patrick.net

Somebody posted this elsewhere, but watch the strange reciprocity between attacks on infrastructure in Russia, and "accidents" a few weeks later in the USA.

Germany Appears to Have Inadvertently Revealed the UK and France have Soldiers in Ukraine

German Chancellor Scholz stands accused of handing Russia a propaganda coup in order to smooth over his own political difficulties as he claims the presence of British and French soldiers aiding Ukrainian forces.

Scholz has been accused of abusing intelligence and being a bad ally by angry NATO politicians after his remarks about the level of involvement he claims there is of the British and French in the deployment of the Storm Shadow / SCALP cruise missiles they have given to Ukraine, and which have been deployed with devastating effect.

Ukraine continues to demand Germany hand over its stock of Taurus bunker-buster cruise missiles to help it fight Russia. Indeed, the powerful and long-range weapon which Berlin has proven resistant to supply has been the subject of debate in Germany dragging on now for several months. Chancellor Olaf Scholz insists providing the weapon, which has the endurance to strike deep into Russian areas would represent an irresponsible escalation of the war and make Germany a party to the conflict in a way its previous donations of weapon systems and ammunition had not.

Answering questions on the subject again this week, Chancellor Scholz developed his reasoning for refusing the weapon by stating it was of such complexity there would necessarily have to be German soldiers present in Ukraine to program and set up the weapon before it could be fired. Scholz said this week: “What is being done in the way of target control and accompanying target control on the part of the British and the French can’t be done in Germany. Everyone who has dealt with this system knows that”.

Indeed, he doubled down on this on Friday: “I will not support any decision that would somehow involve German soldiers in a military operation related to Russia’s terrible war against Ukraine”.

Scholz saying British and French troops are active inside Ukraine in this more active way — helping Ukrainians to program and target individual missiles — is a considerable step beyond this minor embassy protection role. Figures from the United Kingdom and within Germany itself have lashed out at Scholz for, it is alleged, throwing his allies under the bus to try and diffuse domestic political tension over his own issues.

https://www.breitbart.com/europe/2024/03/01/germany-inadvertently-reveals-the-uk-has-soldiers-in-ukraine/

Green Party of Germany is behind Scholtz's move.

Ukraine’s Starting to Get Dangerous by James Rickards

A lot of people seem to have forgotten about the war in Ukraine. That’s a mistake.

Russia is slowly but steadily defeating Ukraine, which is becoming increasingly obvious to everyone except the most anti-Russian diehards.

That’s leading to desperation in elite Western circles determined to stop Russia one way or the other. In their minds, they simply can’t let Putin win. They think that if Putin wins in Ukraine, he’ll next move on to the Baltic states, Poland and elsewhere.

You know the West is getting desperate based on recent threats by France’s Emmanuel Macron to send troops to Ukraine.

The vice president of the Russia Duma, Pyotr Tolstoy (descendant of the great Russian writer Leo Tolstoy), warned that French troops would be priority targets for Russian forces if they entered Ukraine.

Even though France would send troops independent of NATO, that puts us on a very dangerous path that ultimately leads to direct conflict between NATO and Russia. And that path ends in nuclear war ultimately.

Tolstoy added that it would take “just two minutes to nuke Paris.” It’s not hard to envision how quickly things could escalate if France decided to send troops to Ukraine.

More Escalation

Meanwhile, NATO is preparing to send F-16s to Ukraine. Airfields in Ukraine are highly vulnerable to Russian attack, especially since Ukraine’s air defenses are heavily depleted at this point and the Russian air force is becoming increasingly active in Ukraine.

But if NATO allows the F-16s to be based on its own airbases, Putin has warned that these airfields would become a “legitimate target” if strikes against Russian forces were launched from them.

By the way, Russia has hypersonic missiles that NATO has no practical ability to shoot down, so these attacks would likely be successful. Of course, NATO would have to retaliate in kind. You can imagine where all this could lead.

We’re already well along the escalation ladder. And the higher you go, the more face you stand to lose if you back down. I warned about that from the outset of the war.

But the entire notion that Russia poses some existential threat to NATO or Europe is absurd.

Putin Has Nothing to Gain and Everything to Lose

First off, the theory that Putin will invade other countries if he wins in Ukraine is nonsense. The Russian army lacks the men and materiel to occupy Ukraine while simultaneously invading other countries.

