patrick.net

Today I heard that Treyvon Martin had 13 pieces of jewelry in addition to a wrist watch and a burglary tool in his backpack.

Can anyone confirm that?

Honest Abe says

Can anyone confirm that?

Why would you need confirmation? You've "heard" it and that's good enough right?

Today I heard that Zimmerman had a paper bag for huffing paint in addition to a clan hood and journal, in which he wrote on many occasions about his desire to kill a black teenager and frame it as self-defense, in his pockets.

Can anyone confirm this?

Bap33 says

Now, Clarence, you must go watch this video and educate yourself as to why a person must be able to defend from attacks. Enjoy the video, and please respond!! Thanks.
http://www.knoxnews.com/videos/detail/chipman-murders-channon-christian-chris-newsom/

from the video: "They raped them, they tortured them, they beat them, then they killed them. It's not a normal murder."

I don't think that anyone here is saying that people should not be able to defend themselves from attacks.

Unfortunately Trayvon was unable to effectively defend himself from the well armed violent stalker. Just as Channon Christian and Christopher Newsom were unable to defend themselves.

The story you cited often has the level of torture greatly exaggerated.
http://www.snopes.com/politics/crime/newsom.asp

That said even without the exaggeration it was a horrific crime.

leoj707 says

Unfortunately Trayvon was unable to effectively defend himself from the well armed violent stalker. Just as Channon Christian and Christopher Newsom were unable to defend themselves.

sickest post on this site

Bap33 says

sickest post on this site

Sicker than your post that described a horrific torture scenario that has often been vastly over exaggerated, but horrific none the less.

Then trying to exploit that scenario to defend a man with a known violent history who stalked and killed a teenager? A teenager whose last seconds of his life were so terrorized and full of fear that his screams for help were little more than primal calls of distress.

your opinion. nothing more. wrong though it is, you should have one.

yes, your post is sicker.

Bap33 says

wrong though it is

leoj707 says

known violent history

Zimmerman's violent and unstable personality has been well documented.

leoj707 says

stalked

Zimmerman did "stalk" Trayvon who tried to "walk fast" in order to "lose" the person following him.

leoj707 says

killed a teenager

Trayvon was a teenager, and was killed by Zimmerman.

leoj707 says

A teenager whose last seconds of his life were so terrorized and full of fear that his screams for help were little more than primal calls of distress.

Listen to the tape, they are the screams of someone who fears they are about to die. The screams are cut short by Zimmerman's bullet. Experts have determined they are not Zimmerman's screams.

Bap33 says

your opinion. nothing more.

No, it is the facts as we know it today. I am open to the possibility that the trial will shed more light on the matter.

Bap33 says

yes, your post is sicker.

Here is an actual opinion:

Your post that uses a horrific crime is much sicker than mine, suggesting that people who are stalked and murdered unfortunately did not have the option of a more adequate defense against their attackers. *sickening*

You also use a case that has been exaggerated and falsely used as an example of the "horrible injustice" of a black-on-white hate crime. Even the courts and the families do not view the horrific attacks on Channon Christian and Christopher Newsom as a racially motivate hate crime. *sickening*

You compare Trayvon, who even by your admission is the victim of at least manslaughter, to a horrific group of brutal and sadistic killers. *sickening*

The only thing that Trayvon may have with those people is the color of their skin. The only thing that Zimmerman has in common with Christian and Newsom is that they are not black. I am beginning to think that Clarence 13X is correct in that you have some serious race issues. *disappointing*

the race issue was created by the liberal media to give Lord Barry a much-needed fire-strom on the streets. That has been proved beyond doubt.

"Payback for Trevon" has been used for the blacks attacking whites in the past few weeks. That has been proved beyond doubt.

If Lord Barry had a son it would look like the animals that raped and mutilated the young white kids too.

