patrick.net

The venom is warranted, in most cases.

I don't think they are evil people as a whole, but the real estate
system as it is today creates a conflict of interest for the realtor.

The higher the price their client pays for a home, the higher the commission
is for them. Some may think that this is fine, this is america blah blah blah.

I don't think this is o.k as most people don't view realtor in the same
manner as they do used car salesman, but that's really what they are.
Most people think realtors are actually trying to help them !

Realtors are scumbags, that's why there is venom towards them. Break up the cartel and maybe people will ease up a bit. Right now it's forceful extortion performed by a group that are comprised mostly of self-serving, lying, piece-of-shit morons.

If we simply killed every Realtor, aka used house salesman, who told prospective buyers that real estate doesn't fall in value during the bubble (or last week...), or that "we're at the bottom so now is a great time to buy" at any time since 2007, perhaps they'd be less than totally untrustworthy on average, and in any event 99% fewer in number. (DISCLAIMER: Not legal advice, I am not suggesting you go out and kill a Realtor, even if our society would be better off if you did.)

Nomograph says

Realtors are highly trained and educated professionals. They should be considered in the same category as astrophysicists and neurosurgeons. A six percent commission is too low, and should be raised to 15 or 20, although they will probably refuse the extra money out of modesty or donate it to charity.

Yea, I wanted to be a realtor but wasn't able to make it through a six week course. So I got my Bachelor's Degree instead. The problem as I see it is that realtors don't do a whole helluva lot, and a person could educate themselves on the process and save that comission - or at least half of it. The buyer pays more for the house because of the realtor or the seller receives less money, and the incentive is for the realtor to get a higher sales price so they'll get more money.

If they must be involved, they should get a flat fee and that's it. They're helpful if they're honest and help people who move in/out of town. Otherwise, they don't do anything that the buyer/seller couldn't do without 'em. If there are questions, hire a RE attorney by the hour. At least they're required to actually know their stuff and have a bit of education behind them (sorry Nomo, I realize you're a huge fan of realtors).

Realtors are only a part of the problem. It's the system. American society is build on the foundation of public debt. Govt,banks,realtors and many more benefit from higher public debt. It's the debtor who becomes slave. If something goes wrong(bubble pops,deficit increases,insurance-health care cost increases etc.) then pass it on to public as well. America needs a revolution to change the system.

elliemae says

If there are questions, hire a RE attorney by the hour. At least they’re required to actually know their stuff and have a bit of education behind them

Such a sad testament to the current state of our RE industry. Per-hour realtards make more than RE attorneys, yet they are nothing more than glorified crooks.

robertoaribas says

Well, my telling clients that home prices would drop has almost killed my real estate business over the past 4 years…
Oh well, thank goodness I’m also a college professor.

If your day job starts incentivizing you to screw over your students (not literally screw, though there is nothing wrong with that;), then our college education system would be completely fucked. Real Estate is one of the most crooked businesses that exist. On all levels.

klarek says

If your day job starts incentivizing you to screw over your students (not literally screw, though there is nothing wrong with that;), then our college education system would be completely fucked.

Hmmm,

States going broke, families and students going into education loan hock up to their eyeballs to pay school expenses for liberal arts & business degrees, etc., college professors in liberal arts and business school departments at public universities with golden pensions ("Golden Fleece" more like it).

Whaddacall that kind of education system?

sybrib says

Whaddacall that kind of education system?

Imperfect, but a thousand times better than the real estate industry. But like RE, the college system has been whored by easy lending which increases demand as well as cost.

RE industry is broken when it comes to honesty and accountability.

"There are other offers, will you go higher with your offer ?"

For those who said no, they saw the home go back on market for months later.

thomas.wong1986 says

RE industry is broken when it comes to honesty and accountability.
“There are other offers, will you go higher with your offer ?”
For those who said no, they saw the home go back on market for months later.

By no means I am realtor fan but then there is always 1 guy to fall in that trap. So whose fault it is? and if the guy defaults who pays the burden on the system?

realtors are, generally, the most horrible people i've had the displeasure of meeting in day to day life.
lying, cheating, self interested, doing/saying anything to get a commission; but with the thin facade of trying to help you out.
i'm sure many realtors would throw their mom down a staircase if they could make a commission.

i have met some great realtors, but they are few and far between. the sleazy shitbag is way more common.
if i were a realtor (thankfully i'm not), i would be embarrassed to tell people my about my thieving occupation.

bubblesitter says

By no means I am realtor fan but then there is always 1 guy to fall in that trap. So whose fault it is

His agent is getting a lot of money and should be looking out for the client's best interests. Short of a public awareness campaign to let the public know that the opposite is true, I don't think you can fault the folk for not knowing what low-life criminal fucks realtors are.