This isn’t the Soviet Union with its massive tank armies poised to roll over Western Europe. And Soviet communism is long dead, so there’s no ideological basis for Russia to invade Europe. These days Russia is a conservative, Orthodox Christian nation.

But more importantly, Putin has absolutely no incentive to invade any of these nations, which are NATO members. What do they have that he wants?

All it would do is trigger Article 5 of the NATO Charter, which stipulates that an attack on one member is an attack on all, inviting a massive NATO response. At that point, you’re on the fast track to nuclear war.

Putin is fully aware of that.

Fearmongers like to point to what Putin once said in a speech: “Whoever doesn’t miss the Soviet Union doesn’t have a heart.”

They take that as proof that he wants to recreate the Soviet Union. But they conveniently omit what he said next:

“Whoever wants it back doesn’t have a brain.”

Whatever you think of Putin, he definitely has a brain. He has no intention to restore the Soviet Union.

More here:https://dailyreckoning.com/ukraines-starting-to-get-dangerous/

RayAmerica says

First off, the theory that Putin will invade other countries if he wins in Ukraine is nonsense. The Russian army lacks the men and materiel to occupy Ukraine while simultaneously invading other countries.

I wish you all would make up your minds.

You all have been telling us for 3 years that Russia is so strong and dangerous that the West risks WWIII by supporting Ukraine to defend their sovereign borders against Russia's illegal invasion.

In reality, Russia's military is totally fucking pathetic and are stuck in a total quagmire where the front lines have barely moved at all in 2+ years despite 10's of thousands of dead Russians.

Reading all the mershemeiers of this world one soon learns that USSR is simultaneously so stronk that any resistance is futile and also so weak it can fall apart any moment, shedding nuclear weapons into the hands of terrorists uncontrollably.

We also learn that America is about to go bankrupt because it spent of 5% of its defence budget in 2 years and simultaneously that Soviets can totally afford spending 40% of their entire budget on the war indefinitely w/o any ill effects on them.

But the conclusion is always the same: we all must surrender to the Soviets and fulfill all their delusional imperial dreams, no matter what international laws and treaties say.

Clown world.

socal2 says

You all have been telling us for 3 years that Russia is so strong and dangerous that the West risks WWIII by supporting Ukraine to defend their sovereign borders against Russia's illegal invasion.

In reality, Russia's military is totally fucking pathetic and are stuck in a total quagmire where the front lines have barely moved at all in 2+ years despite 10's of thousands of dead Russians.

^^^ retarded. Russia has been fighting a war of attrition. And now that the Ukey soldiers have been slaughtered en masse, the Russians are advancing 5-8 miles per day along the entire front.

But socal2 can't admit to any of that because that would also force him to admit he's been trolling us with complete bulkshit for the past 2+ years.

UkraineIsTotallyFucked says

^^^ retarded. Russia has been fighting a war of attrition. And now that the Ukey soldiers have been slaughtered en masse, the Russians are advancing 5-8 miles per day along the entire front.

But socal2 can't admit to any of that because that would also force him to admit he's been trolling us with complete bulkshit for the past 2+ years.

It's a zero sum game. No one is going to "win" is the point I've been making. This has another decade to go. Potentially longer. There's been fighting for a long time. Russia took Crimea. Ukraine just sat there and took it? There's been conflict for a good decade. Russia just announced it 3 years ago is all. And yes it is a war of attrition.

Knowing the ethnicities and personalities, this will easily be a 20-30 year war. The only caveat is if Ukraine can strike Russia proper and disrupt oil and gas. Even then I see this turning into a Korean war type situation. No winner. Still officially at war with pauses in combat.

UkraineIsTotallyFucked says

the Russians are advancing 5-8 miles per day along the entire front.

If that was even remotely true, Russia would be knocking on Kiev's doorstep in about 2 weeks.

It is one thing to say Ukraine can't "win" (i.e. push all Russian forces out of Ukraine).

But why must you make hyperbolic and foolish statements like the one above that are so provably false making you look utterly retarded? I don't think Russia has advanced 5 miles in a single day at a single point since the initial invasion 3 years ago. Let alone advancing 5-8 miles on the entire front.

Do you think we are retarded and can't look at the battle map which has shown basically the same trench lines for over 2 years despite Russia's latest "winter offensive" throwing tens of thousands of young Russian men into the meat grinder?


https://storymaps.arcgis.com/stories/36a7f6a6f5a9448496de641cf64bd375

WookieMan says

Knowing the ethnicities and personalities, this will easily be a 20-30 year war.

