patrick.net

Zephyr - can you post the offending comment here? I'm curious to see what it takes to get deleted there.

Zephyr, I read your post.
It's a little combative in tone and the argument's a little straw-man-ish perhaps, but hardly troll-worthy material. I can't see why it got deleted.

Ok, I've registered, and would like to post a new thread,

"why you so bitter, bro"

how do I do so?

Btw, I posted an almost identical thread to Ben's latest ("How Would You Fix This Housing Bubble?") called "Bubble Reform" back on August 10th.

I really can't think of a single time when I've thought Zephyr ought to be deleted. I can handle argumentative. It's outright insults that one has to draw the line at, simply for the sake of sane discussions. But to delete when you disagree with someone is wrong.

Bravo, Surfer-X!

Just email Patrick (p@patrick.net), asking for thread creating/moderating rights. Once he's granted you rights, log on then click on the 'Site Admin' link under 'Meta' on the main page. Click on "Write" and there you are...

I just checked, and Ben deleted it again. No surprise.

Zephyr, your comment got deted again. Your name must be on his "spam" list for some reason --no way Ben can be actively moderating 24/7.

I LOVE the idea of Surfer-X creating a thread!

BTW, I rarely post there. So it is very unlikely that I have any kind of reputation there.

Zephyr

Well, you know we value your insights and no one here (I think) objects to thoughtful opinions whether we agree or not. I for one think you are a great resource and I'm glad you'll spend time with us.

Ok I'm done with the love fest. But I think it needs to be said.

HARM,

I don't think he has me listed as spam. A post that I made last night is still there.

Wow, talk about thin-skinned. We put up with MP's crap for over a month (and still are) before we booted his masturbatory flame-provoking ass. As long as it doesn't get excessivly personal, crude or spammy, I'd prefer not to block.

Well, you know we value your insights and no one here (I think) objects to thoughtful opinions whether we agree or not. I for one think you are a great resource and I’m glad you’ll spend time with us.

Ditto - debating in the absence of contrary viewpoints is like clapping with one hand.

Thanks, I am not shy about expressing my opinion, and I can be strong in my views. But, the appropriate response is a counter argument, not deletion.

But, the appropriate response is a counter argument, not deletion.

Absolutely.

OMFG.

Longest. Thread. Ever.

Who is this Randy H kid, and why does he seem to think that informed, rational argument is any way to discuss things?

@Harm: heh

@Peter: head down, tempo, back and through on plane

@sqt: Holy crap! *ahem* How's sac?

@SurferX: Sometimes, the dude... Well. He's the dude.

@Jack: Could you do your ascii art in a more classical style? Since ascii artists threw out concepts such as symmetry, proportion and humanism, it's no wonder that the public audience has faded. It is not the public that has failed ascii art, but rather ascii art that has failed the public.

Cheers,
prat

Welcome, back, Prat!

You're right --this is the longest thread ever. This is exactly why we need solid bloggers like you to put a stop to it by registering and starting new ones ;-).

Well, dudeareno if you're not into the whole brevity thing....:)

Regarding immigrants, each time I drive through King City and see all those mofo's picking whatever, I yell out the window "you sons o'bitches how dare you take jobs from amerikans". Or alternatively "hola pendehos"

I kid, I kid. :) *

*disclaimer -- I'm 1/2 mexican

I emailed patrick. I'll chip in.

We've got a piper down. I repeat, the piper is DOWN.

What?

Cheers,
prat

A320 pilot to cabin "what the fuck did you expect, we're French"

BTW, never ever consider a Boston Terrier, they snore something terrible.

Ben definately does delete posts that he disagrees with. I was just deleted a while ago.

Well, when I was posting as an anon in Ben's blog, someone thought I was a troll. And I was not possessed by Bull$hitter at that time.

Well, I don't don't why Zephyr and Mr.Right/Wrong/Left would be deleted there. I thought we are already deleting more than we would like to. :roll:

Anyway, Zephyr and Mr.Right/Wrong/Left, I am really glad that you guys are here. You add new dimensions to the discussions.

@Prat & Surfer-X,

Thanks for chipping in, guys --really appreciate it. I'm going to be away for a month, so Peter, SactoQt will really need the help.

