patrick.net

RC2006 says

How much will this increase gas prices? Gas lost will be replaced by bringing in gas for overseas.

Phillips 66 announced Wednesday it will close its 650-acre oil refinery complex near the Port of Los Angeles by the fourth quarter of 2025, days after Gov. Gavin Newsom (D) signed a new law regulating gas storage and refineries.

The refinery in Wilmington, together with a complex in Carson 5 miles away, produces up to 85,000 barrels per day of gasoline and 65,000 barrels per day of distillates, such as diesel.

Daaaymn! That's gonna hurt.

Patrick says

One day I saw an entire backyard deck float by.

Were the people still in the hot tub?

RC2006 says

How much will this increase gas prices? Gas lost will be replaced by bringing in gas for overseas.

Phillips 66 announced Wednesday it will close its 650-acre oil refinery complex near the Port of Los Angeles by the fourth quarter of 2025, days after Gov. Gavin Newsom (D) signed a new law regulating gas storage and refineries.

The refinery in Wilmington, together with a complex in Carson 5 miles away, produces up to 85,000 barrels per day of gasoline and 65,000 barrels per day of distillates, such as diesel.

Last time they allowed gas from overseas it required relaxing of "specisl formulation" requirement, iirc.

RWSGFY says

50 years ago when that shack was built it was not "close to the cliff", mwahahahaha.

Yes it was. Wasn't engineered properly. You can avoid erosion like that no problem. It's not complicated. But whatever? Look at the house to the North. It's fucked. They didn't do pilings correctly. This is engineering 101. Do it right once.

WookieMan says

You can avoid erosion like that no problem.

I can see you have never met the Pacific Ocean.

I have in many parts of the of the West coast from Seattle to San Diego many of times.

My folks owned a condo on a barrier island in Florida in the panhandle. All it is, is 12' of sand above sea level (if that) and gets hit by up to CAT 4 hurricanes. Still there's no erosion. 1/4 of a mile at widest. It's a sand bar basically.

Kind of weird a place that doesn't get hurricanes wasn't engineered as well as places in FL? If you want to live on water you need to engineer it correctly or plan better when building. Doesn't matter what body of water.

That slide could have been prevented. If you don't have the money to put in proper infrastructure to secure your property, don't live there? That place is uninsurable now without spending millions.

zzyzzx says

Instant infinity pool!!!

WookieMan says

RWSGFY says

50 years ago when that shack was built it was not "close to the cliff", mwahahahaha.

Yes it was. Wasn't engineered properly. You can avoid erosion like that no problem. It's not complicated. But whatever? Look at the house to the North. It's fucked. They didn't do pilings correctly. This is engineering 101. Do it right once.

There are buildings in, say, Pacifica which are front row now but weren't less than 10 years ago. That coastline constantly moves inward.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/commercial-real-estate-foreclosures-soar-195735846.html

Commercial Real Estate Foreclosures Soar By 48% Nationwide While California Sees A 238% Surge

Booger says

zzyzzx says

Instant infinity pool!!!

And the hot tub is now an Indiana Jones themed sled ride to the beach.

Last year, the weather poundings tore the Capitola pier in half, relegated the restaurant at the end to demolition. An old concrete ship around Aptos and its pier have also been destroyed and the concrete ship that was already sunk destroyed even more.

The surf also tore open some of the cutsie multi million dollar Renaissance beach condos wide open in Capitola. Capitola has been seriously flooded and beaten three times since we have been here (14 years) and the restaurant row wrecked. That means, those in the beach culvert close to the ocean have to be funded to rebuild every five years or so.

Those concrete walls cost multi millions to build for short stretches, even more than the houses that perch on them, and they will be returned to the sea sooner or later anyway. I've been watching a small rock peninsula dissolving year by year. It's now a small island broken into thirds.

RWSGFY says

There are buildings in, say, Pacifica which are front row now but weren't less than 10 years ago. That coastline constantly moves inward.

Concrete and steel are a thing. Barrier islands in the panhandle protect their properties with sand dunes. Not foolproof, but their homes don't get washed away into the sea generally with hurricane force winds.

Like I said, if you want to live in that location there are things that you can do to prevent erosion for 100's of years. Costs $$$$. If you cannot afford it don't live there. Plenty of cheaper and better places to live in the country if you're not a wimp and can handle seasons.

Ceffer says

Those concrete walls cost multi millions to build for short stretches, even more than the houses that perch on them, and they will be returned to the sea sooner or later anyway.

That's what I said. There are solutions they just cost a shit load of money. Tons of steel hammered into the ground, rebar and concrete. It's doable, just no one wants to pay for it. And it probably doesn't look as "pretty" for home owners. Guess what, you own what is likely to be an uninsurable house. You're now looking at a worthless asset that will fall into the Ocean and won't get compensated. That $5M home just got flushed down the toilet and you'll need to default or sell for a fraction of what it used to be worth.

