patrick.net

Sometimes it's just better to ask a question than to argue.

When they come to the conclusion themselves, then it's their conclusion and they will love it and stick with it.

For example: "How is it possible that no one got the flu in 2020?" Just ask and then leave the area and don't argue. Arguing makes them take the opposite point of view. Leaving lets them reach new conclusions.

It's also may work to suggest that they "overlooked" something. Everyone overlooks things, and it's not shameful to change your mind based on that.

Graphs are really good at reaching people too, giving them a visual perspective of the argument:

Patrick says

Sometimes it's just better to ask a question than to argue.

When they come to the conclusion themselves, then it's their conclusion and they will love it and stick with it.

Generally yes, and I do agree with you - for most people.

Not with him though man. He doesn't read, nor does he care to do research. He is a CNN headline watcher.

I have to push back with him.

He treats my wife like crap when he visits, and we have tried for the last several years (since we left CA) to build and maintain that bridge with him - but he's just pissed all over it man. He acts like the world revolves around him and the only person that's right is him.

By the way, he is about 350+ pounds and diabetic. Yet, he is an expert on nutrition as well.

Some people are trail buddies rather than the friends you keep. They are good company while engaged in a mutual pursuit or a portion of your life’s path but they eventually go their own way that diverges from your path and the ride is over. Best you can hope for there is a cordial parting.

I had a best friend like that. Dude went super left, married a harridan who demanded to remain childless, and sucked him into her self-centered lifestyle. I no longer have anything in common with the guy except for shared history. Our paths have completely diverged, and we no longer talk.
Way it goes I guess. Plenty of people in this world. Lots of them are nice, although the percentages go way up once you leave California.
I’m not much on the people here. Some nice people sure, but they aren’t that common. And you’ll probably meet them at church.

ThreeBays says

FDA hasn't approved HCQ or Ivermectin (worm medicine) for Covid - since when was FDA the last word for rightists?

But they have approved it for other uses and these medications have a strong history of safety.

The FDA wont touch the mRNA therapies with a ten foot pole. They've been burnt before.

Onvacation says

The FDA wont touch the mRNA therapies with a ten foot pole. They've been burnt before.

What do you mean by this statement?

joshuatrio says

By the way, he is about 350+ pounds and diabetic. Yet, he is an expert on nutrition as well.

Next time he pisses you off, send him this:

ThreeBays says

joshuatrio says

FDA hasn't approved HCQ or Ivermectin (worm medicine) for Covid - since when was FDA the last word for rightists?

Unless I'm reading this improperly, HCQ has been approved for use by the FDA for over 50 years.

https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/cder/daf/index.cfm?event=overview.process&varApplNo=009768

They pulled it for covid use, despite it being effective.

No, the FDA is not the gold standard, but if this shit hasn't even been tested on animals yet, why would I pump this into my body.

Come on now.

joshuatrio says

he is about 350+ pounds and diabetic

I think that may be your explanation right there. He probably has a psychological need to feel validated.

joshuatrio says

They pulled it for covid use, despite it being effective.

I'd go further and say they pulled HCQ exactly because it is effective.

They are not allowed to get an emergency use authorization to experiment on the public with the "vaccines" when there is an effective existing treatment.

And of course it's much better that many people die than that Trump get even the slightest credit for being right, if you think like a Democrat.

ThreeBays says

joshuatrio says

FDA hasn't approved HCQ or Ivermectin (worm medicine) for Covid - since when was FDA the last word for rightists?

They don't need to because they are far more safer than the experimental vaccines err biological agents, with a history of decades used in humans and animals. Ever heard of off label use? Every MD is free to do so for any generally approved drug, no need for any agency to weigh in.

ThreeBays says

Patrick says

I'd go further and say they pulled HCQ exactly because it is effective.

They are not allowed to get an emergency use authorization to experiment on the public with the "vaccines" when there is an effective existing treatment.

And of course it's much better that many people die than that Trump get even the slightest credit for being right, if you think like a Democrat.

It's not effective enough to change any authorization, and probably not effective at all based the studies.



Has anyone here taken the drug?

The "studies" done didn't administer early and moreover without zinc. HCQ is a zinc ionosphere. MDs around the world had great success with hcq plus zinc. You can take these "studies" straight to the trashcan.

mell says

The "studies" done didn't administer early and moreover without zinc. HCQ is a zinc ionosphere. MDs around the world had great success with hcq plus zinc. You can take these "studies" straight to the trashcan.

