patrick.net

Heraclitusstudent says

CBOEtrader says

Show me where the right is accusing the left of having "blood on their hands" for disagreeing

Here:
https://townhall.com/columnists/dennisprager/2016/07/12/the-new-york-times-and-the-left-have-blood-on-their-hands-n2191460

Nice find. This guy is obviously being using inciting language in an op-ed about a politically targeted murder. I disagree w his level of vitriol. However a 5 cop ambush murder is indeedtime for the left to admit and finger wag at the underlying motivating movements. Black lives matter is statistically more violent than the KKK. Fact.

Again this is fundamentally different than accusing gun rights proponents of having blood on their hands, or accusing Trump supporters of being racist (and therefore worthy of violent response).

Goran_K says

Which facts are they not understanding?

Pretty sure there are Republicans in all those cities. And who knows how many were committed by people from outside the murder location?

So, I'm not understanding how you think your statement is a fact.

CBOEtrader says

Are you saying it isn't true? Ask the murderers in Chicago, Detroit, Baltimore, and DC who they wanted to be president. Over 90% of them would say HRC.

Facts matter. It is the D supporters who kill each other, not Trumps

Yes, I'm absolutely saying it's not true. You're making HUGE assumptions here. Not facts.

Facts do matter.

HappyGilmore says

CBOEtrader says

Are you saying it isn't true? Ask the murderers in Chicago, Detroit, Baltimore, and DC who they wanted to be president. Over 90% of them would say HRC.

Facts matter. It is the D supporters who kill each other, not Trumps

Yes, I'm absolutely saying it's not true. You're making HUGE assumptions here. Not facts.

Facts do matter.

You think black guys in Chicago's west side would vote Trump? Lol

CBOEtrader says

None are true liberals. Being a true liberal today is labelled as white supremacy by the left.

This is sadly true. I’m a member of a FB group that’s mostly white Jews. Leftists nearly all of them. I really have to watch what I say... I mentioned that I liked Jordan Peterson’s philosophy, and got dog piled because apparently they all thought he was an asshole and a bigot and possibly a Nazi, definitely alt right. I retorted that Peterson is a classical Liberal, as defined in any text book. I was told he hates Jews and why would I like someone who hates Jews? I asked for references, and provided one of my own (a video of Peterson remarking on how most of his friends are Jews and he admires the Jewish people). I was told that this is a dog whistle to say that Jews are an evil cabal of selfish influencers. At that point I just gave up. There are none so blind as those who refuse to see.

HappyGilmore says

Pretty sure there are Republicans in all those cities.

Not very many, also, it's not about who is in the city, it's about who is committing the crimes.

We know the general demographic of those committing violent crime in those cities:

- black
- male
- under 25

Does that fit the typical GOP voter profile?

RafiMaas says

CBOEtrader says

Facts do matter.

You think black guys in Chicago's west side would vote Trump? Lol

"A fact is a statement that can be proven true or false. An opinion is an expression of a person's feelings that cannot be proven. Opinions can be based on facts or emotions and sometimes they are meant to deliberately mislead others."

"What one thinks" is irelevent, it is opinion. Facts require proof without proof it's just an opinion.

Fact. 88% of african americans voted for HRC. Fact. Low income African Americans voted for HRC at a higher rate than educated african americans. Fact 95% of shootings in Chicago are perpetrated by African Americans, from under-educated ghettos. Fact. This trend in African American communities is nation wide. Fact. Some cities are worse than others, but the predominant indicating factor for murder per capita is the % of poor african americans in that community.

This is FAR easier to "prove" w available facts than white privilege, the gender wage gap, the college rape culture, or any number of leftist talking points.

Fact. It is an obvious suggestion that most murders are committed by HRC supporters, not Trump supporters. No way you can suggest this isn't true.

Why is it difficult for rightists to make any point at all without attacking "leftists" using a false premise?

Quigley says

CBOEtrader says

None are true liberals. Being a true liberal today is labelled as white supremacy by the left.

This is sadly true. I’m a member of a FB group that’s mostly white Jews. Leftists nearly all of them. I really have to watch what I say... I mentioned that I liked Jordan Peterson’s philosophy, and got dog piled because apparently they all thought he was an asshole and a bigot and possibly a Nazi, definitely alt right. I retorted that Peterson is a classical Liberal, as defined in any text book. I was told he hates Jews and why would I like someone who hates Jews? I asked for references, and provided one of my own (a video of Peterson remarking on how most of his friends are Jews and he admires the Jewish people). I was told that this is a dog whistle to say that Jews are an evil cabal of selfish influencers. At that point I just gave up. There are none so blind as those who refuse to see.