Russia's only chance of a "win" was to decapitate the leadership in Kiev in the first month of the war.

The drunk, corrupt and incompetent Russian military failed to achieve their Blitzkrieg - and are now stuck in a grinding stalemate fighting against entrenched defenders who are taking out multi-million dollar Russian tanks with $1,000 drones.

socal2 says

The drunk, corrupt and incompetent Russian military failed to achieve their Blitzkrieg - and are now stuck in a grinding stalemate fighting against entrenched defenders who are taking out multi-million dollar Russian tanks with $1,000 drones.

Do you honestly believe that if Russia wanted to wipe Kiev off of the map they couldn't have done that? Really? Obviously, that was never their objective.

socal2 says

WookieMan says

Knowing the ethnicities and personalities, this will easily be a 20-30 year war.

Russia's only chance of a "win" was to decapitate the leadership in Kiev in the first month of the war.

The drunk, corrupt and incompetent Russian military failed to achieve their Blitzkrieg - and are now stuck in a grinding stalemate fighting against entrenched defenders who are taking out multi-million dollar Russian tanks with $1,000 drones.

For sure hasn't gone the way Russia wanted it. This is a bar fight. It's still inside at this point. No one has taken it outside yet. Once western aid goes away it goes outside and the gloves come off. That might take a decade. Either way there will be no winner is my point.

The bridge to Crimea is going at some point in a big way. The first attack on it will look like child's play. Ukraine will take out multiple support columns. I think it happens before June/July. If they cut that off they can focus the front in different areas. I ultimately don't have a pony in this race, just predicting what I think is coming.

Cut off the southern supply and Russia only can attack Westward on the border and cannot reenforce southern troops. That bridge is coming down. Hence why I say this will be another decade at least. If Ukraine can collapse sizable portions of the bridge they can attack construction crews trying to rebuild it with basic drones. Then work to cut off Crimea from land access. That's about the only way they could "win" in the long run. That bridge needs to go.

The Zelensky government needs to step up their kidnapping efforts if their much vaunted army is going to be properly manned for the upcoming 'Spring Offensive.' Last year's offensive was, by all accounts, a complete disaster. But hey, maybe the latest kidnapped crop of "I don't want to fight" young boys, old men and women will turn the tide? Maybe even some of them can fly those F-16s that we've sent them?

Ukrainian military leaders know they can't win on battlefield – Guardian

Their army’s weakness has prompted Kiev’s strikes on Russian infrastructure, senior officers have allegedly told the London newspaper

Ukraine has no other option but to launch attacks inside Russia, including on its oil infrastructure, because its army faces continued setbacks on the battlefield, The Guardian has reported, citing the leadership of the country's military intelligence service, the GUR.

Officers who allegedly spoke to the British newspaper were candid about Kiev’s desperate military situation. GUR Brigadier-General Dmitry Timkov said his country was like a patient on life support.

”We are attached to a drip. We have enough drugs to stay alive. But, if the West wants us to win, we need the full treatment,” he admitted, referring to the dwindling quantities of military aid coming from Kiev's western backers.

Major General Vadim Skibitsky, the deputy head of the GUR, admitted that a Ukrainian victory, widely promised by Kiev, is impossible at the moment. Facing multiple setbacks, the agency had “no choice” but to launch strikes deep inside Russia. He described this as a “NATO-standard procedure, known as center of gravity, or COG.”

More here: https://www.rt.com/russia/595341-ukraine-gur-attacks-guardian/

PS: No surprise at all. Everyone with even half of a brain knows that Ukraine never had a chance to defeat Russia ... as in NEVER.

RayAmerica says

Do you honestly believe that if Russia wanted to wipe Kiev off of the map they couldn't have done that? Really? Obviously, that was never their objective.

Do you honestly believe Russia wanted to have a stalemate the last 3 years and over 300,000 casualties with so little to show?

Face it, Russia expected another 2 week victory like they had in Crimea and Georgia and now they are trapped in a brutal slog, and Putin is throwing everything he can at the front line with little gains to justify his total cockup of a war.

People are on crack if they truly believe if this was all part of Russia's plan.

Not a chance in hell Putin expected to be where he is today 3 years later with so little to show.

