patrick.net

Dan8267 says

'Nuff said.

And he said to himself, Oh Magoo your good.

SoftShell says

Where did we learn that from?

Oh yeah....when "marriage" was redefined by the left.

Thanks for the lesson!

OK, you conservatives win. We'll use only the original definition of marriage:
An arrangement between one man and any number of 6 to 16 year-old girls he buys from their fathers in exchange for a number of goats determined by the fertility of the girl. The arrangement transfers the right to beat the girl from the father to the husband.

Happy?

Somebody wrote a headline based on their opinion for the impetus for a sound reasonable act. And you post it as proof of what?

Dan why aren't you protesting Drivers license and voters registration cards? We've already got voters registration cards, why don't we just make them more official with your photo, actually while we're at it. How about a national ID card, that can double as your Voters Registration, your SSN, and any other Federal ID needs.

CaptainShuddup says

Yeah just look at education, that mess was created by the educated and educators.

The mess of our schooling system, especially college, was created by lack of regulation in the industry. Essentially, corporations called universities were able to gain government subsidies without price controls. This led to skimming vast quantities of wealth from tuition. The teachers get paid jack diddly. The money goes to the executives.

Add our corrupt and greedy banking system to the mix, and it's no wonder why schooling is unaffordable.

sbh says

This village idiot likes the way some things sound but he doesn't know what they mean.

There is a purpose in ridiculing the village idiot. The purpose is to make sure others don't take up his mantle.

sbh says

You have admirable patience Dan, but he cannot learn. He cannot grasp his ignorance. This village idiot likes the way some things sound but he doesn't know what they mean. He likes to contest the claims of others but is terrified of number and the act of counting so he relies on obfuscation and deceit . He likes name-calling but automatically accuses others of ad hominem and projection. No matter how you throw the bones it's always the same when confronting indigence and his ignorance.

Here with have a severe case of projection.

indigenous says

projection

projection = insert witty comeback here, for I haven't the creativity to think of one

Why do liberals hate poor people so much that they want to keep them living in shadows without an ID?

If a person can't get the most basic of necessities to FUNCTION in life (i.e. an ID) they can't get a job, go to school, get married, fly on a plane, leave the country, cash a check.......let alone vote in many States.

Why do liberals believe American citizens are so dumb or incapable of getting one of life's basic necessities........and want to keep them that way?

Can any liberal name a single OECD or 1st world country that doesn't require ID to vote?

socal2 says

Why do liberals hate poor people so much that they want to keep them living in shadows without an ID?

We don't. We want to make sure poor people can still vote, even poor people who want to vote Republican. That's why we aren't hypocrites like assholes like you.

Make the ID free. Make sure the lack of ID doesn't prevent any legitimate votes. If a legitimate voter without an ID tries to vote, verify his identify on the spot, give him a free ID, and let him vote. Make it quick, simple, and painless and you can have all the IDs you want.

Of course, that's not what Republican scum want. If the voter ID laws don't prevent legal voters from casting their votes, there is no point in those laws. The only purpose those laws serve is to rig elections by preventing legal votes.

socal2 says

Why do liberals believe American citizens are so dumb or incapable of getting one of life's basic necessities........and want to keep them that way?

It is only you scumbag conservatives who are calling people like Mrs. Troth dumb. And quite frankly, it's despicable and deplorable that you would call her dumb or blame her from not being able to get an ID after the enormous ordeal she went through several times attempting to get that ID. And to blame this poor old woman for the incompetence and callousness attitude of the state bureaucracy standing in the way of her getting an ID is a just plain fucking dick move on your part.

Read this story before you go shooting off your mouth about how only stupid and incompetent people don't have photo IDs.

And then ask yourself why the state doesn't want these people to have IDs. Sure, there are people advocating that the IDs be required to vote, but those people aren't advocating getting all voters these IDs. And that is why they are Unamerican scum. There is nothing more Unamerican than taking grandma's vote away. That's just low, even for a conservative.

