patrick.net

socal2 says

With a Tesla, you use it all the time because you are not making obnoxious noise, you are not spinning your tires out and it is so easy to slow down with regen without even having to tap your friction brakes.

You calling the glorious song of a high-revving engine "obnoxious noise"? =))

I don't do it often, because there is no need for it in daily driving, that's all. And, as noted above, I rented many a Tesla.

Oh, it doesn't shock me in the least:



https://issuesinsights.com/2024/06/26/if-the-nations-power-grid-cant-cope-with-ai-hows-it-supposed-to-handle-millions-of-evs/

socal2 says

With a Tesla, you use it all the time because you are not making obnoxious noise, you are not spinning your tires out and it is so easy to slow down with regen without even having to tap your friction brakes. It is shocking how easy and smooth it is to get to 80 mph. So nice having that torque and power on the freeway when you need to slot into a section. Totally effortless.

With CA traffic??? You crazy talking. Traffic is shit as a visitor/tourist. 80mph? Unless you're going east I don't think I've been close to hitting 80mph and usually it's a 40mph merge best case.

I don't spin my tires or make noise. I don't speed. Or drive recklessly, which 0-60 in 4 seconds is technically illegal in most states. Speeding up and changing lanes is also illegal in most states. Should be slowing down and moving to the right.

Not shitting on you Socal or other patnet users, but speeding and acceleration are kind of small dick syndrome behaviors. Not sure the point. I'll drive the speed limit and keep my licenses and not pay tickets. Worked for 22 years. I know too many dip shits with driving infractions and DUI because they were stupid. Just drive a car safe. It doesn't need to be fast.

WookieMan says

With CA traffic??? You crazy talking. Traffic is shit as a visitor/tourist. 80mph? Unless you're going east I don't think I've been close to hitting 80mph and usually it's a 40mph merge best case.

I'm in north San Diego County and don't hit much traffic on the freeways. And we have a ton of really nice 3 lane arterial roads all over including fun hills and straights. I've said before that I live in a really fun driving area.

WookieMan says

Not shitting on you Socal or other patnet users, but speeding and acceleration are kind of small dick syndrome behaviors. Not sure the point.

I'm addicted to the massive torque and acceleration. I just can't get over it along with the regenerative braking which make for a different way of driving. Like having access to a rollercoaster with a small press of the accelerator.

It would be small dick if I was driving a loud and obnoxious car, belching out exhaust and drawing attention to me. But I can zip around quickly in my Tesla without making a scene or bothering anyone. Especially since there are a bazillion Teslas driving really fast on the road around where I live.

Wow! Who here on PatNet said this was a problem?

And who here on PatNet said that was bullshit or tried to deflect with bullshit of their own?
.

Of the 211 developers surveyed by Xendee, a California-based software company, 75% said that electric grid limitations are among the biggest roadblock to building EV charging infrastructure. The total cost of the infrastructure was a problem for 63% of the respondents, and permitting delays were cited by 53% of those surveyed.

Many of Xendee’s clients, according to Utility Dive, have resorted to installing gas- or diesel- powered generators to run their charging stations.

The Biden administration has gone all in on a future of EV's, but that looks unlikely to happen, given poor planning and market forces.

https://justthenews.com/politics-policy/energy/three-out-four-ev-charging-developers-say-they-cant-get-enough-electricity

Where's all that magically supercheap solar power and windmill shit that was to make sure this would never happen?

Where the flying fuck is all this money for the 'green transition' really going?

C'mon Greentards and Teslatards! WTF happened?

DemocratsAreTotallyFucked says

Wow! Who here on PatNet said this was a problem?

You did. I did. EV's are math and I'm not even good at it. They were never viable if you factor in the cost of similar cars. And you can't do shit with them. The CT is going to be an absolute flop for Tesla.

Millennials are having kids. I don't want a truck to fit 3 kids on a bench seat. They build sedans. NO one is building a large SUV because it would be $150k for a fucking car I can get for $60k. The fact they haven't even done a minivan is hysterical. You'd get the MILF buying them and the cucked men. I don't mind Elon, but he's failed in this regard with tiny cars for baby men. Get a real fucking SUV and I'd maybe be a customer.