Jordan Peterson is the perfect example. The guy is a LEFT LEANING CLASSIC LIBERAL, but gets called a white supremacist because he refuses to tow the progressive line. Progressives are anti-liberal, at their core.

Goran_K says

Not very many, also, it's not about who is in the city, it's about who is committing the crimes.

We know the general demographic of those committing violent crime in those cities:

- black
- male
- under 25

Does probably = a fact?

CBOEtrader says

Fact. 88% of african americans voted for HRC

Does 88% = 100%?

Does every black person vote?

Fact--53% of firearm deaths are from African Americans. 47% are NOT.

CBOEtrader says

Jordan Peterson is the perfect example. The guy is a LEFT LEANING CLASSIC LIBERAL, but gets called a white supremacist because he refuses to tow the progressive line. Progressives are anti-liberal, at their core.

Again I'll ask--what is your definition of liberal?

Because the right wingers are usually imbeciles.

I like calling stupid stupid and ridiculing vile, dumb people.

It really is time for Republicans to step out of the comfort zone and use the tariff/infrastructure drive to recruit Black Males.

Liberate them from the Ghetto Matriarchy. Advertise in Black Heavy districts:

"After 40 years of Democrats, has your community gotten safer? Economy better? Take a chance, vote Republican. You have nothing to lose."

Quigley says

This is sadly true. I’m a member of a FB group that’s mostly white Jews. Leftists nearly all of them.

Secular Jews, particularly in Academia, have replaced Judaism with Leftism. It's almost as pointless to argue with them as it is a Black Female Social Worker.

HappyGilmore says

Does probably = a fact?

No, fact = fact.





Worst part is, it's mostly blacks killing other blacks.

HappyGilmore says

53% of firearm deaths are from African Americans

Haha, OMG. First off, blacks are 13% of the population. Meaning even your murky stat suggests blacks commit 4 times the number of violence as other races. Second, GUN DEATHS includes suicide. Suicides are about 2/3rds of that purposely misleading figure "GUN DEATHS". GUN DEATHS is a purposefully disingenuous stat, only used by liars or parroted by the ignorant into the conversation about violent crime. Which of those are you? Also, whites commit suicide at a higher rate than blacks.

Therefore, even by your own purposefully misleading stats, blacks commit MORE THAN 4 times the gun violence than the average per capita (I think the actual stat is around 6.5 times). IN FACT, like i stated earlier, blacks commit SO MUCH MORE GUN VIOLENCE than other races, that you can build a decently accurate model of murder per capita knowing nothing more than % of african americans in a population. Where you find >90% white people, you also find murder rates identical to europe.

Sorry, those are the facts.

HappyGilmore says

what is your definition of liberal?

The colloquial use has been butchered, for sure, but the word "liberal" still has a proper definition. I encourage you to look it up.

The defining characteristic of a classic liberal is in holding individual rights as the important building block in society. There is no such thing as black rights, womens rights, gay rights... just human rights. Everyone is treated the same. Same laws, same hiring practices, etc... Our pathological leftists cult of diversity throws this most fundamental principle of liberalism out the window, even labeling it "white privilege".

CBOEtrader says

This form of bigotry is so deeply rooted into the psyche of the left that it becomes almost impossible to discuss a political topic w/o letting these direct personal attacks slip.

CBOEtrader says

you wouldnt be able to tell the difference between Nazi's and today's left.

Do others appreciate the irony here ? Lol. Pretty amazing, no ?

CBOEtrader says

HappyGilmore says

what is your definition of liberal?

The colloquial use has been butchered, for sure, but the word "liberal" still has a proper definition. I encourage you to look it up.

The defining characteristic of a classic liberal is in holding individual rights as the important building block in society. There is no such thing as black rights, womens rights, gay rights... just human rights. Everyone is treated the same. Same laws, same hiring practices, etc... Our pathological leftists cult of diversity throws this most fundamental principle of liberalism out the window, even labeling it "white privilege".

A true liberal would engage the following policies:

-Insist on a vote of congress and a declaration of war before engaging in overseas military action.
-fight vehemently against bank/wall st/financial bailouts and favorable policies towards such
-fully support and embrace the 1st and 5th amendments. Take a less strident(but still supportive) view of other amendments including the 2nd. A true liberal is absolutely appalled at what is going on currently in the schools and colleges.
-support tariffs that protect american industry and jobs.
-support a limited social safety net.
-support an increased tax on capital gains.