I know some good Realtors- honest, trustworthy, reliable. Problem is they they assume most others are the same way they are. They are not aggressive, in the sense that they don't question their counterparts in the industry. Thereby letting less scrupulous ones spoil the industry as a whole, albeit unintentionally.

Gratned, I am working from a small sample size, but I guess the poin of my post is that reators are not ALL bad - but those that aren't beyond telling a few white lies to get you to buy are the ones that tend to be most visible.

On the whole its a shame, because in the general population, most trust their Realtor in the same unquestioning way that one would trust their doctor.

The case with realtors is not just few bad apples there are some good realtors but very few and far between.

Like I said earlier there is a conflict of interest, in order for a Realtor to maximize his profit he must push his client to highest priced home a bank is willing to lend to the perspective client. Therefore a Realtor is nothing more than a used car salesman or any other type of salesman.

I know they like to portray themselves as simple brokers between the sellers and the buyers but their role is far more involved than that.

I know it's harder for the Realtor out there right now but some are still up to their old scams. I have also seen Realtors rip minorities off the worst and most often. Heck just last week a home sold in my neighborhood for the full asking price, this a home that needed tons of rehab to make it live in worthy(garage door broken in half, trash in the bakyard, etc). I was wondering who would buy such a crappy house for full asking price, and it mystified me. Then I walked by the place and saw a minority couple had bought it and that explained it all.

Realtors are scum!

Realtors were and are ground zero of the housing bubble and the great recession.

Everybody is blaming banks, mortgage brokers and Wall St, but realtors hold a very large part of the responsibility. They are the foot-soldiers of doom.

Nomograph says

justme says

Realtors were and are ground zero of the housing bubble and the great recession.

Incorrect.
Bankers, the repeal of Glass-Stegal, and the ability to profit from lending and then sell the risk as mortgage-backed securities were the key drivers. Unregulated free markets always self-destruct.
If RE agents caused the bubble, then it would have happened years and years ago.
Don’t let hatred and emotion prevent you from seeing the actual facts.

Here we go again. What point does the circle starts?

Nomograph says

If RE agents caused the bubble, then it would have happened years and years ago.

What really screwed things up was the introduction of no-down SISA negative-am financing.

Realtors are by design first in line on the buy side in real estate, so this crazy financing gave them the power to buy and hold as much real estate as they wanted.

I went on a ski trip in Jan 2005 to Lake Tahoe and a friend of friend happened to be a NV realtor telling us how great his ~20 house empire in Reno and environs was doing. Inside I wanted to stab a fork into his face, but I just wanly smiled instead because by then I knew we had at least the '89 ~ '93 style price recession ahead of us.

Realtors provide useful services to sellers, but other than that they are one of the bigger leeches in the System. In 10 years though they will be more disintermediated than they are now. Zillow only got going in 2003 IIRC.

Nomograph says

APOCALYPSEFUCK says

I’ve been following financial crime for nearly 30 years for reasons that can’t be discussed in public

Can we discuss it if I promise to wear my tin foil hat?

...and so he mentions it anonymously on the interwebs. You know, it's a series of tubes with wires that lead back to the original poster. Right now, in a little office somewhere deep within the CIA, someone is following the exact wire that leads to his non-descript home in an unassuming neighborhood. The place will be surrounded........ NOW! (stay away from the windows, AF)

I can't tell you any more, they'll have to kill me.

Nomograph says

bubblesitter says

Here we go again. What point does the circle starts?

Do you really think that, on the whole, RE agents are smart enough to engineer this debacle?

It didn't require any smarts on their part, just rampant greed and utter disregard for the well being of ones neighbors. Very simple.

Nomograph says

It sounds to me like you got taken in by an RE agent during the bubble. Angry much?

Anybody that's ever been through the selling process has been effectively gang-raped by agents and brokers.

The culpability of agents (that is, NAR) cannot be understated when it comes to the bubble. Just like the zero-down, buy-a-house-now lenders that were urging every schmuck with a pulse to take out a risky mortgage, you had agents our there peddling people to use their services which came out of the sellers' end. This was orchestrated through NAR, via their goons (brokers) to write the brokerage contracts so that the sellers' commission is either split between two agents, or the seller's agent himself gets to double-dip on it (which should be illegal). On top of that you have the absolutely LOL talking points issued by NAR over the years urging people to buy before it's too late, and that housing doubles every ten years.

There are so many lies, distortions, and flat-out "fuck the customer" attitudes amongst realtors, I'm surprised you guys haven't been driven into the sea by the angry public. I guess it helps when you control the debate through expensive lobbying, propaganda, and a cartel.