DemocratsAreTotallyFucked says

It's Solyndra 2.0:

I don't like EV's as you know. But how hard is it to put in a charging spot? Pull a permit, talk to the electric utility for trenching and meter, do a locate and put in the charger. There's no EPA testing that needs to be done as most chargers, at least in IL, are at gas stations anyway. All the heavy lifting has been done.

$5B should have gotten 1,000 chargers easy. The problem is shit like prevailing wage and unions. Maybe just hire a small company to install said chargers and they pay their employees what they want. Federal money is a flying bitch with diarrhea to deal with. Doing it now with my board. No one has inside connections but we're basically limited on what and who we can use for a construction project. Can't use local companies for things like plumbing or electric that could be on site in minutes. Nope, has to be some union company from Chicago 60 miles away.

I legit shut down at my last board meeting. Told them I was pissed off and didn't say another word the whole meeting. We are basically forced to hire certain companies by the Federal government, as a government body because we got money from them. I've know it, but the whole fucking thing is a racket.

socal2 says

Russia loses more troops in a single week in Ukraine than America lost in Iraq in 12 years.

Source?

What are the actual casualties in the Ukrainian war?

WookieMan says

But how hard is it to put in a charging spot? Pull a permit, talk to the electric utility for trenching and meter, do a locate and put in the charger. There's no EPA testing that needs to be done as most chargers, at least in IL, are at gas stations anyway. All the heavy lifting has been done.

In case this isn't rhetorical, I answered this very issue here:

https://patrick.net/post/1381647/2024-07-13-assassination-attempt-trump-butler-pa?start=400#comment-2081538

Onvacation says

socal2 says

Russia loses more troops in a single week in Ukraine than America lost in Iraq in 12 years.

Source?

What are the actual casualties in the Ukrainian war?

What source would meet your standards? Obviously US and UK intelligence estimates is no good. Ukrainian? Even worse. How about Pukin
himself? Good enough?

Russian President Vladimir Putin has stated that the Russian army loses 20,000 combat troops in Ukraine every month.
...

According to analysts, Putin has suggested that 5,000 Russian soldiers die in combat in Ukraine every month. Considering the standard ratio of wounded to killed as three to one, approximately 15,000 Russian servicemen are wounded every month.

Wikipedia puts US KIA at 4,507 for the whole Iraq war.

@RWSGFY what the hell is this Ukraine stuff doing in this thread?

DemocratsAreTotallyFucked says

RWSGFY what the hell is this Ukraine stuff doing in this thread?

Ask @Onvacation.

RWSGFY says

DemocratsAreTotallyFucked says

RWSGFY what the hell is this Ukraine stuff doing in this thread?

Ask Onvacation.

ask @socal2

Onvacation says

ask socal2

Of course.

Rumor has it that Ford is dropping electric F-150.

RWSGFY says

Rumor has it that Ford is dropping electric F-150.

Nooooo shit.

RWSGFY says

Rumor has it that Ford is dropping electric F-150.

I actually wanted one of those. Maybe now the price will come down to reasonable.

HeadSet says

RWSGFY says

Rumor has it that Ford is dropping electric F-150.

I actually wanted one of those. Maybe now the price will come down to reasonable.

Fiskers got reasonable, lol.

socal2 says

That is over 60% of the available US car market!

Tesla can't be everything for everyone, but the available US market is plenty big.

You live in CA. Where I live in IL I'd be constantly worried about running out of juice. I'm going to Wisconsin tomorrow and would need to charge on the way up making the trip 30 minutes longer and then having to use a friends electric to charge.

Go to Bozeman, MT and go for a hike in an EV. Enjoy being stranded. It's an hour in mountains one way and there's nothing in range to charge. You're climbing from 4k to 9k feet to get to a good hike or activity. Fishing. Throw in rugged roads.

CA is a big state. Mostly urban. EV's don't work in most of the country once you factor in cold weather. EV lovers need to get out of their bubble.

WookieMan says

You live in CA. Where I live in IL I'd be constantly worried about running out of juice. I'm going to Wisconsin tomorrow and would need to charge on the way up making the trip 30 minutes longer and then having to use a friends electric to charge.