+1 It's a nice glossy to show off to your Leftist friends, but those studies are completely flawed for this reason. Let's talk Ivermectin, which has been proven to be VERY effective at all stages of COVID infection and even prevention. These experimental vaccines are complete BS when there are WAAAAY safer and proven treatments.

WineHorror1 says

Onvacation says

The FDA wont touch the mRNA therapies with a ten foot pole. They've been burnt before.

What do you mean by this statement?

FDA is not approving until after the human trials are done in 2023. They got burnt by swine flu and polio vaccines.

I read it somewhere on the internet.

ThreeBays says

Must be tru.

yup

You can always find articles to confirm your bias. But they won't confirm your biased.

porkchopexpress says

mell says

The "studies" done didn't administer early and moreover without zinc. HCQ is a zinc ionosphere. MDs around the world had great success with hcq plus zinc. You can take these "studies" straight to the trashcan.

+1 It's a nice glossy to show off to your Leftist friends, but those studies are completely flawed for this reason. Let's talk Ivermectin, which has been proven to be VERY effective at all stages of COVID infection and even prevention. These experimental vaccines are complete BS when there are WAAAAY safer and proven treatments.

Agreed Ivermectin is more effective than HCQ and likely even a tad bit safer, but HCQ plus zinc is still a formidable 2nd option. Maybe all 3 can be given together for maximum effect but nobody has any interest in finding out since there's zero money to be made with these old drugs.

https://www.ntd.com/denmark-drops-johnson-johnson-covid-19-vaccine-over-possible-blood-clot-link_607482.html?utm_source=patrick.net&utm_medium=patrick.net&utm_campaign=patrick.net

ThreeBays says

Hungary (#1 in deaths per capita in the world) is a HCQ world power https://hungarianfreepress.com/2020/04/11/hungary-is-a-hydroxychloroquine-world-power/
Czechs (#3) are big on HCQ too.

Easy to explain if you must assume you can trust any of these numbers from any country. The avg. age is around 43 for those 2 whereas the US is at 38, that's a huge difference, plenty more really old people over there.

Patrick says

And of course it's much better that many people die than that Trump get even the slightest credit for being right, if you think like a Democrat.

And that’s what has pissed me off about Democrats and their bureaucracy and healthcare shenanigans. If you got Covid before the vaccine, good luck getting medical care. Doctors wouldn’t touch you or prescribe anything to help you recover. You had to go to the ER, and they were likely to stick you in a ventilator and sedate you so you never wake up again. Tens of thousands of people died like this, many simply because they were scared and acquiesced to medical malpractice. Doctors killed more people this year than any other source. It’s really disgraceful.
And Democrats were urging them on, with their grubby little hands on the doctors licenses just in case they got any ideas about curing people.

This last year proved that Democrats are our worst domestic terrorists by far.

One of the comments from the newest Denninger blog entry:

"
Just got the phone call that I was dreading. My 80 year old father who is otherwise in terrific health for his age just had a stroke this afternoon. My mother, who is also 80 is not in the same health situation. Smoker all her life, a little overweight, pre-diabetic, and suffers from migraines. Since my mother was getting the shot, my father did it with her (both got their second shots 3 weeks ago). I warned my father that he should skip it since he is probably healthier than most men 30 years younger than him (has worked outdoors most of his life and is one of the strongest 80-year-olds I have ever come across), and told my mother that she was still taking a gamble but at least, with her conditions, she was in that 50/50 club (although if she would go the ivermectin/zinc/Vit-D/inhaler route, she would probably be fine). When they tell you that it is an experimental vax and they have no liability, they mean it - and you are rolling the dice with life. Looks like my father is going to be on the losing end of that gamble unfortunately. I will let you all know what gets reported if it comes down to that.
"

Heartbreaking.

mell says

One of the comments from the newest Denninger blog entry:

"
Just got the phone call that I was dreading. My 80 year old father who is otherwise in terrific health for his age just had a stroke this afternoon. My mother, who is also 80 is not in the same health situation. Smoker all her life, a little overweight, pre-diabetic, and suffers from migraines. Since my mother was getting the shot, my father did it with her (both got their second shots 3 weeks ago). I warned my father that he should skip it since he is probably healthier than most men 30 years younger than him (has worked outdoors most of his life and is one of the strongest 80-year-olds I have ever come across), and told my mother that she was still taking a gamble but at least, with her conditions, she was in that 50/50 club (although if she would go the ivermectin/zinc/Vit-D/inhaler route, she would probably be fine). When they tell you that it is an experimental vax and they have no liability, they mean it - and ...

