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Coping with my Schadenfreude


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2006 Apr 12, 10:14am   15,495 views  268 comments

by HARM   ➕follow (0)   💰tip   ignore  

Mr. Housing Bubble

WSJ article reports Flippers are getting a rough ass-pounding from the market.

Despite the current turmoil, some Floridians remain bullish, including Stuart Miller, the chief executive officer of Miami-based Lennar, one of the largest home builders in the U.S. But Mr. Morgan, the broker, says for him the market has slowed considerably. He wrote in an email late last week that "we went three days this week with not a single showing. That's incredible. I have 35 listings. We usually get 2-6 showings a day....I received more desperate calls from sellers than ever. One lady broke down into tears. Her husband bought two investment properties, and they are now going to lose their 'life savings' if they sell the homes in today's market."

I experience strong visceral feelings of pleasure and satisfaction.
(_pinky to corner of mouth, Dr. Evil style_ Woohahahahaha!!!)

Q: Does this make me a bad person?

Discuss, enjoy...
HARM

#housing

« First        Comments 162 - 201 of 268       Last »     Search these comments

162   Peter P   2006 Apr 13, 6:44am  

5.05% yield….bloomberg analyst predicts 6.5 yield by EOY.

Mortgage rate may return to 8.0% soon.

163   HARM   2006 Apr 13, 6:45am  

So rejoicing in someone else’s pain (or even feeling smug and self-satsified) cannot be considered good karma

This is why I'm not a Buddhist.

I've had to put up with f@cking smug-assed Troll "I'm a genius, you're a JBR" bull$hit for the last 3 years, and this is my well deserved payback. Just like they were "entitled" to rub their 20%/year perpetual gains in my face, I'm "entitled" to my Schadenfreude and I really don't give a rat's ass about karma.

SILSIH, Trolls!
(And you better start getting acquainted with this new sensation called "ass-pounding". You will be experiencing it on a regular basis from now until the end of the correction.)

164   Peter P   2006 Apr 13, 6:51am  

well deserved payback

I am no longer sure whether paybacks are warranted. Whatever needs to happen will happen.

165   LILLL   2006 Apr 13, 6:53am  

HARM
I love your outrage.
I feel it too.

166   HARM   2006 Apr 13, 6:59am  

I am no longer sure whether paybacks are warranted. Whatever needs to happen will happen.

OTC, I am following foreclosure news quite closely. They are already rising, and should really take off within a year or so --when all those option-ARMs begin to reset. I plan on personally attending ones involving amatuer "RE tycoons" who planned on retiring early by making houses in my neighborhood completely unaffordable to working class families. I plan on being there when they get evicted and hand the keys over to the local sheriff. And karma or no karma, I will savor the moment.

167   HARM   2006 Apr 13, 7:00am  

@Linda in LA-LA-LAND,

_blows kiss_

168   LILLL   2006 Apr 13, 7:03am  

I was speaking with a dad at the private school where my son goes. This dad is an amateur flipper who thinks he's 'all that'. When he heard we had sold and were living in a rental, he started trying to sell me one of his condos. Now, I've know this guy since our teens were in preschool together and I've never been a 'condo kind of girl'. I build too, but on a smaller, more conservative level than he. He was CONDESCENDING on me for renting and trying to sell me his freaking condo! And that was several months ago when the bubble was just a 'theory'. The AUDACITY. Yes, there ARE those greasy guys that NEED to fall off their high freakin horses. Schadenfreude......

169   astrid   2006 Apr 13, 7:04am  

Mr. Vincent,

Ha, this is a great illustration of how little realtors do. They couldn't even convince the owners to clean up the piles of paper for the pictures.

It's not that bad, and probably in an okay neighborhood. I'd say $200K seems about right, provided the seller legalizes the add on.

170   astrid   2006 Apr 13, 7:08am  

HARM,

Karma is way too complicated and not particularly fair (what's with this karmic payback in next life business, or the instrument of the karmic payback taking on bad karma business).

I do watch this bubble because I care about the overall economy. And the earlier this thing blows, the less the damage and the faster we get back onto producing useful stuff instead of paper profits.

171   LILLL   2006 Apr 13, 7:11am  

I am of German descent so I'm loving learning a little German here.
My last name, as I was always told as a child means...
"babbling brook that flows from the brewery" :P
Now...maybe they just made the brewery part up.....
And...does it have to mean 'babbling'?
Isn't 'noisy' just as good?