This thread illustrates very well that there are a lot of insecure people here. This obsession with real estate agents is comical. Funny thing, I have never been intimidated into purchasing or selling real estate by any agent. The reason? I don't allow anyone to "sell" me anything that I don't want. What on earth are you people afraid of? Do you live in fear that an agent is going to talk you into buying something against your will? By the way, this is a free country the last time I checked. If you don't want to deal with agents, sell your property yourself and buy only from for sale by owners. However, make very sure that you take your Mommy with you so that greedy seller doesn't force you to buy something you don't want. LOL !!

Yes, we're all insecure. Just like how we resent people that scam the elderly, it's not because we resent highway robbery and the system those crooks create to take from decent but ignorant people, it's because we secretly are those ignorant people. Thank you for exposing the truth!

And you know damn well how rigged the system is. It's extremely difficult to buy or sell without coughing up money to some pond scum realtor.

I went to an open house yesterday. Here is the conversation I had with her.

Agent: Welcome, are you looking to buy?
Me: No, I am just assessing.
Agent: That's good.
Me: How many $/sq.ft.
Agent: It does not work that way for this property because blah,blah....
...Gives me a list of property in the block.
Me: I am interested in properties couple of 3 or block away as they are better neighborhood than this.
Agent: Actually this property is better than that neighborhood as it is cheaper than the other neighborhood and has access to same school district(this was a tipping point during the conversation)

At that point I ended my conversation as I thought it was heating up little bit. For the good of American society these guys should be removed from the real estate buying/selling process.

klarek says

And you know damn well how rigged the system is. It’s extremely difficult to buy or sell without coughing up money to some pond scum realtor.

Are you saying you don't have the intelligence to work around those evil, scheming Realtors in such a way that your interests would be protected?

Nomograph says

It’s about as comical as your obsession with liberals, welfare, and Hitler.

I'm accused of being "obsessed" with Hitler, when in reality, it's people like you that are constantly referring to him. Please copy and paste my posts that prove my "obsession" with Hitler. Don't hold your breath folks, there aren't any. This challenge has been made in the past and there has been zero response.

RayAmerica says

Are you saying you don’t have the intelligence to work around those evil, scheming Realtors in such a way that your interests would be protected?

It doesn't take intelligence. Just because some mob goons are running the markets doesn't mean that you're an idiot if you fall prey to them.

First, it requires one to have knowledge of the system. Your typical first time buyer/seller has no clue how rigged it is. Those who are experienced don't want to fight it. That is, you goons have it so rigged that they can't stomach going around it. In the buyer's case, there is nothing they can do about it since the commission is set up from the sellers' end. This is to prevent a sea of buyers from finding their own house (which they already do, online) and gaining access to them. The agency contracts are written from the sellers' end specifically to keep the customers from winning.

Second, it requires time. I'm getting my RE license, and I have to say that for a three week crash course, it's pretty hilarious every time realleeches compare themselves to doctors or lawyers in terms of training and service.

Your contribution to the sales process has been marginalized, all while your commissions have skyrocketed. If you lack the general self-awareness to see this, then you are in fact part of the majority of scumbag realtors who taint your industry.

klarek says

The agency contracts are written from the sellers’ end specifically to keep the customers from winning.

Really? Ever hear of Buyer's Agency? Or haven't you gotten that far in your "course" yet?

klarek says

It doesn’t take intelligence.

klarek says

I’m getting my RE license

ROFL !!!

RayAmerica says

Really? Ever hear of Buyer’s Agency?

You know that buyer's agency is pure bullshit. If the seller isn't paying, the buyer coughs it up at the closing table. Of course, the agent will likely steer the buyer away from that house period since they only give a shit about their own interests. Pond scum, that's what you are.

RayAmerica says

Or haven’t you gotten that far in your “course” yet?

Done with the class, fuckhead.

Klarek sounds very intelligent and well adjusted .... a really nice addition to Patrick.net. Klarek, have you ever considered a career as a writer? You have a unique talent. I mean, I'm sure you'll make a great real estate agent, being that you have such a pleasing personality and all, but as a writer the sky is the limit for you (not only that, I'm sure you'd succeed in anything you try). Please consider your options. Imagine the world not knowing a writing talent like yours. A tragedy of unspeakable proportions.

RayAmerica says

This thread illustrates very well that there are a lot of insecure people here. This obsession with real estate agents is comical. Funny thing, I have never been intimidated into purchasing or selling real estate by any agent. The reason? I don’t allow anyone to “sell” me anything that I don’t want. What on earth are you people afraid of? Do you live in fear that an agent is going to talk you into buying something against your will? By the way, this is a free country the last time I checked. If you don’t want to deal with agents, sell your property yourself and buy only from for sale by owners. However, make very sure that you take your Mommy with you so that greedy seller doesn’t force you to buy something you don’t want. LOL !!