Dan8267 says

This

This fact that three conservatives disliked the link to a story of an old woman trying to get a voter ID tells you all you need to know about what kind of people conservatives are. They will throw granny under the bus for a dime.

Dan8267 says

We don't. We want to make sure poor people can still vote, even poor people who
want to vote Republican

But you don't want to make sure poor people can get jobs or go to school Dan. You are not helping people by encouraging them to live in the shadows with no ID.

But... but... but you got a video of an old lady in a population of 300+ million who can't manage to get an ID. Therefore our massive country has to have ridiculous loose voter requirements like we are a 3rd world country or something.

Instead of advocating for a more efficient government to provide ID's for the tiny percentage of voters who don't have IDs, unthinking Liberals seem to want no ID's at all. What a solution!

Are all these countries racists for requiring ID's to vote?
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/blogpost/post/voter-id-proponents-point-to-laws-in-other-countries/2012/07/12/gJQAVlGCfW_blog.html

socal2 says

But you don't want to make sure poor people can get jobs or go to school Dan.

No, you ignorant slut, I DO want poor people to get an education and a productive, gainful job that lifts them out of poverty. Hell, I want housewives who aren't working to have an education, in case they vote, serve on a jury, or have to do any other civic duty.

socal2 says

You are not helping people by encouraging them to live in the shadows with no ID.

I'm not encouraging them to live with no ID. I'm making a hard stand that they should not be deprived of their Constitutional rights for not having one. And I'm stating that if the state wants them to have such an ID so god-damned badly, the state can take the steps needed to make sure they have that ID by verifying the identities of all these people and giving them the ID for free and quickly.

Read the story of Mrs. Troth, I posted. She went through way more shit than an old person on a respirator should ever have to go through, and she was still denied an ID by the state. The burden of proof that a person cannot vote should be on the state, not the individual.

And don't give me any crap that the state has no idea who Mrs. Toth is. I bet they had no problem collecting taxes from her and her husband for 45 years.

socal2 says

But... but... but you got a video of an old lady in a population of 300+ million who can't manage to get an ID.

I've also posted multiple sources of evidence that show that the voter ID laws violates and is intended to violate the rights of over 1 MILLION Americans. That isn't small shit, especially when those voters are in key districts.

So 1 million+ legal voters denied the right to vote to prevent ten cases of in-person voter fraud. Meanwhile, do nothing about absentee voter fraud, which is orders of magnitudes higher, because those fraudulent votes favor Republicans.

And why exactly can't the state get all these voters proper IDs if it's so damn important to the state?

socal2 says

Instead of advocating for a more efficient government to provide ID's for the tiny percentage of voters who don't have IDs, unthinking Liberals seem to want no ID's at all.

No, what we want is to make sure that scumbag politicians don't rig elections with voter suppression like they have throughout the majority of our country's history from 1776 to 1964, if not till this very day (see war on drugs).

The thing is, if Democrats were pulling this illegal Stalinist shit, we liberals would be bitching at them. It just so happens that only Republicans are this fucking slimy.

socal2 says

Are all these countries racists for requiring ID's to vote?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/blogpost/post/voter-id-proponents-point-to-laws-in-other-countries/2012/07/12/gJQAVlGCfW_blog.html

Do those countries go out of their way to make sure that certain people can't get voter IDs? Or do they try to make sure every voter has an ID regardless of their politics or race?

Oh, and since you brought up race... The primary purpose of the War on Drugs was to keep blacks from voting. White Americans are more likely than black Americans to have used most kinds of illegal drugs, including cocaine, marijuana and LSD. Yet blacks are far more likely to go to prison for drug offenses. Such a discrepancy can only be explained by racism and is, by definition, racial discrimination.

We liberals believe that all persons are equal under law. And that's a concept you conservatives will never embrace. That's why conservatives aren't real Americans.

Dan8267 says

No, you ignorant slut, I DO want poor people to get an education and a
productive, gainful job that lifts them out of poverty.

Dress it up all you want Dan.

But this is just another unthinking Liberal position that enables people to live off the grid.