How you can equate a watchmen on patrol to protect his, and his neighbors life and treasure, that was jumped by a prowler that matched the exact description of the common perps of the area, who defended himself from the prowlers attack and attempt to cause great bodily harm,.... you are actually trying to equte THAT to these murdering animals ... and that is disgusting. I fgure you must be just doing this for sport.

When will the Black Panther that offered a bounty go to prison?

When will Spike Lee go to prison?

Your attempt to defend the murdering filth would be laughable if not for the sad fact that the entire progressive/liberal/leftist movement plans to use their race-baiting tacitics to force AMerica to allow Lord Barry to remain KING,,,,,, "or else!!!"..... after all, it's all "payback for Trevon!!"

lets not forget how those silly white cops acted "stupidly" way back when ....

This entire racebaiting game is disgusting .. but, I must admit, it is effective with the drugged up scum he is hoping will drag their lazy ass to the polls and vote Lord Barry in as KING.

you actually think it matters that bleech was poured down the poor murdered girls throat after she was ganged rapped for days and dead ... instead of as she was dying. The young man was rapped by the huge black men as his girl watched, and then his dick was cut off while she watched ..... then he was shot a little bit .. and THEN he was murdered. That is a demon created by the liberal social policeys in place. And, you really need help if you see these issues on any level of compairison. Have you no compassion for white kids?

leoj707 says

You also use a case that has been exaggerated and falsely used as an example of the "horrible injustice" of a black-on-white hate crime. Even the courts and the families do not view the horrific attacks on Channon Christian and Christopher Newsom as a racially motivate hate crime. *sickening*

now you go find 10 examples of a black killing a black that IS a hate crime!

and now, find 10 examples of a black killing a white that IS a hate crime.

don't waste your time, they are not there.

now, without even trying you can search and will find 30 examples of a whites being accused of "hate crime" because the victim is other-then-white. THAT is disgusting, and PROVES the racial bias created by liberal social PC bullcrap.

You and Clarence are of the same racebaiter tribe ... you may even be the same poster. Maybe.

leoj707 says

I am beginning to think that Clarence 13X is correct in that you have some serious race issues.

Everyone who has read Bap knows. He's a nice guy in many ways. Fairly high EQ (like IQ but for emotions). But man, his race issues (and other prejudice) run strong and very deep.

It's interesting because nobody admits to being racist, except some of the least racist people. And we see it differently. To his type there is no such thing as a hate crime. And if Zimmerman's profiling was paranoid delusional, and very much about race, somehow Bap discounts it. It's as if "hey, Zimmerman was 100% certain Martin was up to no good, based on his appearance, and wanted to take armed action based on that belief. What's wrong with that ? Racism you say ? I say race baiter to any fool that wants to bring race in to this !!"

Bap33 says

now, without even trying you can search and will find 30 examples of a whites being accused of "hate crime" because the victim is other-then-white. THAT is disgusting, and PROVES the racial bias created by liberal social PC bullcrap.

All it proves is that for good reason as a society we sometimes react to mistreatment of MINORITIES.

Lynching has been mentioned above. Lynching was usually a hate crime (even if it was occasionally simultaneously vigilante justice). Do you think lynching of black men could have even happened if African Americans were at the time the dominant majority culture ??

I know it's a silly question, but there's something very obvious and simple you are missing.

Hate crime laws by definition protect minorities against bias related violence. If a crime against a member of a majority group happens because they are in the group, who cares if they call it a hate crime or not. The majority group doesn't need the same kind of protection from hate from within the minority, as the other way around.