172   HARM   2006 Apr 13, 7:16am  

_nod_ to Mr Vincent

Yes, there ARE those greasy guys that NEED to fall off their high freakin horses. Schadenfreude…

@Linda in LLL,

Yes, pain is a wonderful teacher. We must never get so caught up in savoring our delicious new Schadenfreude that we lose sight of the positive and therapuetic aspects of pain.

The flippers are about to get an education in what asset bubbles are and how they correct. This first-hand lesson will be far more valuable than any condo-flipping seminar or RE course they have ever taken. Hopefully many of them will end up the better for it, and will resolve never again to be flippers (or at the very least, not to take on dangerous risk without first researching the market).

We must all embrace pain as a valuable teacher. Class is now in session --better start taking notes. ;-)

173   astrid   2006 Apr 13, 7:16am  

HARM,

I am amazed by the number of foreclosures and pre-foreclosures listed for Los Gatos. I checked Claremont, home of the Hwang-Smiths, also very high.

174   LILLL   2006 Apr 13, 7:19am  

Mr. Vincent
I got the kiss and you only got a nod! :)

175   astrid   2006 Apr 13, 7:20am  

Linda,

We must remember that desire breeds want and bad karma :P

176   LILLL   2006 Apr 13, 7:23am  

Spring is in the air! It's 80 degrees in LA LA LAND and things are getting a little frisky around here!

177   astrid   2006 Apr 13, 7:58am  

Ray W,

No offense, but your girlfriend's email was the only one of the three I could follow.

178   astrid   2006 Apr 13, 8:00am  

Ray W and HARM,

I'd suggest you modify the email addresses in that posting, so they don't start to get spammed.

179   astrid   2006 Apr 13, 8:01am  

tannenbaum,

Well, Dublin is kinda ugly step sister looking...

180   astrid   2006 Apr 13, 8:02am  

Ray W,

No problem, and I didn't mean to offend, it was just kind of confusing. Your girlfriend's email was fine though, it really expressed her feelings well.

181   astrid   2006 Apr 13, 8:03am  

Don't worry, HARM or one of the other people with editing privilege will probably help you shortly. It's just one of the unfortunate facts of posting on public forums.

182   astrid   2006 Apr 13, 8:07am  

"Perhaps, but the freeway access is unbeatable and is RIGHT NEXT DOOR to the tonier cities of Pleasanton & San Ramon."

True enough. There are a lot of apartments in Pleasanton though. My boyfriend and I went apartment hunting and found that Pleasanton prices were no higher than Dublin prices. Also, if I had money, I'd rather live in Danville.

183   Randy H   2006 Apr 13, 8:09am  

I do not believe in karma, strictly. There are no zero-sum games.

184   LILLL   2006 Apr 13, 8:11am  

Give 'em hell Ray.

185   astrid   2006 Apr 13, 8:14am  

...continuing on my thought. I always thought the way to do affordable housing was to encourage builders to build reasonably nice 2 or 3 bedroom apartment in decent school districts.

186   Peter P   2006 Apr 13, 8:17am  

I do not believe in karma, strictly. There are no zero-sum games.

Huh? They are all zero-sum games. :)

187   astrid   2006 Apr 13, 8:19am  

Peter P,

Do you have delete privilege?

188   astrid   2006 Apr 13, 8:21am  

Peter P,

Buddhists ought to be glad that they don't get audited. They report some crazy numbers (of lifetimes).

189   edvard   2006 Apr 13, 8:28am  

Ray,
Wow, at least you heard back from that guy. I've written to the Mayor of Alameda, several newspapers, and of course all the senators and the Govna' a few times, and nobody except one of the newspapers got back to me, and the person who emailed me from the paper was doing so because he too was pissed that a newspaper editor can't afford anything in town. I think most local politicians would rather just look the other way and stay out of it, which is probably wise because either stand they take will ultimatly put mud on their hands.

190   astrid   2006 Apr 13, 8:37am  

Ray W,

I gave you my take on affordable housing, what's your take on affordable house?

191   Randy H   2006 Apr 13, 8:38am  

Huh? They are all zero-sum games. :)

Then again, I doubt even the Universe is a purely closed system. Not a zero-sum game. ;)

192   astrid   2006 Apr 13, 8:42am  

If the universe was a close karmic system, that means everytime we do something with good karma, someone else is forced to take on bad karma to balance...

193   Randy H   2006 Apr 13, 8:56am  

I was involved in Belmont politics a few years ago, mostly regarding housing-related issues. I spent a lot of time working with a couple of city council members regarding development issues.