If this all sounds familiar, Bernie Sanders and Rand Paul are the closest. Senator Paul fits every part of this except the increase in capital gains tax. Senator Sanders is not too supportive of several amendments and probably would want to increase the social safety net. Also he embraces the garbage that is identity politics.

Funny that both are pariahs in some circles of the mainstream of their respective political parties. Also quirky that President Trump embraces many of the above. Probably why he has a leftist media and the leftists on this site in such fits.

CBOEtrader says

he defining characteristic of a classic liberal is in holding individual rights as the important building block in society. There is no such thing as black rights, womens rights, gay rights... just human rights. Everyone is treated the same. Same laws, same hiring practices, etc... Our pathological leftists cult of diversity throws this most fundamental principle of liberalism out the window, even labeling it "white privilege".

Exactly. The point of gay rights or womens' rights is to make them equal to non-gays or men. Like--giving women the right to vote. Or letting gays be recognized as married under the law. Liberals are trying to get individual rights the same no matter if you're gay, female, black, etc.

And they want everyone to have the same chances no matter if you were born black, Hispanic, or white.

CovfefeButDeadly says

Also quirky that President Trump embraces many of the above. Probably why he has a leftist media and the leftists on this site in such fits.

I agree with most of what you said until this. Trump isn't in favor of 1, 2, 3, 5, or 6. He is far from a liberal.

CBOEtrader says

Haha, OMG. First off, blacks are 13% of the population. Meaning even your murky stat suggests blacks commit 4 times the number of violence as other races. Second, GUN DEATHS includes suicide. Suicides are about 2/3rds of that purposely misleading figure "GUN DEATHS". GUN DEATHS is a purposefully disingenuous stat, only used by liars or parroted by the ignorant into the conversation about violent crime. Which of those are you? Also, whites commit suicide at a higher rate than blacks.

Therefore, even by your own purposefully misleading stats, blacks commit MORE THAN 4 times the gun violence than the average per capita (I think the actual stat is around 6.5 times). IN FACT, like i stated earlier, blacks commit SO MUCH MORE GUN VIOLENCE than other races, that you can build a decently accurate model of murder per capita knowing nothing more than % of african americans in a population. Where you find >90% white people, you also find murder rates identical to europe.

Sorry, those are the facts.

Some of those are facts, but what you said earlier was NOT a fact. Hopefully you see the difference.

Goran_K says

No, fact = fact.

Good, try to be more careful in your word choice in the future please.

HappyGilmore says

And they want everyone to have the same chances no matter if you were born black, Hispanic, or white.

Conservatives and true liberals want that.

Leftist/Democrats want to "correct for history" via reverse racism.

Goran_K says

Leftist/Democrats want to "correct for history" via reverse racism.

Some do. Most do not. Some believe (probably correctly) that there is enough subtle racism to justify some regulations to ensure that minorities are given a chance.

To overcome the sorts of people who think that only black ghetto queens get in fights at IHOP.

HappyGilmore says

Some do. Most do not. Some believe (probably correctly) that there is enough subtle racism to justify some regulations to ensure that minorities are giving a chance.

No they don't. They're doing it because it directly benefits them, not some "greater for mankind" quest to erase racism. There's a reason why asians are getting screwed, and Democrats are a-okay with that, as long as blacks and hispanics get some spots at Harvard.

Democrats/leftist are the most racist people in the country (fought to maintain slavery, formed the KKK, invented a new slavery via LBJ's "great society" movement, their entire identity politics platform).

Goran_K says

They're doing it because it directly benefits them,

Goran_K says

as long as blacks and hispanics get some spots at Harvard.

Either this is an illogical statement or you believe that democrats are mostly black and Hispanic. Which one is it?

Goran_K says

No they don't. They're doing it because it directly benefits them, not some "greater for mankind" quest to erase racism. There's a reason why asians are getting screwed, and Democrats are a-okay with that, as long as blacks and hispanics get some spots at Harvard.

Is this another "fact"? It's funny that Trump supporters are so well versed in what liberals and leftists believe. But are mortally offended when someone states what Trump supporters believe. How dare they???

Goran_K says

Democrats/leftist are the most racist people in the country (fought to maintain slavery, formed the KKK, invented a new slavery via LBJ's "great society" movement, their entire identity politics platform).

