patrick.net

Show me ASSHOLES where on the EIA site does it define US Product supplied Gasoline as "Gasoline Consumed"?

Here's the Gas consumed that's IF you're interested in facts.
And I gotta tell ya, I've known you assholes a long damn time now, and none of you bastards are least bit interested in FACTS!

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-x4oz1hCXrS0/UykP_VX9nqI/AAAAAAAADyQ/ofn24d6f9eE/s1600/Finished+Motor+Gasoline.jpg

http://www.americanfuels.net/2014/03/2013-gasoline-consumption.html

The EIA sure is mealy mouthed about it aren't they.

Here's another take on it, and none of the pages seem to say the same thing. They look more like propaganda charts than accurate data.
This page the timeline only goes to 2010, while at the bottom it clearly states it was updated in 2014.

http://www.eia.gov/dnav/pet/hist/LeafHandler.ashx?n=pet&s=mgfupus1&f=a

Well the EIA wouldn't want to spook the idiot bulls now would they?

Let em run and enjoy them selves. Now you idiots have ran your dumb asses right to the slaughter. Now get some, but the facts are still facts.

There are 1/3 mother fuckers driving on the road today, as I have been saying for years, while you Idiots were droning on and on about hybrids, hydrogen, and $5.00 gas tax to combat the imaginary foe of the billions of non existent cars on the roads. You've all been lied to and are as gullible as cute meat rabbit.

YOu get to that page by clicking on the 1945-2013 link.
http://www.eia.gov/dnav/pet/pet_cons_psup_a_EPM0F_VPP_mbbl_a.htm

Yet like I said it only goes to 2010.

So it turns out that my initially expressed skepticism towards the originally reported numbers was well founded.

The original numbers indicated a 60% drop in gasoline consumption from 2007 to 2013. It sounded much too good to be true, and it was. In fact, the claim made was completely false. Those numbers just showed a drop in gasoline sales from brand-name refineries to brand-name stations (Chevron, Texaco, BP, Valero, whatnot). It did not account for all refineries, brand-name or not, doing brisk business selling to no-brand statons like Arco, Coast, and the like.

Assuming that Shuddup's new and different source is correct, 2013 vs 2007 gasoline consumption dropped by a measly 5.5% (1-134.5/142.3).

One could wish that the orginal interpretation of the wrong data was true, but alas not. US gasoline consumption is STILL sky high. We need to do more. Everyone should be getting 50mpg average by now, not 22 or whatever the current lousy number is.

Call it Crazy says

Oh, look who shows up.... Did mommy allow you to borrow her computer for some computer time before you go off to daycare?

Goes to show that a liberal in day care has more common sense than a grown-up chicken-hawk neocon armchair warrior.

http://www.energytrendsinsider.com/columns/gagliardi/

By Lou Gagliardi on Jun 11, 2013 with 2 Comments
Slow Economic Growth Puts Gasoline Consumption in a Downward Spin

As we have built more fuel efficient transportation vehicles over the years, we have been able to curtail our consumption of motor gasoline and distillates – diesel. However even with more fuel efficient vehicles, our gasoline consumption as measured by the U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA) of total product supplied has been fairly stable since the 1980’s as more vehicles have come onto the road to offset greater fuel efficiency. Then in 2008, the Great Recession hit brought on by the financial crisis and the trend accelerated dramatically downward. By 2008 fuel consumption began to slide downward, by 2012 gasoline consumption literally fell off the cliff.

gas demand lags

The primary catalyst for the dramatic decline in motor gasoline demand has been weak economic growth in the U.S. that has been exacerbated by stubbornly high retail fuel prices pegged to relatively high crude prices, despite a deepening global recession.

http://www.api.org/policy-and-issues/policy-items/fuels-and-renewables/renewable-fuel-standard-facts

Here's the best one by far, that goes back to my first data that I presented as the facts.

This guy even comments on what was happening.

In this guys thread, that made the same argument I did.
All of the schills had to retract their harsh reactions.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-06-08/gas-prices-consumption-and-why-average-american-being-left-behind

Even in 2008 it was apparent that Gas was a government created bubble, fueled by misinfomation from the ministry of propaganda and people like our dear Bubble Boy.

http://www.agmrc.org/renewable_energy/energy/u-s-gasoline-consumption-decline-does-it-affect-potential-ethanol-demand/

According to this chart the country is in deep cheap gas doo doo.

