patrick.net

errc says

or that Facts sunk the Clinton ship, so facts are bad,

The point is not that facts are bad. The point is that selectively publishing all of the negative facts about one side and refusing to do so to the other side is unfair. Making a horse race shorter is not inherently unfair and bad for judging horses. But making it shorter for one horse and not the other is bad.

errc says

What if, the interests of Russia align with that of the American people?

I don't think that we should blindly just elect the person who Russia didn't want. But another country meddling in our election is bad regardless of the outcome. It should be easy to state that without worrying about what the implications are for this particular election.

YesYNot says

Why are you against a sweetheart deal here, but all for Trump's Carrier sweetheart deal where the company gets to avoid paying the standard tax?

Is Carrier allowed to keep sales taxes they collect?

You realize that Amazon dodged sales taxes for years, nationally, of course. It was fundamental to their business model.

Doesn't seem to be affecting the stock price at the moment:

General Motors Company (GM)
37.40 +0.31 (+0.82%)

Thunderlips is Tovbot2 says

Is Carrier allowed to keep sales taxes they collect?

They are allowed to avoid paying 7 million in taxes. Do you really care if it is sales tax, income tax, or property tax? Either you are against such race to the bottom tax incentive deals, or you are not.

Yes, I realize that Amazon dodged sales taxes for years. Technically, individuals dodged those taxes, since they were supposed to report and pay them. But yeah, I get that Amazon benefited. The US gov made a point of being relaxed about taxing internet businesses in the beginning. They wanted to encourage the new industry. Once it was established and competitive, they started cracking down. Or maybe Amazon just had to have brick and mortar in each state to improve distribution as they grew, so they couldn't avoid it any longer.

Do you dislike mail order/internet businesses like Amazon? Personally, I like the convenience and do most of my shopping there (excluding groceries and big box / garden type stuff). Different strokes for different folks.

Debt = Wealth!!!

YesYNot says

The point is that selectively publishing all of the negative facts about one side and refusing to do so to the other side is unfair.

So you're saying that what the mainstream media did to Donald Trump for 15 months straight was unfair? Interesting point! I agree!

Quigley says

So you're saying that what the mainstream media did to Donald Trump for 15 months straight was unfair? Interesting point! I agree!

Yes. Broadcasting his empty podium instead of Hillary's speech and having more negative stories about her email than about his conflict of interests, tax returns, etc. was unfair. The MSM didn't think he could win, so they treated him like an entertainment story rather than a potential president to vet. He did a good job playing them.

That damned Obama forced R/C/T/N-Ns to take on debt & suck on the Big Govt. Socialist Teat.
How many here have a family member that benefits from any socialist program?

AllTruth says

Medical debt (not sure of number but positive debt and amount in delinquency at all-time record highs, too).

Any american that can't pay CASH for any medical care,regardless of cost, is a FAILURE & a DISGRACE to TRUE AMERICANS!

Hangers-on,Free Riders,Something for Nothings

LOL- if the lefties keep at this, Trump will win a 2nd term.

Yeah right, why would the Russians want trump to win. If Hilary won, they would have donated a billion to the foundation and got the rest of our uranium.

Another day another high.
Thank You Santa Trump.

Strategist says

Another day another high.

Establishment insider is not center left no matter how you spin it

Tim Aurora says

I, an immigrant is more worried about America’s position in the world vs all the “so called patriots” that I see on this board, who are more interested in their fake news and government conspiracies.

That's it in a nut shell you foriegn American hatting Sons of Bitches hate America. You hate everything we stand for, and want to make Patriotism a naughty word.
We don't give a crap what you bastards think anymore. America love it or get the fuck out. That goes for loving Old White Crackers we come with the sandwich Assholes!

You know what? Fuck off and Die or just wait until you get deported but this wont fly, and wont be tolerated any longer. This is OUR Country you sons of bitches. I learnt that in the third grade I used to sing it loud and proud with my hand over my heart and American teachers leading the chorus.

I wipe my ass on your flag.

What ever third world shit hole that might be.

Of course. Questioning the media or pollsters or the validity of an election is only OK if you are a Trump supporter! How dare those lefties try to take a page out of the Trump book!??!!