UkraineIsTotallyFucked says

Every example I just gave except for the EMP non-state perpetrators can pull off on a budget financed by credit cards, for crying out loud.

yep. Richmond, Benicia, And Martinez all have big refineries with lots of flammable stuff.

socal2 says

Yet - Russia still hasn't been able to cripple their much smaller and weaker next door neighbor....

Then why are Ukey propaganda outlets like the Kyiv Independent screaming otherwise?

socal2 says

Do you honestly believe Russia wanted to have a stalemate the last 3 years and over 300,000 casualties with so little to show?

I think Russia knows this is a war of attrition and will fight it that way, that means to drag it out as long as possible to deplete resources. This is what the United States wanted incorrectly believing this would lead to the destruction of Russia, due to incompetence in our State Department which we've had ever since the Neocons took over.

I HIGHLY doubt 300,000 Russians have been killed in this conflict. Perhaps as many as 30,000. I wouldn't be surprised that 300,000 Ukrainians have been killed which would explain why the average age of a fighter is in their mid 40's, and women are being recruited and slaughtered.

Once this war is finished, if the shitheads that run our foreign policy now are still in power, they will just start another war. Perhaps in Georgia, they may have recently tried in Kazakhstan (remember that?), they'll do it somewhere. By fighting this war slowly, and by utterly destroying Ukraine and driving it into the worst poverty imaginable which they WILL EXPERIENCE, border states of Russia MIGHT not be able to be convinced to get their entire population killed, and drive their entire nation into poverty to fight a war they have no hope of winning because the US promises they have your back, when they don't.

Depends if they have a traitor in power like Zelenskyy who won't only just follow stupid orders from the traitors in our state department, but will have enough power over their country to get them all to commit national suicide.

socal2 says

Face it, Russia expected another 2 week victory like they had in Crimea and Georgia and now they are trapped in a brutal slog, and Putin is throwing everything he can at the front line with little gains to justify his total cockup of a war.

That's silly. If Putin was "throwing everything he can" into this war, Kiev would have been bombed and Zelenskyy would be dead.

socal2 says

Not a chance in hell Putin expected to be where he is today 3 years later with so little to show.

I disagree. Putin began this war realizing he was fighting a proxy war with the United States. It wasn't Russia claiming they were going to win any moment, it was the US propaganda machine claiming that Russia said this. Our media just lied about what Russia expected. It always lies about every war, in the stupidest, dumbest ways, and if you can't see this now, you just can't see at all.

socal2 says

Do you honestly believe Russia wanted to have a stalemate the last 3 years and over 300,000 casualties with so little to show?

Keeps making the 300,000 lie. Then when called out on it, he deflects with "what do you think the figure is"...as if opinions trump facts.

UkraineIsTotallyFucked says

socal2 says

Do you honestly believe Russia wanted to have a stalemate the last 3 years and over 300,000 casualties with so little to show?

Keeps making the 300,000 lie. Then when called out on it, he deflects with "what do you think the figure is"...as if opinions trump facts.

The figure I hear bandied about is 30,000 - 40,000 Russian dead, more than 250,000 Ukrainians dead, but there's no way to know. Nobody talking about this conflict has reliable information, or if they do, their government tells them to lie, and they do.

richwicks says

That's silly. If Putin was "throwing everything he can" into this war, Kiev would have been bombed and Zelenskyy would be dead.

Huh? Russia does not have the ability to bomb Kiev as their jets would be shot down. Instead, Russia has been impotently launching missiles and rockets into Kiev the last 3 years.

UkraineIsTotallyFucked says

Keeps making the 300,000 lie. Then when called out on it, he deflects with "what do you think the figure is"...as if opinions trump facts.

What's the point? As if you or Richwicks will believe anything? Everything is a big fucking psyop to support the "Global Homo Satanists" - right?

FWIW -

https://apnews.com/article/ukraine-troops-killed-zelenskyy-675f53437aaf56a4d990736e85af57c4
https://www.reuters.com/world/us-intelligence-assesses-ukraine-war-has-cost-russia-315000-casualties-source-2023-12-12/
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/02/15/world/europe/russia-invasion-casualties-wounded.html
https://www.voanews.com/a/us-official-russia-suffers-staggering-losses-despite-ukraine-s-supply-shortages/7491475.html
https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2024/02/24/how-many-russian-soldiers-have-died-in-ukraine
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHbsiWyjX20
https://www.cnn.com/2023/12/12/politics/russia-troop-losses-us-intelligence-assessment/index.html
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/7/10/new-data-uncovers-50000-russian-deaths-during-the-ukraine-war
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-68358008

socal2 says

Huh? Russia does not have the ability to bomb Kiev as their jets would be shot down.