Maybe one day when a lot of gay men are going on violence sprees targeting straight men, there will be some new types of hate crime legislation.

marcus says

somehow Bap discounts it. It's as if "hey, Zimmerman was 100% certain Martin was up to no good, based on his appearance, and wanted to take armed action based on that belief

not how I see it at all. Zim was armed to be ready for the unforseen .. like boyscouts are taught. And it saved him from possible death. He did not run home and get his gun and go hunting for the prowler. You are shaping the situation to fit your bias (or the mass hysteria bias), but I am not.

marcus says

Do you think lynching of black men could have even happened if African Americans were at the time the dominant majority culture ??

every slave that was picked up in Africa was sold to traders by Aficans. The slaves were the losers of wars and victims of kidnapping, and either got on the ship or where murdered by their African capters. Your point?

marcus says

Hate crime laws by definition protect minorities against bias related violence.

and that is the stupidest thing any civilization could ever dream up ... special laws that are drempt up for a special sect of the group. Who is the insane idiot that can't imagine a crazy sodomite --- like the wiki-leak mole --- taking action against a person or entity based on their sexual orientation??? How much more obvious can a hate crime be??? Blacks attacking a white, and boasting that it was 1) retailiation (vigilaty BIG TIME) and 2) justified because they are the same color as Trevon and the victim was not. Yea /// that would be a friggin race based HATE crime if there really were any need or reason for such a stupid assed idea as "hate crime" enhancement tied to plain old crime.

Sleep well marcus

Bap33 says

The slaves were the losers of wars and victims of kidnapping, and either got on the ship or where murdered by their African capters. Your point?

Wtf ?

My point was about hate crime being about crimes against minority individuals, and that's why it seems skewed to you.

What is your point, with the bit about slaves being sold to slave traders by evil African scumbags ? What does that have to do with anything ? I'm not interested in trying to figure out who was the most evil in slave trafficing. Was it the traders who bought and sold slaves to other traders who bought and sold them or the farmers and others who bought them, or the initial (evil) profiteers who couldn't resist the price being paid for their fellow Africans. My guess is that those most likely to be taken in to slaverly were small tribal groups that didn't have advanced weaponry or awareness of the scumbags that they should have been fearing.

Kind of off topic from your confusion about why the name "hate crime" ends up attached to some hate based crimes and not others.

Bap33 says

Zim was armed to be ready for the unforseen .. like boyscouts are taught.

We now know in hindsight based on his well documented innapropriate emotional outbreaks and associated assaults (and what happened with Martin), that he never should have had a gun.

Bap33 says

And it saved him from possible death

I would give 3 to one odds on a huge bet that without the gun he would not have stalked Martin and confronted him. Again, it's quite obvious that he was not emotionally and psychologically balanced enough to even have a gun, let alone pretend he's a law enforcement officer imagining that he has some special powers enabling him to magically know what a fellow citizen's intentions are.

(most real cops don't do that - but at least when a real cop stops you to ask you what you're doing - you know its a cop and usually feel somewhat safe, from physical harm - even if their profiling was unfair)

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/04/25/us-usa-florida-shooting-zimmerman-idUSBRE83O18H20120425

This just in from Reuters.

Bap33 says

How you can equate a watchmen on patrol to protect his, and his neighbors life and treasure, that was jumped by a prowler that matched the exact description of the common perps of the area, who defended himself from the prowlers attack and attempt to cause great bodily harm,....

You and your kind are the worst of the worst when it comes to stupidity....your a flat out racist who denies being such.

It has been proven Trayvon Martin was headed to the store and was a member of the same neighborhood you claim he prowled. Where was the fucking blood on Zimmermans shirt since Martin was on top bashing his head in? Where was the marks on his back? on his head? Now you want to label him a prowler. He was a 17 year old kid, who was afraid after having a strange man following him. Yeah, he made the mistake of behaving suspciously and pulling his hoodie over his head but that gives your punk ass no right to show no remorse for this accident. You have a history of showing no remorse towards the poor, blacks or mexicans. You called your neighbors Pedro, called blacks negroes as if you were at war with a people whom you wanted to dehumanize.

Your words hold the economic power of a squirrel nibbling on a walnut. You represent the white power movement very well along with your Tea Party cohorts. While the rest of America attempts to figure out how to move forward with our lives as one people you continue your precious rants on why no one but Aryans belong here or deserve the right to walk down the street without being followed.

The reason you will lose in the end is because no one President is sending 60 million Mexicans and 50 millions blacks packing because the combined economic effect would be catastrophic to our economy.