90% of Foreign invaders are molesters, because they were molested by their foriegn folks. Tim Aurora says

• Evangelists supported Trump, a known sex philanderer and offender ( not really but pretty close) . Now I do not care philandering ( unless forced) but I guess evangelist should

Tenpoundbass says

Establishment insider is not center left no matter how you spin it

I don't know if you might want to call this spin, but center and left are relative terms.

I would agree that both Obama and Hillary are/were virtually republican by 1970s standards. But in today's world they are left of the center.

Today's center is to the right of Reagan or Nixon. It is true, that Bernie is there, and some naively think he could be elected. But that's only becasue the right wing media doesn't even bother arguing against socialism anymore. In fact they like Bernie for his ability to split the democratic party. They knew all along that Hillary was who they were up against.

Those republican strategists are not dummies.

It is true, that Bernie is there, and some naively think he could be elected.

---------

Nothing naive about that. Bernie absolutely would have won the election, with even a half fair shake. He came close, and that was with both parties doing everything possible to deny him in the primary.

The naive are those who ever thought Hillary had a snowball chance in hell

errc says

Bernie absolutely would have won the election, with even a half fair shake.

Nah, not buying it. Joe Biden, on the other hand....

Tim Aurora says

• I, an immigrant is more worried about America’s position in the world vs all the “so called patriots” that I see on this board, who are more interested in their fake news and government conspiracies.

Which filthy third world country are you from?

Straw Man says

errc says

Bernie absolutely would have won the election, with even a half fair shake.

Nah, not buying it. Joe Biden, on the other hand....

Biden lol!

Bernie would have won in a landslide

Wait I found a chart that is really ugly

errc says

Straw Man says

errc says

Bernie absolutely would have won the election, with even a half fair shake.

Nah, not buying it. Joe Biden, on the other hand....

Biden lol!

Bernie would have won in a landslide

The country is not so far gone as to elect self-defined socialist. Biden would be considered a "safe" choice by lots of people on both left and right.

Tim Aurora says

Putin’s Communist government (extreme left)

His government is not Communist. Not even extreme left. The closest would be fascist (not a swear word, merely a definition in mainstream sense of the word).

YesYNot says

Yes. Broadcasting his empty podium instead of Hillary's speech and having more negative stories about her email than about his conflict of interests, tax returns, etc. was unfair. The MSM didn't think he could win, so they treated him like an entertainment story rather than a potential president to vet. He did a good job playing them.

What media were you watching? They printed or cast ten negative stories about Trump to one positive story about Hillary, and only occasionally mentioned her little email scandal in the nicest of ways that made clear she did nothing wrong! If it weren't for alternative news sites, we'd have never seen anything negative about her at all! Hell, a MSNBC reporter was nearly fired for suggesting that she wasn't taking Trump's threat seriously enough and needed to campaign harder!
Quit being completely dishonest. Nobody at all agrees with you that the media favored Trump. It's just the opposite of truth! A big fat LIE! Quit lying Toby.

joeyjojojunior says

Of course. Questioning the media or pollsters or the validity of an election is only OK if you are a Trump supporter! How dare those lefties try to take a page out of the Trump book!??!!

Did Hilalry sign off a big chunk of our uranium to Russian interests after getting a gazillion dollar to her foundation through Russian interests?

Ironman says

joeyjojojunior says

Do you think a phishing email is not a hack?

Nope, not when you VOLUNTARILY give your password to someone who asks for it... That's just being an idiot.

Idiot is a necessary component for any hack. Be it an idiot user who clicks on links in phishing e-mail and has one simple password for all his accounts, idiot administrator who doesn't patch his system in timely manner and/or doesn't enforce strict security policies, or idiot programmer writing code with more holes than Swiss cheese in it...

Phishing is a hacking technique. There is no point of attempting to redefine the term.

"Did Hilalry sign off a big chunk of our uranium to Russian interests after getting a gazillion dollar to her foundation through Russian interests?"

Let's see. Hillary, the secretaries of Treasury, Justice, Homeland Security, Commerce, Defense, and Energy all signed off on it. As well as the heads of the office of the US Trade Representative and Science and Technology Policy. But, I'm sure she paid them all off. Or maybe they were scared of her hitman. You know, the one that was going to be interviewed on Fox? Oh yeah, he never showed up.