If Flordia is a high consumption state, then the rest of nation must be on a drip feed. We're just not consuming the Gas to warrent the bubble of the last 8 years.

http://ourfiniteworld.com/2013/01/31/why-is-us-oil-consumption-lower-better-gasoline-mileage/

meh why Kill my self, you either get the point, or you're just a schill or an investor who has made a killing in the last 8 years.

There will be no changing your mind. So just consider this post for the Edification of Marcus, because he seems genuinely duped by you bastards.

bob2356 says

Refiners are less than 10% of the retail market. Here is total sales. http://www.eia.gov/dnav/pet/hist/LeafHandler.ashx?n=PET&s=C100000001&f=M. No they aren't sticking all that gas in cans behind the stations either.

The page you requested cannot be located. Due to a redesign of the website, many pages have been moved. You may click on the links below to access the default Navigator page.

Okay Captain, go to this link that I'm quoting from you. You'll see the daily number of gallons

CaptainShuddup says

Why don't you state where I'm wrong. What I said about Gas is what I got from the link you provided.

http://www.eia.gov/energyexplained/index.cfm?page=gasoline_use

Now go to the bottom of that page under FAQs to the link that says

"How much gasoline does the United States consume per year?

THen on the page that takes you to you'll find a link that says:

"Annual and monthly gasoline consumption data in thousand barrels per day"

hit that and you'll find this grapgh and table.

http://www.eia.gov/dnav/pet/hist/LeafHandler.ashx?n=pet&s=mgfupus1&f=a

You sure don't know how to be wrong gracefully.

CaptainShuddup says

According to this chart the country is in deep cheap gas doo doo

There I am in that red area--it's because of my '77 Mercury that gets 12 MPG on the highway and 7 in town!

CaptainShuddup says

Even in 2008 it was apparent that Gas was a government created bubble,

Brain just can't learn anymore eh ?

marcus says

What you have been observing isn't a scam, but rather a chain of cause and effect.

Markets are forward looking. So prices went up in fear that demand would exceed supply in the not too distant future, based on rapidly growing worldwide demand and the best projections of how well supply will keep up. Don't forget the global economy was booming back then (compared to now).

In response to prices going up, two things occur. More people buy smaller and or more efficient cars, including a lot of hybrid cars. Also they possibly drive less.

The other effect of higher prices is that it becomes more profitable to get harder to get oil out of the ground. Many of the costs associated with this are up front costs of new wells etc.

So now, several years later, the 2 big effects of higher prices are lower demand and higher supply.

I honestly see no conspiracy here, but rather textbook examples of incredibly obvious market forces at work.

CaptainShuddup says

Marcus, because he seems genuinely duped by you bastards.

No, I'm just not an idiot.

I think that you can probably understand that gas being so expensive for the past 7 years had a big impact on both supply and demand. Worldwide car manufacturing and buying were deeply affected, for all of those years. AS was opening of new wells etc. and the bringing oil to market to cash in on those high prices.

If this was all simply the result of manipulators, it doesn't change the impact that these prices had on both supply and demand. If you are right that it's all manipulation, shoulsn't a ridiculous excess of supply relative to demand have kicked in several years sooner ?

Do you understand my question ? THere must be what 5 years of excess supply out there ? Where do they store it ?

PErhaps we did it to supply aliens with some kind of oil derivative ?

marcus says

hit that and you'll find this grapgh and table.

http://www.eia.gov/dnav/pet/hist/LeafHandler.ashx?n=pet&s=mgfupus1&f=a

Incomplete in accruate data that does not line up with the misinformation you and bubbleman is trying to put forth.

Why do you people hate the truth.

You keep going back to that erroneous assumption based on incomplete data, that represents somethign totally different than what you guys even claim.

Also let's not forget, it's NOT in the EIA's best interest to help me make my argument for me. They are simply industry cheerleaders playing Swami with the data to support $5.00 gas.

Let's not forget they are blaming OPEC for natural market forces.

2010 was 5 years ago assholes!

CaptainShuddup says

http://ourfiniteworld.com/2013/01/31/why-is-us-oil-consumption-lower-better-gasoline-mileage/

That article refers to fewer miles traveled, but that's per person not total. Dan posted a graph above that shows the population adjusted miles traveld, and then I posted the one that shows total miles traveled.

It is intersting that that your article seems to show more of a drop in other uses of oil than gasoline. This is from your linked article.

Spint it baby! SPIN IT!