Here's what I came away with from my experience spending too much time interacting with the bowels of city government:

1. If you are reading this blog then you are too smart to be wasting time with your city government, unless you have a rare bunch of people running your town (unlikely), or you live in a city with a history of real politics (that is, the state and even national parties take an interest in getting candidates into office in your city).

2. Absent of the exceptions above, the people who rise to political office are those who are most recognizable. This tends to favor reatlors(tm), a very few local business people, and rarely a long-time activist resident.

3. Most of the people running the city have a good heart, but lack the experience, education, or practical knowledge to interpret the complex issues before them.

4. In this vacuum, policy tends to be (a) poorly considered usually with lots of nasty unintended consequences, (b) populist; whatever tends to quiet down the chronic complainers, which by the way are people who have spent the past 25years bitching about the same stupid personal annoyance, (c) self-serving; see real-estate agents.

In Belmont we had a certain unnamed, infamous realtor(tm) who rose to mayor, only to have approved an illegal McMansion development (in a closed session if I recall correctly), which was land acquired by a business partner, and subsequently sold to developers for a few million (as an option, dependent upon approval) from which she directly profited. She came under pressure, resigned, and is still very popular in town. She got to keep her money too, and the little "zoned for 8 houses" area proudly boasts some 30+ overpriced McMansions. I have no doubt that if she ran for mayor again, she'd win. Everyone recognizes her picture, being it's on signs all over town.

The lesson I came away with: "life is too short to waste time herding cats".

**not political advice

194   Randy H   2006 Apr 13, 9:05am  

Ray W,

Just an excerpt of my cynicism towards city governance:

which has yet to make it past the Planning Department and to the public for a full discussion on the pros and cons. I haven’t yet formulated an opinion, and I won’t, until this matter is before the full City Council, and you have an opportunity to be heard.

Yea yea, that's what we heard a bunch of times in Belmont too. Translation: "I've already made up my mind, but will hide behind formality until this issue has become confused and frustrating. Hopefully no earnest, organized grass-roots efforts arise to counter the proposal, which I shall encourage by refusing to comment on the issue. I'll seek legal advice from our incompetent, subcontracted municipal lawyer which will result in our losing the next 3 years city budget in lawsuits even if the Council votes no anyway. So hey, by the time I push this thing through, you and everyone else should be thanking me."

195   LILLL   2006 Apr 13, 9:13am  

Have you guys checked out ..

http://overvalued.blogspot.com/

lately...funny...

196   HARM   2006 Apr 13, 9:14am  

@Ray W & Astrid,

I have removed the private phone numbers & email addresses from Ray's posts. Unfortunately, neither I, Peter P, Randy H, nor SQT can moderate each other's threads, only those of other people.

197   Randy H   2006 Apr 13, 9:14am  

City commissions are different in every city. In Belmont they had little to no power and the Council overruled the recommendations of the commissions whenever they wanted to, often in closed session. They can close session whever things get "rowdy", meaning someone speaks emotionally in open debate.

Your mileage may vary.

One piece of unsolicited advice: don't underestimate the power of formality or sound-bite good intentions. If they hold an "affordable housing workshop" and you don't participate and contribute, then they'll discredit you on the subject thereafter. If they label bad housing as "affordable housing", then you cannot attack it directly, or you'll be labeled as a NIMBY, racist, elitist, etc. It's very Orwellian and depressing.

198   Randy H   2006 Apr 13, 9:16am  

I can't edit comments in a top-level admin's thread (none of us can). So SQT, HARM, Peter P and myself cannot edit each other's threads.

HARM, if you see this, strike the email from the OC.

199   HARM   2006 Apr 13, 9:17am  

Randy H, it's already done --see my above comment.

200   Randy H   2006 Apr 13, 9:21am  

@HARM

I have committed the sin of not scrolling up. My apologies. ;)

201   Randy H   2006 Apr 13, 9:28am  

Ray W,

Agreed. I guess my only caution is that city government uses "time commitment' as a barrier to entry. If you are going to fight this battle and have it be anything but a complete and utter waste of your time, then you have to invest in it heavily. You must get involved, go to every council meeting, join a commission, and show up to every workshop. Take council members to coffee, help allies campaign, carry little signs around on election day. You have to spend an enormous amount of time on other issues in order to get them to champion your issue.

Something about an analogy to how one makes sausage fits in here.

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