They don't need jets. They have ICBMs. They have hyper-sonic missiles.

Also, nobody is going to stop Russian aircraft from flying into Kiev. There is no Ukraine airforce left, and any nation shooting down a Russian plane would be at war with Russia so they aren't going to do that.

This is a purposeful, deliberate, evisceration of Ukraine by Russia. Russia has TRIED TO PLAY NICE with the West for years, for 2 decades, they once asked to be a part of NATO and they just get shit on over and over and over again. Russia called out the US' bullshit in Syria, by bombing ISIS and this time actually hitting them, unlike the US who pretended to fight ISIS and funded them.

This war is purposely being fought slow so that everybody watching it can see what Russia will do, deliberately. This war has hurt Europe, they are run by traitors that are loyal to the United States, and it's hurting the United States. Russia is inviting the US to throw in as much money as they want into this, fund all the mercenaries they want, send in all their equipment they want just to show the world that the US is going to lose.

socal2 says

Instead, Russia has been impotently launching missiles and rockets into Kiev the last 3 years.

Nothing is intercepted. Anti-ballistic missiles are very easy to defeat, you just fire in a bunch of garbage and let the ABM system shoot those down, because they are cheap, and the reason you do this is to cost money, because the ABM missiles AREN'T inexpensive, eventually the ABM system runs out of ammunition and then you can fire in whatever you like. Israel does this to Syria all the time. They are just trying to cost Syria money chiefly.

The West Bank does this to Israel, that's what Qassam Rockets are for. They aren't designed to hit any targets.

Russia dealt with Georgia quickly, remember that - when Georgia attacked S. Ossetia? Mikheil Saakashvili moved to Ukraine after he doomed Georgia by starting that conflict. He was part of the "freedumb movement" of Ukraine of course, being a US intelligence asset. The Ukrainians didn't accept him so he couldn't get elected, but he was appointed governor.

Our State Department is run by retards, and our intelligence agencies by assholes that keep repeating the same mistakes. It's a blatantly obvious pattern. It irritates me to no end there are still people that can't see it.

Remember when Russia started this war with Ukraine in earnest, and top Russian generals kept getting fired one after the other? That was supposed to be a sign of weakness. That was just Russia cleaning house. The US never does that, so only the incompetent and corrupt rise to the top in the United States. No matter how bad a fucking job anybody does in the US federal government, how much they fuck up, how stupid their decisions are, they get a promotion and a bonus, every fucking time. Victoria Nuland FINALLY left, I doubt that bitch got fired and if she was fired, it's more than 15 years too late.

Anyhow, do YOU believe after TWENTY YEARS of this behavior in all our intelligence agencies and our state department, they are going to win a proxy war against Russia? Even recruits sense this, which is why they are recruiting transgender weirdos, obese men, the mentally ill, homosexuals and lesbians, whatever. Nobody wants to go into the military unless they are sheltered and ignorant, or stupid and insane.

Russia isn't making a promise to end this war quickly. I don't think they ever did to their people. If they are promising that or ever did, they were lying. This war has at least 2 more years to go I think.

it’ll only end when US stops running it. we are just using ukrainians as fodder in our war against Russia. Sometimes we can be very fucked up morally as a nation.

FortwayeAsFuckJoeBiden says

Sometimes we can be very fucked up morally as a nation.

I don't how people can think it's "sometimes" at this point. We have a 2 decade solid record of it. Our government doesn't even bother to make up excuses to start a war anymore, they just start one. I would bet less than 1% of Americans even KNOW that the US is bombing Somalia and Yemen and I would bet if you told them, they wouldn't care to even ask why.

We're a morally bankrupt nation and have been for a very long time, so I don't see why people are shocked that drag queen story perverts are showing up in kindergartens. Americans don't have any morality at all.

richwicks says

We have a 2 decade solid record of it

please go back further such to Korean War and then Dominican Republic and Bay of Pigs

I think Nixon and Carter were the least enthusiastic as far as geopolitical skirmished and turf battles

.

richwicks says

FortwayeAsFuckJoeBiden says

Sometimes we can be very fucked up morally as a nation.

