so there are one or two ways of telling the difference. The fact that makeup can be semi-realistic in a photo is utterly irrelevant to real life events. I would have thought even someone with your limited intellect might be able to wrap their head around that but apparently not.

bgamall4 says

NO, moron. When they need people who are "missing limbs", they just hire folks who are already missing the limbs and then do this same makeup. You are really a dumb ass aren't you?

You must be taking the piss. Let me guess, every single one of the people standing watching the race in Boston were actors, every person at Newtown, every person who came to aid the people affected. You seriously think every single one was an actor. Is that right? Or do you really think that a member of the public is incapable of telling makeup from the real thing, from distinguishing between someone who has previously had a leg amputated and someone who has just had it blown off?

So those aren't the actual actors?

Then you could have just said actors like these...

You're getting more and more desperate Gary. Now your 'proof' is that they had some bottled water. Extraordinary stuff. A true smoking gun.