You could be wrong way more gracefully.

marcus says

It is intersting that that your article seems to show more of a drop in other uses of oil than gasoline. This is from your linked article.

That's the US OIL products consumption chart you fucking IDIOT. Well no you're not actually an Idiot, you're just being intentionally misleading. Which is far more sinister.

That US OIL Products consumption chart is why we can't stop producing unwanted and uneeded gasoline.

How does this graphic from your linked article line up with your thesis ?

None of your charts even show the slightest dip for any recession activity or spikes for the housing bubble. It's pure unadulterated Liberal Filth and nothing more.

You're scaring me man.

I would respect you more if you could find a way to own up to being wrong here. It's been an interesting thread. Everyone makes mistakes sometimes.

CaptainShuddup says

None of your charts even show the slightest dip for any recession

ACtually that last chart (YOUR CHART) does show changes due to recession but it's because of the scale that they don't seem significant.

THe line at the top of the green part is the same as the graph at the top of your article.

Because the other distillate and the all other in that chart, are in demand. And as I've been saying you guys are trying to sell the EIA Gasoline produced as gasoline consumed, while calling gasoline retail sales misinformation.

You guys have a serious comprehension of the supply chain deficit.

The refineries are making gasoline up the wazoo with no where to put it. What is actually being delivered to gas stations is way down for the first time in History, and you guys are trying to spin that with your typical Liberal filth.
"Oh you're just too stupid to understand."

You guys are Idiots not even worth the time it takes to argue with, as you're not the least bit interested in facts or the truth. You're just protecting the Liberal agenda at all cost.

marcus says

THe line at the top of the green part is the same as the graph at the top of your article.

I posted a lot of pages with a lot of facts. You cherry picked one insignifigant chart and posted it out of context.

Why don't you address this... http://patrick.net/?p=1274960&c=1164861#comment-1164861

CaptainShuddup says

None of your charts even show the slightest dip for any recession activity or spikes for the housing bubble. It's pure unadulterated Liberal Filth and nothing more.

Quite the contrary. The decrease in consumption (versus projected) was very much about the recession and also higher priced oil.

THis graph and the top of the green band are one and the same. Different scale. Again, from your linked page.

CaptainShuddup says

Why don't you address this...

IT's been addressed. THat's obviouly a strange metric.

Look, I'm not an expert on this, but I know how to make inferences. Apparently refining oil and selling oil at the retail level used to be more connected than they are now.

I'm guessing that one of the reasons that metric was tracked is simply that the data was not too difficult to obtain. But things changed a lot around 2011 - 2014.

Here I've got a suggestion for you. Why don't you admit that that retail refined gas number is completely and totally not representing the the amount of gasoline that the US consumes.

BUT - change your argument to the fact that this extreme drop in retail refinery oil is indicative of the way that the global liberal manipulation of oil came to an end.

In other words perhaps you can build a whole conspiracy thoery about how tha supply chain suddenly changed in 2012 - 2014 which is what allowed oil to finally come down to the real price that it should have been the whole time.

OF course this is really stupid, but it would make more sense than holding on to the idea that the metirc represents gas consumed.

marcus says

Look, I'm not an expert on this, but I know how to make inferences. Apparently refining oil and selling oil at the retail level used to be more connected than they are now.

Yeah it's called manipulation. Thickly obtuse much?

So, was it aliens ?

marcus says

I think that you can probably understand that gas being so expensive for the past 7 years had a big impact on both supply and demand. Worldwide car manufacturing and buying were deeply affected, for all of those years. AS was opening of new wells etc. and the bringing oil to market to cash in on those high prices.

If this was all simply the result of manipulators, it doesn't change the impact that these prices had on both supply and demand. If you are right that it's all manipulation, shouldn't a ridiculous excess of supply relative to demand have kicked in several years sooner ?

Do you understand my question ? THere must be what 5 years of excess supply out there ? Where do they store it ?

PErhaps we did it to supply aliens with some kind of oil derivative ?

marcus says

Here I've got a suggestion for you. Why don't you admit that that retail refinery oil number is completely and totally not representing the the amount of gasoline that the US consumes.

We're not importing refined Gasoline, and we're not selling it from the refinery, but you claim Gas sales remain constant.

What you think Hodgi is out back at the stop-n-go refining crude oil in a piss bucket?

Again you guys are infering what the charts represent with out actual proof of how the EIA is defining those metrics.

That's called spining the fats yer dishoner.

I too give up. I hope things get better for you.