Less than .003% of the population can't get it together to have an ID to vote, so liberals think the solution is that we must have 3rd world voting regulations.

There are many ways to get granny her ID card to vote, paid for by the gov...
The only viable reason there is pushback on voter ID cards is the illegal immigrant vote.
They are the only group that are present to vote, without any kind of citizenship verification.
So, which party benefits from the illegal immigrant vote?
Which party opposes voter ID?
Case Closed.

socal2 says

Instead of advocating for a more efficient government to provide ID's for the tiny percentage of voters who don't have IDs, unthinking Liberals seem to want no ID's at all. What a solution!

socal2 says

Dress it up all you want Dan.

But this is just another unthinking Liberal position that enables people to live off the grid.

Dodge, dodge, dodge. And don't address any of the evidence that proves you wrong.

At least when I post something on this site, I am completely honest and sincere. From your post, I can tell you don't give a rat's ass about being honest.

SoftShell says

The only viable reason there is pushback on voter ID cards is the illegal immigrant vote.

Illegal immigrants don't do in-person voter fraud. It is highly risky. They have much to lose. And there is no benefit because you'd have to repeat the act hundreds of times to have even a margin impact in the polls and tens of thousands of times to influence an election.

In contrast, absentee ballots are far less risky and allow for orders of magnitudes of more influence.

Put simply, you are full of bull.

http://www.youtube.com/embed/FmMVe763Sbc

SoftShell says

The only viable reason there is pushback on voter ID cards is the illegal immigrant vote.

This claim is moronic. You are clueless -- the number of undocumented immigrants who try to vote is almost non-existent. No undocumented immigrant wants to vote without authorization because it could jeopardize any potential immigration relief they have because it'd be a false claim to citizenship. If you make a false claim to citizenship, it doesn't matter how good your immigration relief claim is -- you're mostly fucked.

Ironically, people who don't understand immigration law are the most likely to make stupid claims about it. The concept of so-called "anchor babies" is another one -- it's almost insurmountable to get relief on a claim like this, but ignorant ideologues repeat that term whenever they are trying to make a flawed argument.

Yep, The Young Turks video says it all. The facts are indisputable, but that won't stop conservatives from lying. Damn conservatives could tell a truth even if it was in their own damn interest. They are pathological liars.

Hmmm...It appears you are living a sheltered life.
One of hundreds of examples....

http://www.youtube.com/embed/2hjmKBfrycQ#t=105

Dan8267 says

SoftShell says

The only viable reason there is pushback on voter ID cards is the illegal immigrant vote.

Illegal immigrants don't do in-person voter fraud. It is highly risky. They have much to lose. And there is no benefit

For the most part the benefit is not in the polls. it is in the immigrants pocket in the form of cash.

Dan8267 says

And there is no benefit because you'd have to repeat the act hundreds of times to have even a margin impact in the polls

What also is moronic is the left's resistance to, and reasons to suppress voter/national ID cards.
A national ID card can serve multiple purposes...so easy to cost-effectively implement with today's technology....
You'll have to provide another avenue of reasoning as to why such a thing is bad for the country.
Suppressing votes doesn't fly.

corntrollio says

the number of undocumented immigrants who try to vote is almost non-existent.

SoftShell says

One of hundreds of examples...

I noticed a hell of a lot of details missing. Did the people in question fill out the voter applications or were their identities simply stolen? No answer. How many of the hundreds of names turned out to be non-citizens? Which of the non-citizens voted in-person, if any, and which voted through absentee ballot. If the problem is with the voter registration database, how would a voter ID solve this problem? Non-citizens in the voter database would simply get the voter ID.

Additionally, your video does not address any of the facts presented by The Young Turks.

1- Illegal Immigrants (II's) routinely lie to obtain employment.
2- II's that obtain employment commit perjury when they sign the I-9 form supplied by their employer.
3- II's have broken the law by simply being in the USA
4- II's lie to obtain medical care
5- II's lie when obtaining food stamps
6- II's lie when obtaining unemployment benefits
7- II's lie when registering to vote.