Ray--it's not very often that we agree so I have to comment when it happens. I don't think realtors are worth 6% necessarily, but anyone who pays too much for a house because their realtor says there may be another offer out there deserves whatever they get.

I think it was Twain that said-- "A fool and his money are soon parted".

He is perfectly sane if he dislikes realtors. Anger is a totally legitimate response to the utter dishonesty most of them display. How did these useless squatters get a reasonable position in society? A whore is more honest.

RayAmerica says

I mean, I’m sure you’ll make a great real estate agent

Don't assume your profession is so coveted. I'd sooner die than work to fuck people over like you do.

I'm just getting my license because I'm sick of you fucks robbing people (see above: how us stupid people can get around you assholes). I have a normal job and only plan on doing RE not-for-profit. If I can save a friend or family member thousands of dollars while depriving some piece of shit agent that commission, then as far as I'm concerned, justice is served.

It was actually my dealings with a few realtors that inspired me to start this site. I just could not believe that the system actually worked the way they were telling me, namely, that everyone borrows as much as possible and it's all OK because housing always goes up, and I should get my bid in right away, like NOW because otherwise I'd be locked out forever.

One thing was true though. Most people really do borrow as much as possible, whenever they can.

bubblesitter says

I went to an open house yesterday. Here is the conversation I had with her.
Agent: Welcome, are you looking to buy?
Me: No, I am just assessing.
Agent: That’s good.
Me: How many $/sq.ft.
Agent: It does not work that way for this property because blah,blah….
…Gives me a list of property in the block.
Me: I am interested in properties couple of 3 or block away as they are better neighborhood than this.
Agent: Actually this property is better than that neighborhood as it is cheaper than the other neighborhood and has access to same school district(this was a tipping point during the conversation)
At that point I ended my conversation as I thought it was heating up little bit. For the good of American society these guys should be removed from the real estate buying/selling process.

Are you kidding me? You sound like a complete ass. You come to an open house that you have no intention of buying and proceed to criticize it to the selling agent? All the agent did was point out the positives of that property--that's selling 101. Highlight the positives while minimizing the negatives...

Nice dodge, by the way. Don't want to address the inherent conflict of interest that NAR has created, let alone the system that screws your customers? Can't blame you. Go ahead, attack me for being a mean person.

It was actually my dealings with a few realtors that inspired me to start this site.

Ah Patrick, you're just jealous. realtors are too smart for you!

tatupu70 says

bubblesitter says

I went to an open house yesterday. Here is the conversation I had with her.

Agent: Welcome, are you looking to buy?

Me: No, I am just assessing.

Agent: That’s good.

Me: How many $/sq.ft.

Agent: It does not work that way for this property because blah,blah….

…Gives me a list of property in the block.

Me: I am interested in properties couple of 3 or block away as they are better neighborhood than this.

Agent: Actually this property is better than that neighborhood as it is cheaper than the other neighborhood and has access to same school district(this was a tipping point during the conversation)

At that point I ended my conversation as I thought it was heating up little bit. For the good of American society these guys should be removed from the real estate buying/selling process.

Are you kidding me? You sound like a complete ass. You come to an open house that you have no intention of buying and proceed to criticize it to the selling agent? All the agent did was point out the positives of that property–that’s selling 101. Highlight the positives while minimizing the negatives…

Look at my username. Do I seem like a realtor friendly guy? I just went there to just say the agent "good luck selling you f...ing house, a$$hole"

just could not believe that the system actually worked the way they were telling me, namely, that everyone borrows as much as possible and it’s all OK because housing always goes up, and I should get my bid in right away, like NOW because otherwise I’d be locked out forever.

Uh, I don't mean any disrespect, but isn't that kind of what the adult life is all about? That is, people attempting to seperate you from your money, etc.? Caveat Emptor .... buyer beware. If you aren't an educated buyer in any market, don't hold others accountable if you end up buying a bridge in Brooklyn.

bubblesitter says

Look at my username. Do I seem like a realtor friendly guy? I just went there to just say the agent “good luck selling you f…ing house, a$$hole”

Whatever floats your boat. But why come here and complain then? Clearly, you were the asshole...

tatupu70 says

bubblesitter says

Look at my username. Do I seem like a realtor friendly guy? I just went there to just say the agent “good luck selling you f…ing house, a$$hole”

Whatever floats your boat. But why come here and complain then? Clearly, you were the asshole…

I think you are an asshole. What is the subject/title of this thread? What are other guys on this thread saying about Realtors? If you don't have anything negative for Realtors than you are wasting you time on this thread.