Nice bunch of nonsense there. Read up on history and learn how the makeup of the parties changed in the 1960s. Then you can talk about which is the party of racism.

And let’s shut down the “equal chance for underserved communities” argument with one single question.

Would you also be in favor of affirmative action programs for poor disadvantaged white children?

If the answer is “no” then you are a classically defined racist.

HappyGilmore says

Is this another "fact"?

Yes.



HappyGilmore says

Nice bunch of nonsense there. Read up on history and learn how the makeup of the parties changed in the 1960s. Then you can talk about which is the party of racism.

No they didn't. This is a myth Democrats try to push to pretend that their party was not the founders of the KKK and fought to preserve slavery. I've asked posters here who made that point to name 10 senators or elected officials who switched from the Democrat/DixieCrat party to the Republican party in the 60s, and never ever got a list longer than 1-2 senators (out of over 1500 elected seats). The reason? There wasn't a "party switch".

That's such a ridiculous claim. Like, why would GOP politicians suddenly become racist, and why would Democrat racist, who had been racist for over a hundred years, suddenly become pro-black benevolent non racist. That doesn't even make any sense.

LBJ was a well known racist. Jimmy Carter opened his re-election campaign at the headquarters of the KKK. DNC e-mails leaked by wikileaks show DNC internal staffers referred to hispanic outreach as the Taco campaign, and also showed two DNC staffers cracking jokes about a black woman's name. Hillary Clinton's mentor was a KKK grand dragon for fucks sake.

Democrats have, and will always OWN the most vile racist history of the United States.

Goran_K says

Democrats/leftist are the most racist people in the country (

Can you please clarify if you mean all, most, many, some, etc. democrats/leftists. Because I suspect a personal attack on other users here.

Goran_K says

Democrats have, and will always OWN the most vile racist history of the United States.

Yep. And don't forget the Democrat's vile history with Eugenics.

But hats off to the Democrats and their Media enablers in their successful bid to re-write history and shield the Democrats from their racist past and spin it all on Republicans.

Simply put, the South became less racist once they started to become more Republican.

Twenty years from now when Democrats finally become wise on science and biology and stop their support of abortion on demand - they will probably find a way to re-write history showing that Republicans are the party of Planned Parenthood.

FP says

Can you please clarify if you mean all, most, many, some, etc. democrats/leftists. Because I suspect a personal attack on other users here.

In general.

Goran_K says

In general

Please use this or similar qualifier in future so that it is clear that you are not insulting the other users.

socal2 says

Yep. And don't forget the Democrat's vile history with Eugenics.

Exactly. Margaret Sanger is a well known DEMOCRAT heroine who is till this day revered by well known Democrat politicians, and Democrat voters despite her KKK membership, her history of planned extinction of black people or whom she called "unfit", "weeds", etc and her overall support for the Eugenics movement. I find no difference between Sanger and Hitler in their views of people they considered "unfit".

" I admire Margaret Sanger being a pioneer in trying to empower women to have some control over their bodies and I deplore statements that you have referenced. That is the way we often are when we look at flawed human beings. There are things that we admire and things we deplore." - Hillary Clinton

FP says

Please use this or similar qualifier in future so that it is clear that you are not insulting the other users.

You don't have to worry about me. I'm the mod here, and I'll keep things nice and clean for everyone. Rest assured.

FP, knock it off. Being purposefully trolly and insulting of a mod isn't going to work out for you. Trying to save you some heart ache.

@patrick,

Your moderator, Goran, is again:
1) attacking me personally for no reason
2) lying - claiming that I've insulted him, which is not true; I was actually quite polite.
3) deleted my comment, which contained no personal attacks or has in any other way violated the site's rules

Please moderate your moderator.

Please, let's all stick to discussing topics rather than discussing each other.

Maybe it's impossible, and people just lose track of everything except hating their rivals.

I suppose that's the basis for "divide and conquer". As soon as a group is divided, there is only infighting, and no attention to external threats.

Goran_K says

HEYYOU says

The Right to keep & bear,it's accoutrements & affects,trumps the lives of the right's loved ones & friends.

Fact: If you simply banned gun ownership to leftist/democrats, the U.S gun homicide rate would be comparable to the UK or Australia per capita.

and how would that work since the highest murder rates are in liberal gun law red states and the lowest murder rates are in strict gun law blue states. Yet another inconvenient FACT.

Nice job cherry picking out a few selected cities though. Extrapolating that to the entire country and calling if fact doesn't work, but hey whatever.