The reason you don't see much of this in the news is due to liberal media bias in reporting it, and due to Hispanic backlash if they did report it.

Democratic party spokesmen justify their opposition to laws requiring proof of citizenship in order to register to vote by the absurd claim that poor people do not have birth certificates or passports. But we require everyone, including the poor, to produce such documents when becoming employed for their I-9 Forms. And if that is tolerable, then it must also be tolerable for the same documents to be produced to register to vote and some sort of photo ID in order to vote.
There is a huge problem with voter fraud. And, in my opinion, it is proven by the vehemence of the Democrats, the beneficiaries of the fraud, toward enforcement of our laws.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/howard-foster/democrats-benefit-from-illegal-immigrants-voting_b_1418523.html

Dan8267 says

SoftShell says

One of hundreds of examples...

I noticed a hell of a lot of details missing.

Wiggl Wagon (wigglwagons)
4
SUPER USER·42 Fans
Why should I have to provide ID to board an airplane? Surely that is no more important than voting. That just affects a few people's lives. Voting affects millions of people's lives.

What you are saying below is a red herring, as the voting system is currently setup to not require proof of citizenship...so how in the hell would we know?

corntrollio says

he number of undocumented immigrants who try to vote is almost non-existent.

bottom line:
LEGAL citizens benefit if ILLEGALS do not vote.
LEGAL citizens should be the ones making the decisions in this country.

SoftShell says

. But we require everyone, including the poor, to produce such documents when becoming employed for their I-9 Forms

Huffington post doesn't know what they are talking about. The I-9 doesn't require a birth certificate or a passport. You can use a ss card and pretty much any picture id including a student ID. Illegals all have fake ss cards and picture IDs anyway.

SoftShell says

What you are saying below is a red herring, as the voting system is currently setup to not require proof of citizenship...so how in the hell would we know?

corntrollio says

he number of undocumented immigrants who try to vote is almost non-existent.

Then how are you so sure they are voting?

SoftShell says

A national ID card can serve multiple purposes...so easy to cost-effectively implement with today's technology....

You'll have to provide another avenue of reasoning as to why such a thing is bad for the country.

Suppressing votes doesn't fly.

Who is going to pay for the national ID card?

SoftShell says

What also is moronic is the left's resistance to, and reasons to suppress voter/national ID cards.

A national ID card can serve multiple purposes...so easy to cost-effectively implement with today's technology....

Great idea, it worked terrific in communist and fascist countries. You seriously want the government to have more information about you then they already do or is this trolling bullshit?

control point says

SoftShell says

A national ID card can serve multiple purposes...so easy to cost-effectively implement with today's technology....

You'll have to provide another avenue of reasoning as to why such a thing is bad for the country.

Suppressing votes doesn't fly.

Who is going to pay for the national ID card?

Why not require passport to vote? It's not far fetched, and every citizen does have one, or at least should.

FortWayne says

Why not require passport to vote? It's not far fetched, and every citizen does have one, or at least should.

I just renewed my passport, it cost $110. Would you change the burden of cost to the issuer if making a passport a requirement to vote?

control point says

Who is going to pay for the national ID card?

Other people!

Don't tax you, don't tax me!

Just tax the guy behind that tree!

Since a national ID card makes so much sense, I think a federal electronic gun registry also is a great idea: If one makes sense, so does the other!

FortWayne says

Why not require passport to vote? It's not far fetched, and every citizen does have one, or at least should.

There are 109 million passports for 311 million citizens. Not every citizen has one.

Iosef V HydroCabron says

Since a national ID card makes so much sense, I think a federal electronic gun registry also is a great idea: If one makes sense, so does the other!

It's different. No national gun registry is about freedom and being a rugged individualist standing up for your constitutional rights. Requiring a nation id is about, is about, is about oh hell never mind I forgot I can't figure out right wing logic.

We will transfer birth control funding away from the Sandra Flukes of the world and put it to better use implementing national ID cards with embedded iris imprints coupled with dna samples.

control point says

SoftShell says

A national ID card can serve multiple purposes...so easy to cost-effectively implement with today's technology....