In the end, you will have to learn to get along or hang yourself with the same noose you been making the past 12 hours.

You are full of shit, America doesnt need this type of unemotional hate filled rhetoric.

People are trying to come together as one, and here you come to call us spicks, spooks and wetbacks.

Way to go dumbass!

I bet everything your weak ass it at home in your underwear waiting on your next welfare check from Fannie Mae on the house you bought with tax dollars.

Hypocritical fuck!

marcus says

What is your point, with the bit about slaves being sold to slave traders by evil African scumbags ?

Exactly, the warlords are just as at fault with their bullshit. All this was is a cry for help.

Bap33 says

You and Clarence are of the same racebaiter tribe ... you may even be the same poster. Maybe.

N0 bastard, I have held other debates with Marcus prior in other forums. Eat shit and die....right along with your hate filled stupidity.

People came to America from all over, but some of us just were not accepted like the Jews, Irish and Italians were.

If Zimmerman didn't have a gun and he knew that Trayvon had a gun, will Zimmerman stalk Trayvon?

If Zimmerman had a gun and he knew that Trayvon had a gun too, will Zimmerman stalk Trayvon?

If Trayvon was white, will Zimmerman stalk Trayvon?

Yep, this case is all about gun and race.

Honest Abe says

This just in from Reuters.

Why no mention of Zimmerman's past troubles controlling his temper, his arrests, his being fired from the security job etc ? Could it be that the article is PR?

I wonder how much it costs to get that type of thing published. Maybe it's good will on the part of the reuters, to help there be some neutral potential jurists.

Bap33 says

If Lord Barry had a son it would look like the animals that raped and mutilated the young white kids too.

Surely you aren't as stupid as you appear.

Obama's comment was addressing the obvious (to anyone objective) probable connection between how Martin looked and his being followed and eventually confronted and shot by Zimmerman.

There is an implied assessment on Obama's part that Martin was a victim (based on his apperance). It's not that we know with total certainty that it's the case. But anyone who isn't severely retarded knows that it appears to be the case.

marcus, here is why I mentioned the way slaves were made.

marcus says

Do you think lynching of black men could have even happened if African Americans were at the time the dominant majority culture ??

So, I pointed out a negro majority culture that was mistreating negros. The same thing goes on now with machettes on the necks of African Christian negros, placed there by African muslamislamic negros. I was only answering the question you raised.

The facts are the last thing looked for by the anti-white-middle class press thus far. I mean, they even used the words "white hispanic" in their efforts to make this about race. They invented Zim saying "coon" to help fan some flames ... and funny, when that was proved false the liberal press and the racebaitors just kept rolling full speed without regard to facts ... ask Spike Lee, Al Jackson and Jesse Sharpten, the Black Panthers, the CBS worker that edited the 911 call, the media putting out these youthful pics of Martin to hide his actual appearence, and even better how the entire racebaiting parade pretends that a 17 year old negro male can not possibly be dangerous ... you guys care to read the stats on the ages that most negro males are when they start to do violent things?

By the way, back to Zim not saying, "coon" ..... why would his use of that word make him a bad person, a racist, or a killer?? Should Zim be arrested for using a slang word that offends people that are only offended if a person they feel should not use a phrase does so??? Like, are you suggesting that a select group should have full right to enjoy unrestricted use of words, and also be given the right to be offended and seek retribution should a person not in the group utter the phrase???? ya ... right along with "hate crime", PC Speech or "hate speech" is unAmerican. Disgusting.

Clarence you are pathetic. You take personal shots at an imaginary profile on a blog site? As soon as you ran out of original thoughts, you knew you needed to attack the person .. a common libtard act. Your personal attacks are not allowed on PatNet. Go start your own site. You should call it Racebaitors Inc. Or, maybe How to Hate 101. Adios punk.

Marcus,
have a good day. Tomorrow has better things in store.

marcus says

Obama's comment was addressing the obvious (to anyone objective) probable connection between how Martin looked and his being followed and eventually confronted and shot by Zimmerman.

