patrick.net

There are only three major reasons NOT to live in many parts of California -cost of living, taxes and earthquakes.

Of course there are bad parts/cities with more reasons

On most other counts California is a great place and you can understand why from 1945-1990 people moved there in droves

you forgot it is a crime ridden cesspool.

I'm here for the weather, the jobs, and because my wife and kids and I have all friends here now.

But even more than that, I just love the Bay Area. I was stunned when I first saw San Francisco and still haven't gotten over it.

SF is easy on the eyes but can be hard on the nose. Or have you grown accustomed to the stench of rancid free-range urine?

lakermania says

If the stars ever lined up and gave me an opportunity to move [to Texas or Colorado], I'd take it. California still has a lot to offer but in 20-30 years, I don't see how we can keep up our higher quality of lifestyle compared to other more responsible states.

I would not call Texas responsible at all. They mismanage water and pollution, some areas are literally drying up and won't have tap water anymore. Their current finances result from high oil prices and a race to the bottom in working conditions, but you can see the potentially explosive consequences in one example after another: refinery explosions, the Deepwater Horizon disaster, etc. The world might be going to hell in a bucket, but Texas is speeding to Mad Max in an SUV limo with cattle horns on the hood.

California is actually more responsible in many ways, though I do worry about a culture of reckless spending - both public and private.

I love the climate here and most of the people. Every day in SF, I see something that makes me smile. I can walk to great cuisines from around the world. Almost everything other than housing and the insurance-driven side of the medical sector is reasonably priced. (As covered in another thread, Americans have the lowest prices for OTC drugs, but the highest in the world for Rx, where insurance and government programs "help" by shifting costs around and making them larger at every stage.) There are many good people in Texas, for example Austin and Houston and San Antonio, but the majority in Texas are horribly bigoted irresponsible nuts and I wouldn't want to be stuck with them. California has a better balance.

smaulgld says

earthquakes

smaulgld-imo, the small ones are actually cute, the lights way, it's a gentle rocking motion. Near the epicenter, it's only terrifying for less than a minute. With the California building codes, chances are your body will survive. Depending on your circumstances of course, some financial hit will occur, again, near the epicenter.

David9 says

smaulgld says

earthquakes

smaulgld-imo, the small ones are actually cute, the lights way, it's a gentle rocking motion. Near the epicenter, it's only terrifying for less than a minute. With the California building codes, chances are your body will survive. Depending on your circumstances of course, some financial hit will occur, again, near the epicenter.

Never heard of anybody being killed by a falling popcorn ceiling.

Why? Job. Weather. Been here a long time.

Curious2 says

There are many good people in Texas, for example Austin and Houston and San Antonio, but the majority in Texas are horribly bigoted irresponsible nuts and I wouldn't want to be stuck with them. California has a better balance.

Have you been to Texas? You do know that California has over 4 1/2 times the hate crimes per 100k ppl versus Texas right, despite TX having over 50% more agencies reporting to the FBI a hate crime occurred .

http://www.businessinsider.com/fbi-2011-hate-crime-statistics-2012-12

curious2 says

but the majority in Texas are horribly bigoted irresponsible nuts and I wouldn't want to be stuck with them. California has a better balance.

Rush Limbaugh got his start in Sacramento. There's a reason for that.

New Renter says

SF is easy on the eyes but can be hard on the nose. Or have you grown accustomed to the stench of rancid free-range urine?

Every morning on my bike ride from the SF Caltrain station to work I smell piss and pot at least once each. Can't say I enjoy the piss smell, but the pot is nice. The total volume of pot smoke in SF at any one time must be really huge.

lakermania says

Have you been to Texas? You do know that California has over 4 1/2 times the hate crimes per 100k ppl versus Texas right, despite TX having over 50% more agencies reporting to the FBI a hate crime occurred .

http://www.businessinsider.com/fbi-2011-hate-crime-statistics-2012-12

Yes, and thanks for the statistics, but 1 or 2 crimes per 100,000 population doesn't provide a representative picture of life in either state. I've met fine people in Texas, and they have only good things to say in terms of their experience living there, but they aren't a representative sample either. I wish Governor Ann Richards had been re-elected. While I don't share Jerry Brown's enthusiasm for bond-driven HSR, I much prefer him to Rick Perry.

New Renter says

curious2 says

but the majority in Texas are horribly bigoted irresponsible nuts and I wouldn't want to be stuck with them. California has a better balance.

Rush Limbaugh got his start in Sacramento. There's a reason for that.

Thanks, you're right about that, a lot of inland California is that way. They have Texas house prices and California property taxes, yet I stay in SFBA rather than move in with Bop69 and postbubblesuccess.

