patrick.net

Bellingham Bill says

Yup, their meeting wasn't going to end well.

But Zimmerman was the original aggressor here, no matter how Martin reacted to his actions.

Short of video of the meeting, we can't know what happened.

Only bring our own biases to it.

Pick the side you want to give the benefit of the doubt to, but the bottom line was and is Martin had every right to walk in that complex without getting accosted by the condo cop.

If Martin had in fact been some thief casing the place, then I would be arguing a different point entirely, and Zimmerman would have had much more leeway from me.

But Zimmerman fucked this up completely.

"original agressor" - you are fabricating.

>"original agressor" - you are fabricating.

not in the slightest. Martin hadn't done a fucking thing to Zimmerman before Zimmerman decided to follow him in his car

through half of the complex.

Some creepy guy started following me minding my own business, hell yes I would be put on edge.

http://reason.com/blog/2013/06/26/why-does-it-matter-when-and-why-george-z

Bellingham Bill says

not in the slightest. Martin hadn't done a fucking thing to Zimmerman before Zimmerman decided to follow him in his car

Car, on foot, on a horse, on a tricycle.. it matters not.. there was a reason why Zimmerman was on Patrol.. furthermore, since 1 out of 5 residence were black,
can you provide evidence that shows, Zimmerman was stalking other black residence.

In September 2011, the Twin Lakes residents held an organizational meeting to create a neighborhood watch program. Zimmerman was selected by neighbors as the program's coordinator, according to Wendy Dorival, Neighborhood Watch organizer for the Sanford Police Department.

Bellingham Bill says

>"original agressor" - you are fabricating.

not in the slightest. Martin hadn't done a fucking thing to Zimmerman before
Zimmerman decided to follow him in his car

Following is not aggressing. So yes, you ae fabricating.

Back to Obama's remarks - Dear Mr President, STFU. Quit pouring gasoline on the fire and claim to be helping to put it out. The man is a prime example of Mark Twain's quote - Better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt. - The president consistently removes all doubt.

OK, here's what happened.
Obama provides American with another face palm moment, and the Patnet liberals all went... "Ah fuck, more stupid shit Obama did, that I'll have to defend on Patnet!"
As long as there's a white man involved then they've got an excuse.
If it ain't the GOP or the Tea baggers, it's a Jewish Inca.

CaptainShuddup says

OK, here's what happened.
Obama provides American with another face palm moment, and the Patnet liberals all went... "Ah fuck, more stupid shit Obama did, that I'll have to defend on Patnet!"
As long as there's a white man involved then they've got an excuse.
If it ain't the GOP or the Tea baggers, it's a Jewish Inca.

Perhaps a Jewish Timoto–Cuican.

John this case was never about Zimmerman's stability, or whether his grown ass should have been approaching teens, or anyone in the dark in his patrols. It was turned into a the white people on trial for racism proxy a Jewish Peruvian dude. Who's motives for getting out of the car, should have been looked at more closely.

When race went on trial, reality took a backseat to everything else.

John Bailo says

Case closed.

The case is indeed closed. 'Not Guilty' on all counts.

I've posted this before, but it's worthwhile to repeat since you lack logic and critical thinking skills, as most black crime apologists do.

That is an awfully risky and suspicious murder plot.

This was the first time he called police to report a person, had contact with that person and just so happens he killed that person.

Lots of dominos had to fall perfectly on the first attempt he decided to commit murder. GZ has called police a lot before, but never spoke to any of the suspects or got close enough to touch them as far as we know. Odds are if he did try to commit this devious plan, he would have a few failed attempts.

GZ is either a criminal mastermind with the perfect plan executed perfectly on the first try or he was just unlucky to run into one black guy who punches people in the nose for talking to them.

CaptainShuddup says

When race went on trial, reality took a backseat to everything else.

That and some supierority by GZ. Did anybody REALLY think the race part of this tradgedy wasn't going to be hyped for maximum value since the OJ trial????