Lord Barry said, "if I had a son he would look like Trevon."
I say, "if Lord Barry had a son he would look like one of the murdering animals in the story I shared."
Both are due to how the people match how Lord Barry looks. Why does that make me stupid? If Lord Barry wants to say he matches someone's appearence, that is his choice. And he does. But, others match too. Right?

Bap33 says

Lord Barry said

You have a typo you wrote Lord where you meant President of the United States.

potAto potato

Honest Abe says

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/04/25/us-usa-florida-shooting-zimmerman-idUSBRE83O18H20120425

This just in from Reuters.

well now ... who will be the first of the racebaitors on here to admit they were wrong?? I'll be holding my breath.

Bap33 says

well now ... who will be the first of the racebaitors on here to admit they were wrong?? I'll be holding my breath.

That article doe not contradict anything said here.

marcus says

Honest Abe says

This just in from Reuters.

Why no mention of Zimmerman's past troubles controlling his temper, his arrests, his being fired from the security job etc ? Could it be that the article is PR?

I wonder how much it costs to get that type of thing published. Maybe it's good will on the part of the reuters, to help there be some neutral potential jurists.

Getting a great laugh at the hypocrisy on this post. There has not even been a trial yet.... Keep it coming.... LMAO...

I think Jack said it best,

http://www.MPMmC0UAnj0

Bap33 says

Lord Barry said, "if I had a son he would look like Trevon."

I'll spell it out again. I think you know. For weeks this had been talked about, especially among African American media. Many felt and still feel that what happened to Martin was due to his appearance as an African American teen.

We know it's true. Even the article above talks about the belief that black kids had burglarized homes in that community. Of course it takes a special kind of stupid to assume that every black kid is such a criminal.

Do you really not get this ? The part about an assessment made by Zimmerman that this kid was a criminal based on his appearance ?

(you can go off talking about Spike Lee or whomever had an over the top reaction - but at least you could acknowledge that what they were over reacting to - and what Obama was commenting on (not over reacting) makes sense.)

How can you possibly not get it ? Could you just acknowledge that you get it and that it makes sense, and then go back to calling everyone racebaiters so that I know you aren't totally beyond hope.

dude, I said it made sense for Zim to suspect a person that matched the common perp in that area that had been doing bad things of late ... way way back in the early parts of this I said it only made sense to know the description of the most likely bad guy to look for while on patrol. The black lady that was interviewed (but was afraid of being attacked for being honest, so she stayed annon) she said that the area had been targeted by "young black males". So, sure, we both agree that Zim knew what to be on the lookout for - a person matching the description of the home invaders and robbers in that area - and we both agree that Treyvon matched 90% of the profile of the local bad guys. We agree.
You take on the task of making a trail in the woods safe for walking. The last 5 guys that walked that trail were bit by a rattlesnake. You arm yourself incase you come across a rattler. What this means is there is a very good chance that you would shoot a gopher snake if one was on that same trail as you walked along. Anyone would. A gophersnake can coil up and hiss and strike and unless you are 100% sure, that gopher snake is just another rattle snake that can hurt you or the next person to hike that trail. Millions of harmless (beneficial even) gopher snakes are killed every year because of how they look. The snake they look like has done bad things to many people, and is well known to be very dangerous. The people are not to blame. The gopher snake is not to blame. The rattle snake is to blame.

No, I am not trying to equate anything about anything, I'm just searching for a good analogy to express what I know to be facts of life and survival.

@leo,
it does not contridict you because you phrase your position with at least a little bit of uncertainty. But, it clearly is not in line with what some others have wrote.

Bap33 says

By the way, back to Zim not saying, "coon" ..... why would his use of that word make him a bad person, a racist, or a killer??

If I called you a CRAKKKA and your wife a faded out white bitch would it make you feel that I was fond of White America?...huh, you piece of shit?