G'nite all...

Nite Harm

Glad to hear from Prat (Yaaaa!)

Regarding immigrants, each time I drive through King City and see all those mofo’s picking whatever, I yell out the window “you sons o’bitches how dare you take jobs from amerikans”. Or alternatively “hola pendehos”

LMAO. It's good to have some humor amidst all these discussions about immigration. I think a lot of the comments are meant seriously, but sometimes it's hard to tell if there is veiled racism or if too much is being read into the remarks. Either way, we've all begun to take too many of the comments waaaaaaaaaaay to seriously. Thanks for lightening things up.

Re: the deletions on Ben's blog.

I'm feeling a lot more tolerant right about now.

I think a lot of the comments are meant seriously, but sometimes it’s hard to tell if there is veiled racism or if too much is being read into the remarks.

I do not think anyone is a racist. Most people here are very nice.

I’m feeling a lot more tolerant right about now.

Yes, indeed. Shouldn't we be proud for that?

Nite.

I do not think anyone is a racist. Most people here are very nice.

Peter P

I still maintain you are the nicest person here. ;)
But you're right, most people are are very nice, and I am constantly amazed at how intelligent and well thought out most of the posts are.

Stanman,

I believe, regardless of whether you like it or not, the whole world is moving towards freer flow of capital AND labor. If you don't allow immigration, job will go. If you allow, job may go too. In a word, in highly desirable places, you need to EARN YOUR RIGHT to live here. The fact that your ancestors arrived a generation or two earlier than mine doesn't give you a necessary edge in your competing with your contemporary, unless your ancestors played their cards right, e.g. hoarding large number of land when they first arrived.

Stopping people from moving upwards for a better life is simply impossible. That desire to lift ourselves up will express in the form of immigration/emigration, job outsourcing/insourcing, capital flowing out/flowing in...The whole evolution of human being is about flattening all arbitrage opportunities and giving the best of our kind a fair chance to compete against each other. Life, will find a way.

So the best way for the native citizens who got lucky for being born to the right country or right family to keep their edge is, work hard to lift themselves. A native citizen whose skills can only be qualified for a job that can be fulfilled in China at 1/10 the cost will become obsolete no matter what. Any immigration control is just a temporary fix, if this land continues to be desirable, people will come, legally or illegally. And for my own sake, I hope they keep coming.

Stanman

This ground has probably been covered before, so forgive me if I bring up something that's been discussed to death.

But isn't the argument for immigrant workers usually that they do jobs that native workers typically don't want? Or maybe it's more accurate to say that they are willing to work for wages that American's won't work for since they can get welfare that pays out more. As far as I know (and I may be wrong) illegal immigrants can't get welfare (though they probably can find a way to obtain it since they can get driver's licence's and health care) so they have to take low wage jobs.

Prop. 187 was meant to change some of this, but one lone federal judge threw it out as supposedly “unconstitutional.” He never was able to show what part of the 14th Amendment he was pretending to be referring to

Let me guess, 9th circuit judge? California can be ridiculous sometimes.

Escaped from the District . . . With Kurt Russel ,

Stick around. I rather enjoy your posts since they fit my world view (which is neither Left or Right ... since they lie on the same corrupted body).

Yes, the in-state tuition for illegal immigrants is unbelievable beyond words.

Regarding illegals doing work for lower pay as justification:
The premise is not good...and as per Stan's earlier post, it's mired in short-term thinking. The fact is, a balance of some sort will be achieved. Would we really pay $10 for a head of lettuce for eternity? No. Of course not. (Or maybe we would, but then we would gradually spend less & less on other things...like housing). More likely, there would be accelerated innovation...automation, etc., that could actually create other types of jobs (i.e. tech) thus buoying other sectors. No way of knowing for sure, though, right?...& when there is no way of knowing, it's best to just enforce the fn law.

California illegal immigrant cost info:
http://www.fairus.org/site/PageServer?pagename=iic_immigrationissuecentersffec
There is a link to a 19 page .pdf file that includes references for data ( no, haven't read it).
I don't know anything abou this website...just found thru ggl.