Awesome. When does the 1st degree murder trial start?

foxmannumber1 says

GZ is either a criminal mastermind with the perfect plan executed perfectly on the first try or he was just unlucky to run into one black guy who punches people in the nose for talking to them.

OR maybe a guy instigated a fight that lead to him shooting a guy dead. And now thousands of right wingers trip over eachother defending the story that Zimmerman made up so that he won't go to prison for life.

It doesn't have to be either premeditated murder or Martin jumped Zimmerman. There are countless possibilities in between, most of which should lead to manslaughter or murder charges for the weasel pussy that kills a guy dead just because he is losing a physical altercation that he himself started in one way or another.

What superiority?

He was called a racist before he was even bailed out. The minute the story hit the news it was about race. and in a post "First Black President" America, it was supposed to be politically incorrect to even acknowledge someone branded with Racist Scarlet letter. Zimmerman got a few hundred 1,000 for his defense through unsolicited donations and in a grand pandering fashion, the prosecutor and judge conspired to revoke his bond. Even though he didn't break any laws.

I can't recall any case in the History of American justice where bail was revoked because they thought the "Suspect"(Innocent until proven guilty) could afford more.

It's not supposed to be a fucking Tijuana shakedown.

But none of that happened. He was found 'not guilty' on all charges. 2 weeks ago.

The only thing people should be talking about are a possible civil rights case via Obama/Holder or a civil suit from TM's parents. Both of those have no merit in my opinion.

CaptainShuddup says

What superiority?

I should've explained what I meant by that. GZ had a predetermined idea/thought or whatever you may call it the TM "was up to no good".

Well, what exactly is that?? Are there different levels of "up to no good", and how are they judged?? Didn't matter because GZ had already determined(without causeOR evidence) that TM had or was breaking some law in his mind.

And, just WHY did GZ even get out of his car,(we know that he called 911 and that the 911 dispatcher told him NOT to do anything and that the police were on the way and would handle it)and begin to confront-chase-initiate ANY contact between the two??

Neighborhood WATCH kind of means WATCH and see, not to try and be a real live version of a vigliante.

marcus says

OR maybe a guy instigated a fight that lead to him shooting a guy dead. And
now thousands of right wingers trip over eachother defending the story that
Zimmerman made up so that he won't go to prison for life.

Probably the best summation that I've heard yet. And try telling any of those RWers that GZ was a registered democrat, and after they argue with you about it and you prove it, they STILL don't believe it, or want to.

upisdown says

Well, what exactly is that?? Are there different levels of "up to no good", and how are they judged?? Didn't matter because GZ had already determined(without causeOR evidence) that TM had or was breaking some law in his mind.

I can't tell you how I feel when I have to present my receipt after paying a damn shit load of money to purchase what ever it was I came to those stores for in the first place. Do I get to bitch about being profiled as up to no good?

I don't understand people like you, you don't seem to have a problem with peoples personal and individual rights are whittled down to nothing. But you reach in the shit pile and pull out one race to say "Oh the humanity!".

Bullshit! We're all being sodomized by the man.

George Zimmerman does not represent "The Man". Anyone in the Justice system that would use this case to distract from the real problems with privacy, rights and the justice system. Are most certain what's most horribly wrong with the Justice system in America in the first place.

CaptainShuddup says

I don't understand people like you, you don't seem to have a problem with
peoples personal and individual rights are whittled down to nothing. But you
reach in the shit pile and pull out one race to say "Oh the humanity!".

I WAS referring to personal rights, such as the right to do anything(within the law) and not be harrassed while doing it, or even be shot.

Were YOU refering to TM personal rights though?

upisdown says

And try telling any of those RWers that GZ was a registered democrat, and after they argue with you about it and you prove it, they STILL don't believe it, or want to.

No one is denying GZ was a registered democrat.

It's an obvious fact, as is GZ defending the beaten homeless black man, GZ being part African, GZ dating blacks, GZ tutoring blacks and GZ calling 911/NEN on suspicious blacks numerous times without interacting with the suspects at all. These are all facts.