Your positions are ridiculous, and I know better than to argue with an obvious idiot. It's pretty obvious that you used to be posting under a different username.

"Nope, not when you VOLUNTARILY give your password to someone who asks for it... That's just being an idiot."

So, in other words, you don't know what phishing emails are then. (they don't involve giving up ones password)

"Your positions are ridiculous, and I know better than to argue with an obvious idiot. It's pretty obvious that you used to be posting under a different username"

Yes, please stick to posting memes. That's what you're best at. The one with Hillary falling off the bike is solid gold.

"Podesta's "hack" came from an email telling him to reset his password. He went to the fake site and MANUALLY ENTERED his password. Please try to keep up with your cluelessness...."

Wait--I thought you said it wasn't a hack? It was someone on the inside releasing the docs? Now you admit it was a hack?

Tim Aurora says

Right wing is more cozy with Putin’s Communist government (extreme left)

Calling Putin's government "left" is really misleading. In social terms, Putin is very much like the American right. Of course, what constitutes left and right varies greatly from country to country. In America guns and Christianity go hand-in-hand. In most Christian nations the opposite is true.

Even in economic terms, calling communism the left is misleading because essentially the economic scale is circular. Take either leftist economics or rightist to the extreme and they become the same thing.

We really need to give up this stupid one-dimensional view of politics anyway. It's not even remotely useful.

Instead, we should be talking about many independent principles and how they are upheld or opposed by different economic systems and governments. That would be actually useful.

Tim Aurora says

Good, I like that ad hominem. If you can't argue against the position, argue against the man. Strip him down. Are you a Russian Troll. Good I will put you in my ignore list

Do what you want, I am simply sick and tired of listening to smug condescending foreign assholes with a green card, acting like White People have no birth right to any preferential American consideration or treatment, then go politically banana's with our Education department demanding you have some God given right go unchallenged on everything.

I think the burning the flag and the giving us the finger for 8 years. Yeah... that was a bit much!

YesYNot says

They are allowed to avoid paying 7 million in taxes. Do you really care if it is sales tax, income tax, or property tax? Either you are against such race to the bottom tax incentive deals, or you are not.

If Carrier leaves there will be none of those other taxes. Why an internet shopping company should ever get out of collecting and passing along 100% of a state sales tax is a mystery. Why Amazon would need any incentive not to pay a state sales tax is a mystery: They'd pay it if Amazon moved to Mexico or Germany or Canada.

Quigley says

What media were you watching? They printed or cast ten negative stories about Trump to one positive story about Hillary, and only occasionally mentioned her little email scandal in the nicest of ways that made clear she did nothing wrong! If it weren't for alternative news sites, we'd have never seen anything negative about her at all! Hell, a MSNBC reporter was nearly fired for suggesting that she wasn't taking Trump's threat seriously enough and needed to campaign harder!

Don't forget the media repeated the lie that not only did Russia hack various Democratic emails, but at least in Podesta's case they claimed they were completely fabricated.

Oh, and just like the CIA briefing bullshit, they never showed any evidence this was the case.

That's also the people who get paid when you pee in a cup.

I don't give them any business. So they didn't hack me.
"I'll piss in a cup if you drink it!" - Interview response

Ironman says

The Madison, New Jersey-based company says “an unauthorized third party” on Nov. 26 gained access to customer information including names, dates of birth, lab results and in some instances, telephone numbers. The stolen data did not include Social Security numbers, credit card accounts, insurance details or any other financial information.

So now they know what's in my urine. LOL.

PUTIN!!!!!

Wants to know how many warehouse workers who had to pee in a cup to qualify for a $9/hr job smoked the Whacky Tobaccy.

Tim Aurora says

Fascist regimes have charismatic dictators with hyper-masculine personality cults. These regimes generally evince a hyper-nationalist ethos, a cult of violence, mass mobilization of youth, high levels of repression, powerful propaganda machines and imperialist projects. Fascist regimes are hugely popular—usually because the charismatic leader appeals to broad sectors of the population.

Limp wristed Techno-Bankster globalist regimes are dominated by Matriarchs who love money and war. Like Pelosi, Boxer, Feinstein, Hillary, Powers, etc.

Salon actually uses child labor to make up stories under duress.