Bap33 says

I'm just searching for a good analogy to express what I know to be facts of life and survival.

So weak. For one thing that the burglaries were done by black kids was the story, but was easily not even the case. For all we know, Zimmerman was the burgler (part of his psychotic personality) and he built up the story that it was black kids. OR some other racist easily could have turned burglaries in to "black kids." It could even be that, people assuming it was black kids, AND they were right !

Who knows ?

But no mattter what, even if it had been black kids, your snake analogy doesn't quite work. In fact part of the definition of second degree murder rather than manslaughter is disregard for human life (implied in your analogy "hey it's a snake - close enough")

Something else that's implied by your refusal to answer my question is that you are possibly even less facile with logic than Zimmerman.

Let's supposed that those burglaries were done by black kids. And lets even further suppose that black kids aren't seen in that neighborhood all that often.

DO you really think that that means just seeing a black kid in the neighborhood makes it all that likely that he is a burgler ? If so, you're an idiot.

marcus says

Who knows ?

you did not read the linked article?

marcus says

Let's supposed that those burglaries were done by black kids. And lets even further suppose that black kids aren't seen in that neighborhood all that often.
DO you really think that that means just seeing a black kid in the neighborhood makes it all that likely that he is a burgler ? If so, you're an idiot.

No, you friggin dipshit, what that means is the chances are pretty good that a bad guy that you find while on patrol will match the same descriptions found in all of the police reports and interviews of victims in the area. All of them. You can't be so stupid as to think a person should not use survival skills, or basic intellect, while on patrol for criminal activity?? How do you expect to perform such a task without some sort of "what to look for"?? Don't be an ass, just to be an ass.

go read the article, please.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/04/25/us-usa-florida-shooting-zimmerman-idUSBRE83O18H20120425

The PR piece that didn't discuss any of the negatives of zimmerman's history? Yes I read it. I understood "the word" was black kids were behind the burglaries. Someone saw a black kid looking in to a home. Seems believable, and I can see how it would prove all burglaries were done by black kids. I can also imagine some racist saying
burglaries = ******* .. And then someone says how do you know ? And they make up some BS. Or maybe it's true.

You probably didn't read my whole comment. Because it's irrelevant to my point. Which I understand you refuse to comprehend. Hey, that's just how you (t)roll.

Bap33 says

No, you friggin dipshit, what that means is the chances are pretty good that a bad guy that you find while on patrol will match the same descriptions found in all of the police reports and interviews of victims in the area.

Got to get to work, but this is an over the top logic error. And you probably even know that. If not, I'm sorry, I didn't know. Hey, you have many other strengths. There are other types of intelligence.

dude, please,

"Let's talk about the elephant in the room. I'm black, OK?" the woman said, declining to be identified because she anticipated backlash due to her race. She leaned in to look a reporter directly in the eyes. "There were black boys robbing houses in this neighborhood," she said. "That's why George was suspicious of Trayvon Martin."

""On February 6, the home of another Twin Lakes resident, Tatiana Demeacis, was burglarized. Two roofers working directly across the street said they saw two African-American men lingering in the yard at the time of the break-in. A new laptop and some gold jewelry were stolen. One of the roofers called police the next day after spotting one of the suspects among a group of male teenagers, three black and one white, on bicycles.

Police found Demeacis's laptop in the backpack of 18-year-old Emmanuel Burgess, police reports show, and charged him with dealing in stolen property. Burgess was the same man Zimmerman had spotted on February 2.

Burgess had committed a series of burglaries on the other side of town in 2008 and 2009, pleaded guilty to several, and spent all of 2010 incarcerated in a juvenile facility, his attorney said. He is now in jail on parole violations.""

Hey, guess what, that makes this bad guy under 18, 17 and 16 ... wow!! ... he's just a child!!

So marcus, go read the story, please. Open eyes and open mind and open heart. You'll be fine.

I do read your entire response. You sometimes respond like you take my postings as direct insults of like I am being snide. I aint.