Good luck Mell. I'm hopeful for you and your family.

ThreeBays says

Shaman says

If you got Covid before the vaccine, good luck getting medical care. Doctors wouldn’t touch you or prescribe anything to help you recover. You had to go to the ER, and they were likely to stick you in a ventilator and sedate you so you never wake up again. Tens of thousands of people died like this, many simply because they were scared and acquiesced to medical malpractice. Doctors killed more people this year than any other source. It’s really disgraceful.

The brainwashing is insane. Get out of your bubble man!

What are you talking about, that is absolutely accurate. I know a few people who got the "nothing" til ICU treatment. Criminal.

WineHorror1 says

mell says

One of the comments from the newest Denninger blog entry:

"
Just got the phone call that I was dreading. My 80 year old father who is otherwise in terrific health for his age just had a stroke this afternoon. My mother, who is also 80 is not in the same health situation. Smoker all her life, a little overweight, pre-diabetic, and suffers from migraines. Since my mother was getting the shot, my father did it with her (both got their second shots 3 weeks ago). I warned my father that he should skip it since he is probably healthier than most men 30 years younger than him (has worked outdoors most of his life and is one of the strongest 80-year-olds I have ever come across), and told my mother that she was still taking a gamble but at least, with her conditions, she was in that 50/50 club (although if she would go the ivermectin/zinc/Vit-D/inhaler route, she would probably be fine). When they tell y...

It's from someone else - but it hits home. My Dad already had the jabs (so far so good) and I'm fighting my Mom - who had Covid and recovered without major illness (regular flu symptoms, she's slim and reasonably fit) - not to take it, but may lose that one, the FUD propaganda is strong. They keep measuring the antibodies and claiming she will lose immunity as they fade which is bullshit since the T cells do all the heavy lifting likely for decades. Plus the constant propaganda about !strains and mutations! (which t cell memory protects as well against). Thanks anyways!

https://c19hcq.com/ continues to accumulate overwhelming evidence for the efficacy of HCQ.

Effectiveness of Ivermectin, but you need a court order to get US hospitals to prescribe it to dying patients. They don't the experimental gene therapy trials to end, so they continue to let people suffer without this life-saving drug that won a Nobel Prize.

https://trialsitenews.com/top-yale-doctor-researcher-ivermectin-works-including-for-long-haul-covid/

Well, if people stop dying, then Fauci & Co.'s revenue stream dries up.

So they must die to keep the profits going.

ThreeBays says

Doctors killed more people this year than any other source. It’s really disgraceful.

The brainwashing is insane. Get out of your bubble man!

Fact Check: TRUE!
Johns Hopkins study suggests medical errors are third-leading cause of death in U.S.
https://hub.jhu.edu/2016/05/03/medical-errors-third-leading-cause-of-death/

Total 239 studies 3,801 authors 364,893 patients
Positive effects 182 studies 2,798 authors 253,483 patients

Seems like an awful lot of patients to me.

ThreeBays says

The brainwashing is insane. Get out of your bubble man!

Back at ya. Any other ridiculous things to say?

ThreeBays says

I opened the 3 largest controlled studies that they put in the "Positive" bin for early treatment.

Do you still not understand the point of most here? Covid isn't going to kill you. We have members here that got it and plenty of anecdotal evidence from friends and family. This is over a year after Covid got out.

We're 9 months from seeing early effects of the vaccines. You literally have no clue what it could do to you. I'd agree it's mostly safe to get the vaccine, but I'd also say covid won't kill me anyway. The 70+ crowd has minimal concerns if you're being realistic. What 5% death rate for people that are mostly dead?

My 9 year old nephews best friend was diagnosed with leukemia last week. We have no idea when our time is coming. I sure as shit am not ingesting something I have no clue about. I'm not trying to be a dick, but your point of view is massively flawed. It's not right or left. It's data and facts. Vaccinate yourself, just don't try to sell us on it. If we wanted it, we'd get it. Not much else to discuss.