I don't how people can think it's "sometimes" at this point. We have a 2 decade solid record of it. Our government doesn't even bother to make up excuses to start a war anymore, they just start one. I would bet less than 1% of Americans even KNOW that the US is bombing Somalia and Yemen and I would bet if you told them, they wouldn't care to even ask why.

We're a morally bankrupt nation and have been for a very long time, so I don't see why people are shocked that drag queen story perverts are showing up in kindergartens. Americans don't have any morality at all.

we really don’t have say in this. democracy is kinda an illusion, eminence front.

AD says

please go back further such to Korean War and then Dominican Republic and Bay of Pigs

We used to have credible propagandists who weren't hired based on whether they were willing to get assfucked or not, or because they happened to be the son of a politician or something and our State Department would at least have to find SOME REASON to attack the country, not just total bullshit reasons which were discovered to be ENTIRELY unfounded once the conflict was over.

We are as low as we can go now. We can't possibly get any lower. Every war is a complete lie, or if it's really an error, nobody gets fired for the error, EVER.

Americans, being fungus instead of people, don't seem to care that either our foreign policy is run by either sociopaths lying retards that kill for pleasure, or just incompetent retards that keep getting it wrong and continue to get promotions anyhow.

This idea that we are a "moral nation" is just fucking ridiculous. We're anything but. Our population has NO principles at all.

richwicks says

to find SOME REASON to attack the country, not just total bullshit reasons

I think they wanted to have US military bases in Iraq because of mostly Iran and what it did in 1979.

.

AD says

richwicks says

to find SOME REASON to attack the country, not just total bullshit reasons

I think they wanted to have US military bases in Iraq because of mostly Iran and what it did in 1979.

.

Iran just took some stupid spies hostage. Big deal.

The bases are for exerting power on regimes. The US intends to make all of the Middle East a vassal state, like Europe is. That's why there are still US bases in Europe.

richwicks says

The bases are for exerting power on regimes. The US intends to make all of the Middle East a vassal state, like Europe is. That's why there are still US bases in Europe.

Nah, the Germans still want them there. You don't see Germans protesting to get the US military bases out of Germany or at least there are not even vocal political parties demanding this enough for the left wing media in Germany to report this.

I've talked with "progressive Germans and also conservative Germans" and they admit its so that Germany does not have to spend as much on defense.

And what's going down in eastern Ukraine has not helped much. Even Finland (was) rushed to get into NATO.

.

richwicks says

The US intends to make all of the Middle East a vassal state, like Europe is.

Bologna, the globalists manipulate every government to consolidate their control. All states are vassal to the satanic globalists New world order. The USA is not the boogie man. The globalists are.

AD says

And what's going down in eastern Ukraine has not helped much. Even Finland (was) rushed to get into NATO.

Regardless of body count, this is exactly the reason Russia has already lost. Next is the Kerch Bridge. If the bridge gets blown to bits more, supplying the southern front quickly and efficiently is toast. Get defensive positions to the west and then make a southern assault to completely cut Crimea off.

As usual I don't have a pony in this race. Just war gaming. This will become a defensive war on both sides at the end of the day. Fighting will dwindle with each side trying to retain territory. It's clear Russia doesn't have the forces to overwhelm Ukraine after 3 years basically. That's why I'm convinced this goes on for another decade and maybe longer.

Russia will collapse though. Putin is not a young man. There will be a power struggle/vacuum when he dies or leaves office. We'll see what other infrastructure Ukraine will hit within Russia. They're literally just an exporter of gas and oil. Cut that off to any significant degree and they're screwed. Europe can get those resources from elsewhere albeit expense AF. Better than having civilians and troops killed as Russia decides to move further and further West.

At no point was NATO going to attack Russia. EVER. That's why this whole conflict is stupid. What would stop Russia after controlling Ukraine from going further west? NATO was never going to be an attacking force. The Soviets tried it with fucking Cuba for Christs sake. USSR and Russia have always been the aggressor. And before you go there Rich, yes, we were the aggressor in Iraq and Afghanistan... don't need to hear it again.

WookieMan says

What would stop Russia after controlling Ukraine from going further west?

Putin's intelligence and common sense. He doesn't even 'want' Ukraine let alone more territory, he just can't tolerate US proxy NATO at that border. Almost exactly analogous to Cuba.

AD says

Nah, the Germans still want them there.