Drop the $2-3 million shoring it up. If/when you go to sell it will pay itself back. Uninsurable houses are worthless really. That's why I don't live on water. If I did I'd be above the flood plain or away from areas that could erode like that. I'd rather live on the hill 1/2 mile away. You're not even at your house that much anyway. Between work and sleep, you get maybe what, 2-4 hours to enjoy the view? And if it's a vacation rental, the renters won't even be there that much. It's just not worth it.

WookieMan says

That $5M home just got flushed down the toilet and you'll need to default or sell for a fraction of what it used to be worth.

True, have to sell it for the "original price" (pre erosion disaster) minus the price to pay a contractor to install at least a 100-year-fix for the erosion problem

if you live in Florida, this may be the way to go

https://www.msn.com/en-us/travel/article/the-hurricane-proof-dome-homes-defying-nature-s-fury-in-florida/vi-AA1tfMoe

our townhome (built around 2015) is about 2 miles from the shoreline in the Florida panhandle and we got wind gusts up to 180 miles per hour from Hurricane Michael ... the only damage was the back exterior french doors had their seals broken so water got between the two panes of glass ...

.

AD says

our townhome (built around 2015) is about 2 miles from the shoreline in the Florida panhandle and we got wind gusts up to 180 miles per hour from Hurricane Michael

Storm surge is the biggest enemy in your region. Then wind. Most places built post 2000 should be pretty hurricane proof wind wise.

Live in a place with tornados that can jump up to 300mph. I'll take hurricanes with a newer house over an F5 tornado. No one is building to that standard. That's why when the sirens go off here we're in the basement and go to the basket full of flashlights. Have a 3 sided concrete room and chill there. Knock on wood, they always miss. Have had some close calls and friends lost houses.

Only 1-2 actual siren warnings every year the last decade. When I was a kid it was 5-10 every year. I think however the weather pattern changed, it shifted South of where I am. I sound gay, but it was traumatizing as a kid. Witnessed two tornados. They're fucking devastating. Not video, but saw them.

WookieMan says

Concrete and steel are a thing. Barrier islands in the panhandle protect their properties with sand dunes. Not foolproof, but their homes don't get washed away into the sea generally with hurricane force winds.

Money is the thing here. If you can't make taxpayers build that seawall for you (again), you are SOL. And apparently even CA government is not keen on spending this kind of dough to rebuild failed 40ft high seawalls.

Santa Cruz is relatively peaceful, being an inlet facing South with all of the real raging going on in the West facing coasts. It still gets fucked by the weather and angry Mother Ocean every couple of years.

Rip rap is ugly and restricts access except to the billy goats who can climb over it. The walls look nice, but projected life expectancy isn't that great when one considers the costs, and that the temporary advantages goes to the wealthy who can afford the houses on the oversees.

Mountains can be challenging too. Neighbors have a 3500 sq. ft. house in Tahoe close to a ridge line. He complains that he is sent up there periodically for snow management, and the back deck collapsed a winter past. He went up once and the snow blower broke and leaked oil all over. He's pissed off because his lady companion's family go up there and trash the place like a hotel room. She's rich, and coughed up the money for the place, but wants him to do all the butler tasks.
He doesn't hang around the grand kids because they aren't his, but he has the donkey boy tasks for the place.
I bet they sell sometime soon, like many people with second homes who seldom use them.

They came very close to being burned out also in the fires the year before last, it was a squeaker. There was that fire several years ago when nearly everything around Lake Arrowhead went up in smoke, too, in SoCal.

Our previous neighbors in Santa Cruz had a place in Lake Arrowhead, their house was spared, but everything around their place was burned trees and ashes.

My older friend has trusteeship over a family area in the Santa Cruz hills that has a natural spring. I laugh because he has this conservator hat he wears and is constantly feuding with the water district politicians and bureaucrats. This culvert has been washed out by flooding at least three times over the last ten years, carrying a bunch of his crap downstream to parts unknown and carving a deep channel. It also burned down once with the surrounding neighborhood when that thunder storm came through a couple of years ago. He had a tent and tool shed and some other temporary conveniences to stay there, and they all burned down.

Ceffer says

Rip rap is ugly and restricts access except to the billy goats who can climb over it. The walls look nice, but projected life expectancy isn't that great when one considers the costs, and that the temporary advantages goes to the wealthy who can afford the houses on the oversees.

That's the key. You can live somewhere more scenic for 1/4th the price, you just might have to deal with seasons. If it wasn't for the wife's job and connections we'd be long gone from IL to a cheaper state. I don't really care about family and in laws. If they want to see us they have the ability to do so.

My mom also owns property on water. It's not worth it. It's like owning a boat. Let your friend do it.

Pacific is strange because it carries ghosts inland. It really effects people's brains.

The nice days are so utterly narcotic and psychedelic beautiful that they are hard to describe. They also create absolute amnesia to the generally poor attitudes of the people and the regular stompings by the natural environment, in spite of the nice weather. It makes the Santa Cruz hard liners about as smug and chauvinistic about their place as New Yorkers are about theirs, but in a hippie dippie way. Different places, different pretenses.

I'm one of them.

https://babylonbee.com/cleanArticle/newsom-assures-californians-they-will-be-safe-from-all-the-trump-administrations-prosperity-safety-lower-prices