ThreeBays says

This forum is getting pretty short of different points of view. Seems like a loss to me to have this place be an echo chamber. I don't know if that's what Patrick wanted out of patrick.net or not.

I disagree. I don't like many points of view here and I'll address them with users frequently.

For example on Covid. I don't really have to wear a mask where I'm at 98% of the time, but when I get closer to Chicago I will. Restaurants are one example. Many users here say fuck that and just not wear them. I agree with them, but I will wear a mask. I just don't fight them on the occasional mask wearing. They probably think I'm a cuck or something throwing on the mask from time to time. Whatever.

Ultimately the vaccines were pushed through in record time. Partly by Trump and still sold by Biden. So this isn't really left or right anymore. We have over 400+ days of data on this virus. It's not a pandemic. It's not deadly. We have 2-3 months of data from a larger sample size for SHORT term reactions. FDA hasn't approved it.

For me, the outcome from getting Covid would be fine to a nothing burger. I simply don't know with any of these vaccines.

WineHorror1 says

I used to be more on the pro-vaccine side but the BS on the pro-vaxxers exceeds the BS on the anti-vaxxers.

I want to make you aware of what you THINK are "anti-vaxers".

I'm not opposed to vaccinations at all. I think they are largely positive. What I object to is the denial there can be detriments - but it may well be worth hurting or even killing 1000 people to save 1,000,000.

I just have no belief this government is working on behalf our the population at this point and I will point out that what is called a "vaccination" today, was not called that, just 3 years ago. This is not an attenuated or killed virus, it's experimental, even in animal studies.

The polio vaccine program of the 1960's - I think that was done to help the population because the population was valued as a resource, but a vaccination for a virus that is largely not dangerous, and only kills (at very most) less than 1% of the population? I'm doubtful of. Especially when it threatens most the elderly - because our government I don't think has any interest in paying Social Security. They would love to kill off the elderly.

Boomers run the country, and they are largely viscous and sociopathic. They are nothing like their parents.

ThreeBays says

This forum is getting pretty short of different points of view. Seems like a loss to me to have this place be an echo chamber. I don't know if that's what Patrick wanted out of patrick.net or not.

Well, this particular thread is about the shot not really being a vaccination and more of an experiment... what do you expect?

Patrick says

https://c19hcq.com/ continues to accumulate overwhelming evidence for the efficacy of HCQ.

Thanks Patrick, I was looking for that site.

ThreeBays says

This forum is getting pretty short of different points of view. Seems like a loss to me to have this place be an echo chamber. I don't know if that's what Patrick wanted out of patrick.net or not.

That's why we appreciate you being here. It's important to hear the leftist lies so we know what we are up against.

ThreeBays says

WookieMan says

My 9 year old nephews best friend was diagnosed with leukemia last week. We have no idea when our time is coming. I sure as shit am not ingesting something I have no clue about. I'm not trying to be a dick, but your point of view is massively flawed. It's not right or left. It's data and facts. Vaccinate yourself, just don't try to sell us on it. If we wanted it, we'd get it. Not much else to discuss.

I'm not trying to sell you on it, just dispelling some bad data when I see it.

This forum is getting pretty short of different points of view. Seems like a loss to me to have this place be an echo chamber. I don't know if that's what Patrick wanted out of patrick.net or not.

Most of us are not anti vaccination, just about the freedom of making informed personal decisions on each vaccine. Most if not all are probably sold on tetanus and polio vaccines, some may take the flu vaccine, some may take mmr boosters. Some may see value in hep b, pneumococcal or shingles vaccines as they age. The point is that so far each and all of these vaccines are totally optional yet uptaken by a decent percentage, so why make any changes with the covid vaccine and have a mass propaganda campaign and coercion? It simply doesn't pass the smell test. And the data at hand and evolving is certain cause for caution and review.

mell says

Most of us are not anti vaccination, just about the freedom of making informed personal decisions on each vaccine. Most if not all are probably sold on tetanus and polio vaccines, some may take the flu vaccine, some may take mmr boosters.

This.

GREAT CLOSING WORDS - R. KENNEDY JR, DR. JUDY MIKOVITS, DR. MARTIN & DR. ROCCO GALATI

It's not about protecting us from disease, it's about controlling populations.

Worth reading.

Link between vaxx and increased death rate.

https://twitter.com/Metabo_PhD/status/1387548104073912324