Other obvious facts of this case being TM beat up people and did illegal drugs. GZ beat up no one and did not do illegal drugs.

foxmannumber1 says

Other obvious facts of this case being TM beat up people and did illegal
drugs. GZ beat up no one and did not do illegal drugs.

And you left out picking his nose. And the relevance to thier actions is still nothing.

It shows TM's past behavior, and gives evidence of who is most likely to assault someone for no reason.

The world is a better place without TM and people like TM.

foxmannumber1 says

GZ beat up no one and did not do illegal drugs.

And you can't now or ever prove that to be true.foxmannumber1 says

The world is a better place without TM and people like TM.

No, it just shows how many MORE people that we should be rid off. Get it?

thomaswong.1986 says

The population in the development, at the time of the shooting, was about 49% non-Hispanic white, 23% Hispanic (of any race), 20% black, and 5% Asian, according to Census figures.

that house is $92K on zillow plus 23% Hispanic (meaning at least 23% on welfare) and 20% black, not exactly an "up-scale" neighborhood anyways.

actually far from it.

not sure why that kind crazy neighborhood watch was needed.

meth is a very crazy drug. makes you extremely paranoia and stop talking it causes weight gain, even when in prison.

upisdown says

And you can't now or ever prove that to be true

With the FBI and DOJ breathing down GZ's neck for the past 17 months I'm pretty sure they would have found 'something' by now and made it public to continue their persecution. They have nothing and they know it.

With regards to a 1st degree murder charge: that was dropped by the prosecution when the evidence against GZ was fully discovered. It was weak, too weak to even get an indictment returned from a grand jury. So Angela Corey utilized a loophole law of Florida to bypass a grand jury and get an indictment with just an affidavit. This can be done with any charge BUT 1st degree murder.
So, you see, case being weak as dish water, the prosecution had to divert normal justice to even GET a trial.
Angela corey also withheld evidence from the defense, then fired a whistleblower technician in response to him testifying about the withheld evidence.
This was grounds for a mistrial, but the evidence was so weak he got off anyway.

To me, it's not about race. It's about some people's nasty criminal kids who they let do whatever they want and act all surprised when their criminal activities land them in jail or on the coroner's slab. If race is involved, it's at the point where black culture has become so degenerate that this is considered unavoidable.

I would be mad as hell if I were a black man. Not mad at racial profilers, but mad at the black people who glorify thuggish behavior as part of black culture, and thus JUSTIFY racial profiling! You absolutely should racially profile black males in urban setting if you don't want to become the victim of violent crime!

John Bailo says

homaswong.1986 says

can you provide evidence that shows, Zimmerman was stalking other black residence.

George Zimmerman’s History of 911 Calls: A Complete Log

39. Aug. 6, 2011 – 10:20 p.m.

Type: TEL

Subject: Suspicious activity

Report: Two black males, one wearing a black tank top and black shorts, the second wearing a black t-shirt and jeans … “Subjs are in their teens”

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/03/22/george-zimmerman-s-history-of-911-calls-a-complete-log.html

Case closed.

were they all black ?

Michael Madison .... what now racebaitors?

foxmannumber1 says

upisdown
says

And you can't now or ever prove that to be true

With the FBI and DOJ breathing down GZ's neck for the past 17 months I'm
pretty sure they would have found 'something' by now and made it public to
continue their persecution. They have nothing and they know it.

So what, that doesn't mean that GZ didn't at some point in time in his life partake in drugs or even deal drugs. He was never charged or convivted of such behavior(just like TM ironically) and yet you claim to know as fact that TM did.

But it's really more about posting vile remarks on the net to try and tick people off and somehow eke out some nickels for it, isn't it?????

foxmannumber1 says

With the FBI and DOJ breathing down GZ's neck for the past 17 months I'm pretty sure they would have found 'something' by now and made it public to continue their persecution. They have nothing and they know it.

It's almost like they think he's likely to do something, and they're following him and are confronting him and asking him what he's up to.

Blurtman says

Bellingham Bill says

>"original agressor" - you are fabricating.

not in the slightest. Martin hadn't done a fucking thing to Zimmerman before

Zimmerman decided to follow him in his car

Following is not aggressing. So yes, you ae fabricating.