I just got back from a week vacation visiting relatives in Michigan, Ohio and Indiana. I rented a GMC (Arcadia?) and we drove over 800 miles. Alot of it was on back country roads and away from the freeways. But I ran my route through Tesla's navigation and there were still plenty of Tesla Superchargers that would make the drive totally easy.

The GMC didn't even have adaptive cruise control......let alone lane assist. It was tiring and less enjoyable to have to manually drive all 800 miles. But it did have a big gas tank and we only had to fill up a few times.

You mean you didn’t take your cyber truck?

GNL says

You mean you didn’t take your cyber truck?

Can't afford one yet.

Fun fact: Hertz didn't offer a single EV at their Indianspolis airport location when I visited last spring.

socal2 says

GNL says

You mean you didn’t take your cyber truck?

Can't afford one yet.

Hmm, my bad. I was sure you were the one telling us that you bought one.

MORE RIDICULOUSNESS VIA TESLA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-AiuQy4ALc

WookieMan says

The fact they haven't even done a minivan is hysterical.

ModelX IS a minivan. Down to middle doors designed in a way to prevent kids from hitting cars parked next to it.

Eric Holder says

ModelX IS a minivan. Down to middle doors designed in a way to prevent kids from hitting cars parked next to it.

Haven't looked at it. What's the towing capacity? Likely nothing. Not looking it up. Full sized SUV's are missing from the EV market.

Also if your kid is that stupid to hit another car you should probably parent better (not you specifically). Most full sized SUV's are already built on truck a chassis. Make the CT a full sized SUV body and add a third row. You can still put stuff in the back. Still tow. You either have a truck or full sized SUV where I live. I've yet to see a CT on the road where I live as well.

Problem as I've said is it's going to cost $120k plus with no range. A 10 hour road trip turns into 13-14 hours easy, especially towing a camper which you'll likely have to unhitch to get into a charging station. I've yet to see a pull though in my region. The charging might be there in CA, but I've yet to see it around me. It's all 20 miles in the opposite direction I'm going.

WookieMan says

What's the towing capacity?

Who cares? It's a minivan. Nobody buys these for towing.

Just got one of my sales engineers in Idaho to buy a Tesla Model Y. He turned in his tricked out Ford Maverick (poor man's Raptor) and he is absolutely loving it so far. He told this morning he is shocked at how awesome it is for road trips from Boise to Idaho Falls.

That said - he does have a free month trial of the latest Full Self Driving, so he has the latest and greatest version.

In addition to driving a couple thousand miles a month for work, the dude is in the army reserves, hunts, skiis and travels all over the mountain west. He is 6'7" tall too and said he has plenty of room.

WookieMan says

Also if your kid is that stupid to hit another car you should probably parent better (not you specifically).

Maybe. But there is no denying that minivans are popular because of their sliding doors, not despite of them. Peace of mind is peace of mind.

socal2 says

Just got one of my sales engineers in Idaho to buy a Tesla Model Y. He turned in his tricked out Ford Maverick (poor man's Raptor) and he is absolutely loving it so far. He told this morning he is shocked at how awesome it is for road trips from Boise to Idaho Falls.

That said - he does have a free month trial of the latest Full Self Driving, so he has the latest and greatest version.

In addition to driving a couple thousand miles a month for work, the dude is in the army reserves, hunts, skiis and travels all over the mountain west. He is 6'7" tall too and said he has plenty of room.

Wait until he needs to charge it somewhere out of the way...which is most of Idaho.

Wait until winter comes and the battery can barely charge enough like before.

socal2 says

Just got one of my sales engineers in Idaho to buy a Tesla Model Y. He turned in his tricked out Ford Maverick (poor man's Raptor) and he is absolutely loving it so far. He told this morning he is shocked at how awesome it is for road trips from Boise to Idaho Falls.

That said - he does have a free month trial of the latest Full Self Driving, so he has the latest and greatest version.

In addition to driving a couple thousand miles a month for work, the dude is in the army reserves, hunts, skiis and travels all over the mountain west. He is 6'7" tall too and said he has plenty of room.