Germany can't even get their gold back from the Fed. They stood still for the devastating attack on their energy infrastructure, the largest industrial terrorism attack in history. Germany is totally subservient to the US/Globalist agenda. They have made any pushback to the 'Camp of the Saints' immigrant invasion illegal. The German people themselves are indoctrinated into happily accepting the required self-immolation.

Robert Sproul says

Putin's intelligence and common sense. He doesn't even 'want' Ukraine let alone more territory, he just can't tolerate US proxy NATO at that border. Almost exactly analogous to Cuba.

So what is Putin going to do about the brand new NATO members Sweden and Finland now at Russia's border?

Cuba was over half a century ago during the height of the Cold War with Marxism sweeping across parts of Europe and the 3rd world (including South/Central America). I think we all can agree that Marxism was an absolute cancer on humanity and worth resisting. But it is a different world today. No one in their right mind thinks Ukraine (or anyone) is going to invade or wants anything in shithole Russia.

Apparently Putin can't "tolerate" having Ukraine living next door with more favorable relations to the EU and the West, but Putin can tolerate getting over 300,000 of his young men killed or grievously wounded, 2 new NATO members on his border, loss of half his Black Sea naval fleet and stuck in an unwinnable war?

So my comment was that Putin has no expansionary ambition, you are saying he does?
Ukraine has long been a red-line. Most NATO expansion took place when Russia could not defend itself and was solely an attempt to control Russian resources, or maybe you think we were spreading !Democracy and Freedom!.

Robert Sproul says

So my comment was that Putin has no expansionary ambition, you are saying he does?

I just can't understand Putin's ROI considering the hundreds of thousands of people he has gotten killed on both sides with no end in site.

Ukraine being more friendly with their EU neighbors is a "red line" for Russia - but having 2 brand new NATO members on Russia's border and the entirety of the EU increasing their military budgets is not? If Russia intended to rape Ukraine for their economic resources or something that could quickly cover the billions Russia has spent of their fuckup of a war - I might be able to understand Putin's motivations.

But right now, I just see Russia banging their heads against a wall with very little to show for it.

socal2 says

I just can't understand Putin's ROI considering the hundreds of thousands of people he has gotten killed on both sides with no end in site.

Because he hasn't gotten 100's of thousands of Russians killed. Those are Ukrainians, and they won't work on the behalf of the Russian Federation anyhow, they work on behalf of the US empire.

socal2 says

but having 2 brand new NATO members on Russia's border and the entirety of the EU increasing their military budgets is not?

NATO is a paper tiger. In a real conflict between the EU and NATO, it's nuclear, and military doesn't matter. The modern military is used to expand business goals and to control foreign nations to varying extents. The military is really obsolete if all you want to do is defend your borders. It's been obsolete since July 16, 1945.

socal2 says

If Russia intended to rape Ukraine for their economic resources or something that could quickly cover the billions Russia has spent of their fuckup of a war - I might be able to understand Putin's motivations.

No, the US intends to (and will!) rape Ukraine of their economic resources but not for the benefit of the United States, but of the banking system that controls the United States. They will benefit.

The incentive of Russia is they want to be left alone, and to do this, they are going to extinguish a country to show others "this is what happens when you suck up to the United States to fuck with us".

socal2 says

But right now, I just see Russia banging their heads against a wall with very little to show for it.

Both sides are going to lose, nobody really walks out of a war ahead - unless they avoid it. That's why the US did so well after WWII, the US hardly went in and was the last industrial economy still standing at the end.

Russia has been placed under sanctions, they've finally been forced to amp up their own manufacturing, they have ways to avoid sanctions now, they have built up relationships with India and China, they don't depend on european goods or services or euroes. They are now entirely independent of the SWIFT banking system and they are showing the world the US is a paper tiger.

What has the US gotten out of it? Well, the US got nothing out of it, but Blackrock has a lot of land they forcibly took over, the energy industries now have a new customer base in Europe, and it only cost the US a few trillion dollars, again.

It's not a question of who gets ahead in war, it's who is pushed further back. The US and Europe were.

richwicks says

Because he hasn't gotten 100's of thousands of Russians killed.

I provided you nearly 20 links reporting Russian casualties yesterday.

You will continue to ignore ANY information that doesn't comport to your fevered imagination of massive conspiracy theories believing there is a "Satanist Pedo Joo" around every corner.