No, It's Stalking. Also, a condo patrol is not a LEO. He was also told to stay away. When you follow somebody, it's not stand your ground.

If somebody jumps me in the park and I blast them, it's "SYG".
If *I* follow a shady looking character around the park (or development or whatever) and then start barking questions at him, and then he punches me, then I shoot him, that is not standing ground.

that may be why that stand ground law was never mentioned in the trial ... only mentioned by the lefty racebaitors in DC and mass media. maybe?

also, nobody had to tell GZ to take an active roll in the public safety of his area, so why should he listen to someone sitting safely at their desk, where there is no crime issue, if they suggest he just sits back and takes it some more? Those in control don't like the idea of individual liberty.

thunderlips11 says

No, It's Stalking.

nope. stalking has a check list like sexual herrassment does.

thunderlips11 says

No, It's Stalking. Also, a condo patrol is not a LEO. He was also told to stay away. When you follow somebody, it's not stand your ground.

If somebody jumps me in the park and I blast them, it's "SYG".

If *I* follow a shady looking character around the park (or development or whatever) and then start barking questions at him, and then he punches me, then I shoot him, that is not standing ground.

Nothing GZ did was considered stalking. Following someone for 5 minutes while on the phone with a NEN operator does not qualify. The prosecutors did not use the word 'stalking' once during GZ's m2 trial. People do not call to have the police show up right before committing murder.

A NEN or 911 operator can't issue a legal command, over the phone or otherwise. A police officer can't issue a legal command over the phone, as the person on the other end has no way to verify the police officers status.

GZ did not employ a SYG defense. SYG was only mentioned in passing when discussing GZ's school classes.

You are wrong in both scenarios you list. It is self defense in both of them.

foxmannumber1 says

GZ did not employ a SYG defense. SYG was only mentioned in passing when
discussing GZ's school classes.

The jurors did though, as it was admitted in an interview of a juror by Anderson Cooper. And, she admitted that it was based upon GZ's words/statements in a police interview that should never been admissable because his words weren't subject to verification/cross examination.

Who's worse, the dumbest of FL on the jury, or the incompetent prosecutor the same people elected?

Bap33 says

Michael Madison .... what now racebaitors?

google Michael Madison bodies

COOPER: Because of the two options you had, second degree murder or manslaughter, you felt neither applied?

JUROR: Right. Because of the heat of the moment and the Stand Your Ground. He had a right to defend himself. If he felt threatened that his life was going to be taken away from him or he was going to have bodily harm, he had a right.

The juror is confusing SYG and self defense. There is no SYG when you're pinned beneath someone who is punching you and slamming your head into the concrete.

I'm sure GZ was properly mirandized. Anything he said before then or after does not need to be "verified" or "cross examined" before it can be considered evidence by a jury. GZ said plenty during multiple police interviews and chose not to take the stand during his trial. It's was his right to do both of those things.

I don't think the jury was dumb. I think they made the correct choice. TM was largely responsible for this own death.

This is America, ghetto black people will scream "racism" any opportunity they get. Not because it applies, but because their racist leaders tell them it is. If Al Sharpton tells poor blacks to jump, they do. Herd mentality.

foxmannumber1 says

I'm sure GZ was properly mirandized. Anything he said before then or after
does not need to be "verified" or "cross examined" before it can be considered
evidence by a jury.

I don't think the jury was dumb. I think they made the correct choice. TM was
largely responsible for this own death.

Really, "Mirandized"????? "Any statement can and will be used against you", remember that from watching L A LAw???? To bad that the show couldn't have taught you some real info.

It's heresay that's not subject to verification/cross examination, and if the prosecutor were even remotely bright, wouldn't allowed any of his interview statements to have been entered. You have the right to not incriminate yourself, but not to advance your theory of defense. That's why the burden of proof is on the state/prosecutor.

But, it's Florida...............the land of paranoid and lazy boomers. Now they'll NEVER come out after dark(as if they did anyway).