You'll have to provide another avenue of reasoning as to why such a thing is bad for the country.

Suppressing votes doesn't fly.

Who is going to pay for the national ID card?

A national ID card would not contain any more information about anyone that the government doesn't already have.
Unless you have a specific example in mind...

bob2356 says

SoftShell says

What also is moronic is the left's resistance to, and reasons to suppress voter/national ID cards.

A national ID card can serve multiple purposes...so easy to cost-effectively implement with today's technology....

Great idea, it worked terrific in communist and fascist countries. You seriously want the government to have more information about you then they already do or is this trolling bullshit?

Agreed.
Surprised?

You can add gun registry information to the national ID card...have it all embedded on a chip with your iris scan and dna.

Iosef V HydroCabron says

Since a national ID card makes so much sense, I think a federal electronic gun registry also is a great idea: If one makes sense, so does the other!

With the world population increasing exponentially, terrorist organizations on the rise, international travel increasing, more borders opening up, it's only logical that at some future point there will be a World ID card.

Why not catch the wave of the future, develop and implement the technology before china/japan does so we can create jobs now and heal the middle class in this country.

SoftShell says

A national ID card would not contain any more information about anyone that the government doesn't already have.

SoftShell says

Why not catch the wave of the future, develop and implement the technology before china/japan does so we can create jobs now and heal the middle class in this country.

Following your "logic" to the end conclusion then It would be more logical to put it all on a encrypted chip and implant it rather than to implement it. No lost cards, no identity theft. The police could just walk around with RF scanners.

I think you should volunteer to be in the first test batch.

SoftShell makes a lot of assertions and provides little evidence. In contrast, independent commissions have study the alleged problem of in-person voter fraud and found only 13 cases in Pennsylvania. No solution that infringes upon a million person's voting rights in order to stop 13 illegal votes is rational. Hell 13 x 50 or 650 does not justify infringing a million legal votes.

And absentee ballet fraud is much, much more pervasive than in-person. There's more benefit to it. It scales more. And there's less risk. Yet, no conservative proposes preventing this fraud. If they really cared about stopping illegal votes, they would call for absentee ballots to be banned.

And when you get right down to it, most of SoftShell's complaints have nothing to do with voting or the illegality of immigrants and everything to do with immigration itself.

If the problem conservatives have with immigration is the illegality of it, then the solution is simple, quick, and easy. Make all immigration legal. Provide a free, quick path to citizenship. You want to be a U.S. citizen? Fill out a simple form and wowla, you're a tax paying citizen with a social security number.

Of course, this is not what conservatives want. They don't want immigrants to be legal. They want no more immigrants. And that's a perfectly fine position to take, if you are honest about it.

However, there are consequences to this like driving out all the profits that big farm makes using essentially slave labor. People in Florida will have to mow their own lawns like I do.

If conservatives had balls and honesty, they would simply come out against immigration, all immigration legal or not. Come up with a compelling case that America's population is already too high. Hell, I could make that case myself and have many times. But don't bullshit about immigration and voter law because you don't have the courage to defend the actual position you want.

The current system is the worst of all possibilities. We have massive amounts of immigration, yet
- the immigrants are doomed to live in poverty and thus use social resources payed by taxpayers
- children and adults are sent to countries they never knew
- the immigrants are abused by big farm and other corporations
- there is no tracking of people
- they don't pay taxes
- social funds like school funding is not allocated properly as a result
- more crime results from all the above, especially the poverty
- illegals are essentially treated as slaves or indentured servants with no legal rights

As much as conservatives want all the Mexicans to leave, they still need the Mexicans for cheap, slave labor. They just don't want to pay for the cost of keeping the slaves alive. That's why they don't want to solve the problem of immigration. They just want to use the issue to keep the immigrants powerless. They like the idea of a large population of slave labor that cannot vote or get benefits or a living wage. They like illegal immigration precisely because it dis-empowers and impoverishes multitudes of people. But they have to maintain the ruse that they are against it.

Conservatives, grow some balls and just come out against immigration itself.