Question: Are you in Fort Lauderdale ? I'll tell you why I ask when you answer.

Ah instead of waiting for your answer ( I have to go do some other stuff), Ill just tell you.

You might want to put this on your radar.
http://www.thefabfaux.com/

I've heard they are great live. I'm not into fake beatles bands, but these guys are different. Studio musicians that do this for fun. Late Beatles covers done really well. In recent concerts they do the entire white album flawlessly.

If they were coming to LA, I would definitely see their show. Supposed to be amazing live.

CaptainShuddup says

What you think Hodgi is out back at the stop-n-go refining crude oil in a piss bucket?

Okay, I'll try to play teacher a little more. With the disclosure that I'm making educated inferences here.

This article talks about why refineries have been closing.

http://abarrelfull.wikidot.com/blog:why-are-refineries-closing-down

THey say that these days a refinery has to do all of these things well (or have all of these in their favor) to be profitable:

**The ability to add value, something that depends in large part on Nelson
Complexity

**The cost of operations, including energy efficiency

**Access to and ability to process low cost raw materials, like extra heavy
crudes

**The market conditions in the local or regional area

I notice that profiting from retail margins is not on the list. MY inference is that before recently there were some refineries that did not have all of these factors in their favor, but who managed to barely barely stay profitble by marking up what gasoline they could produce and selling at retail.

Presumably, many of the refineries that can refine oil profitably have no interest in trying to also be in the retail business. They simply sell their product wholesale. Many of the ones that weren't that great at refining, but stayed in business by selling retail, have been closing.

Most educated people when confronted with something they don't understand or something that contradicts their previous view will either look for information that helps to explain it, or they might even assume in situations such as this that there are complexities to the supply chain and that it's a complex and changing industry because of a myriad of factors.

That is, I'm more likely to assume that there are things that I don't understand going on, than I am to instantly try to assign blame to some boogie man ("teh libruls"). That's just stupid. It's hard to even believe you're serious.

Education is mostly about learning how to learn.

My opinion, and I don't mean to offend, but your bias, and the biases that you love to run to, prevent you from implementing good learning practices.

marcus says

**The market conditions in the local or regional area

Yup! What's you're point?

Oh I see what's going on you Idiots are thinking Wholesale/Retail terms.

OK Sunshine listen up Puddin Pops! See if you can wrap your thick little Liberal minds around this truth.

NOBODY, and I mean NOBODY, is driving up to the refineries and telling the man in front of a Billion Gallon Tank of Oil, "Hey Fellah fill'er up will Ya!?"

OF COURSE! The refineries are selling Gas at wholesale prices to the Gas Stations, and bigger Gas companies like Exxon and the like are refining their own Oil and producing Gas.

Retail in the report I've provided is the Gas that Joe and Billy Numbnutz buy at the pump. There is not Retail/Wholesale large scale Gas sales. Retail means "YOU" driving to a pump and buying Gas. ALL GAS STATIONS ARE PAYING WHOLESALE.

You're paying Retail. Which as Iv'e stated, is down 2/3rds from the historical norm.

Which is it, would you guys have us believe according to the charts you keep producing, that spite all of the Liberal meddling and draconian laws that have been passed, and spite all of the market volatility from the great bubble to the great recession, your needle on the Gas consumption gauge hasn't budged one smidgeon, not the least bit.

Do you really want to stick with that? That makes your whole life a wasted and thankless cause, and all of the bullshit you bastards put through all for fucking naught!

Be magnanimous and step up and take my stats and at least spin it to fit your Liberal utopian cause to say how your Liberal causes are working. Which I would bet anything, you will in the not too distance future. You just don't want to admit that I've been right about every fucking thing I've ever said on this board, and you guys are a bunch of gullible Idiots.

CaptainShuddup says

You guys have a serious comprehension of the supply chain deficit.

The refineries are making gasoline up the wazoo with no where to put it.

And yet the price is dropping!

Hmm. You may be on [to] something.

Hmmm. So it seems believable to you that gas consumption is down 65%. in just 7 years.

And it also makes perfect sense to you that the same company that provides all kinds of different stats on gasoline says in some of their stats that total retail sales by refiners are down by 65%, but the same company posts a lot of stats showing consumption of gasoline down less than 10% during the same period.

I don't know. I guess you're even worse at listening to others than you are at learning.
marcus says

your bias, and the biases that you love to run to, prevent you from implementing good learning practices