One of my relatives who's very ga-ga on everything Tesla (and has been uninvited from pretty much everywhere because all he does at parties is talking about FSD this and FSD that until everybody's eyes roll into their skulls) never takes his AWD Model Y on skiing trips. This is when trusty 4Runner comes out of the garage. I think he did once take his MY to Utah. Don't know what happened there, but it's been 4Runner from then on.

DemocratsAreTotallyFucked says

Wait until he needs to charge it somewhere out of the way...which is most of Idaho.

The country.

Haha, you’re bragging that you hooked another sucker?

DemocratsAreTotallyFucked says

Wait until he needs to charge it somewhere out of the way...which is most of Idaho.

Wait until winter comes and the battery can barely charge enough like before.

Dude is an engineer and has done his research.

This is a great site where you can map your drives to figure out what charging you need. You can adjust for temperature, weather, weight in car, model and battery charge level.
https://abetterrouteplanner.com/

My other Sales Engineer in remote Oregon has had his Tesla for almost 2 years now (40,000 miles driven so far) and has had no problems driving all over the Mountain and Northwest in all weather conditions.

GNL says

Haha, you’re bragging that you hooked another sucker?

He's been thanking me all week saying "I should have done this sooner".

It was after his family vacation last month to the Olympic National Park (8+ hour drive from Boise) followed by an unexpected business trip to Eastern Idaho the Monday he returned from his vacation that finally got him to pull the trigger.

Difficult to express how nice autopilot is for long trips. You arrive at your destination so much more refreshed and comfortable.

Dude is also going to save a ton of money on gas since he can expense his business miles and his electricity at home is dirt cheap.

Hydrogen powered vehicles will put the faux green electrics in the junkyard. Plus, they are the truly environmentally friendly ones (exhaust is water). They have been suppressed by the usual suspects for the usual reasons, but are now starting production through Asia and Toyota.

Ceffer says

Plus, they are the truly environmentally friendly ones

Do you realize you just quoted some level one dumbassery from Shrub?

Cars that will run on hydrogen fuel produce only water, not exhaust fumes….

How is hydrogen made? Don't say 'electrolysis' because commercially produced hydrogen mostly is not, but through processes like pyrolysis of natural gas or steam reforming of coal.

But either way, it costs too much. It is not a source of energy but merely a carrier.

From an extensive article on this topic by Robert Zubrin:

The trouble is that making hydrogen requires more energy than the hydrogen so produced can provide. Hydrogen, therefore, is not a source of energy. It simply is a carrier of energy.

And it is, as we shall see, an extremely poor one.

The wholesale cost of commercial grade liquid hydrogen (made the cheap way, from hydrocarbons) shipped to large customers in the United States is about $6 per kilogram. High purity hydrogen made from electrolysis for scientific applications costs considerably more. Dispensed in compressed gas cylinders to retail customers, the current price of commercial grade hydrogen is about $100 per kilogram. For comparison, a kilogram of hydrogen contains about the same amount of energy as a gallon of gasoline. This means that even if hydrogen cars were available and hydrogen stations existed to fuel them, no one with the power to choose otherwise would ever buy such vehicles. This fact alone makes the hydrogen economy a non-starter in a free society.

2007 prices in those cost figures ^^

The hydrogen refueling stations for the Toyota Murai currently charge $36/kg. A drastic increase from $17/kg from the year before.

So either significant improvement has been achieved since Zubrin wrote his article in hydrogen production, distribution & storage, or it is being subsidized.

It costs $200 to fill up a Murai. And it only gets at most 400 miles out of all that. Usually it avgs at 300 miles. So it is STILL uneconomical as hell.

Murai 2024 fueling costs source: https://www.topspeed.com/how-much-costs-to-refill-hydrogen-powered-toyota-mirai/

Zubrin then goes on to thoroughly detail other costs, like metal embrittlement of storage and distribution equipment, costs from pressurization or cryogenic storage, etc.

Oh, and like EVs, it can be quite polluting. Just front loaded before it gets put into your car, is all.

https://www.thenewatlantis.com/publications/the-hydrogen-hoax