Patrick, if you like bluegrass music, you might love bicycling to Golden Gate Park for the annual "Hardly Strictly Bluegrass" festival founded by the late great Warren Hellman. It's often called "the golden child" of SF festivals, very mellow and well behaved.

lakermania says

California has over 4 1/2 times the hate crimes per 100k ppl versus Texas right, despite TX having over 50% more agencies reporting to the FBI a hate crime occurred .

Yeah, if I lived there I might be 4.5x more afraid to report a hate crime, too.

The comments about TX are way off. I say this because I've been there a number of times and to me, the people were a hell of a lot nicer than they were in Cali. ALso- its easy for some of you who live crammed on the Cali coast to think that the whole state of CA is one big SF. Guess what? 80% of the state is totally rural and in many cases extremely conservative. I have many a friend who lives way out there and once you leave the genera; cocoon of the Bay Area and probably San Diego and LA, well it turns into rural anywhere real quick. As in you could be in rural AL, TN, NC, FL, TX, or whatever.

I like to think that most people are generally reasonable when it comes to their political views. It is ok to disagree.

edvard2 says

The comments about TX are way off.

I have to agree.

Is a place like Austin, Texas going to be full of more bigots than a place like San Bernadino County, Imperial County, or Palmdale? I don't know.

lakermania says

Have you been to Texas? You do know that California has over 4 1/2 times the hate crimes per 100k ppl versus Texas right, despite TX having over 50% more agencies reporting to the FBI a hate crime occurred .

http://www.businessinsider.com/fbi-2011-hate-crime-statistics-2012-12

I can't believe you're using that study to prove that TX is more tolerant than CA. According to your data, among the 10 states with the LEAST amount of hate crimes reported, 7 are in the Bible Belt: OK, FL, TX, AR, LA, GA, MS

And how about that, in 2011, the entire state of Mississippi had 1 hate crime reported.

I'd say it says more about the tolerance of hate than the tolerance of people.

Maybe because in CA everybody is trundling down to their local friendly litigation tick and suing their next door neighbors for hate crimes, under the "all liberal accusations are true and actionable" clause of the CA constitution. Everybody is guilty until proven innocent, and even then they are guilty.

Goran_K says

edvard2 says

The comments about TX are way off.

I have to agree.

Is a place like Austin, Texas going to be full of more bigots than a place like San Bernadino County, Imperial County, or Palmdale? I don't know.

Wow did either of you even read those comments? You start by calling them "way off," then basically repeat some of the same points from them. For example, my two mentioned both Austin TX and inland CA. The only comment about TX that was "way off" was the one that implied TX is "more responsible."

edvard2 says

I've been there a number of times and to me, the people were a hell of a lot nicer

Lemme guess, you're white, and if you're gay, you keep it to yourself.

That said though, just because Bay Area Hipsters aren't bigots does not mean they're not obnoxious. The Bay Area is one of the most obnoxious places in the world. And nearly all of the obnoxious ones came here from somewhere else.

curious2 says

Wow did either of you even read those comments? You start by calling them "way off," then basically repeat some of the same points from them. For example, my two mentioned both Austin TX and inland CA. The only comment about TX that was "way off" was the one that implied TX is "more responsible."

I wasn't specifically referencing your post.

Someone else mentioned earlier in a blanket statement that Texas was full of bigots and the South can't help but be bigoted against somebody, which I think is a horrible blanket statement to just throw out.

41% of 2011 American venture capital spending was in Silicon Valley.

That makes it _much_ easier to find jobs which are interesting technically, with business plans lacking truck sized holes, where the companies are early in their life with their biggest problems lacking solutions and decent equity shares available.

I spend more waking hours working each week than I spend in my house, and am a lot more concerned about how good that situation is than how big and nice my home is.

Good weather is also a nice fringe benefit, although with enough money (about $5M) in the bank that I could be comfortable without working I'd be open to moving back to Boulder, Colorado.

Ceffer says

Another lady down the street, who was a professional litigant slip and fall artist, had one of her fleabag lawyers declare her back yard a "bird sanctuary" so that she could get away with capturing and poisoning her neighbors' cats.

Sounds like a good way to piss of the cat people.

You NEVER want to piss of the cat people!

New Renter says

Ceffer says

Another lady down the street, who was a professional litigant slip and fall artist, had one of her fleabag lawyers declare her back yard a "bird sanctuary" so that she could get away with capturing and poisoning her neighbors' cats.

Sounds like a good way to piss of the cat people.

You NEVER want to piss of the cat people!

B.A.C.A.H. says

edvard2 says

I've been there a number of times and to me, the people were a hell of a lot nicer

Lemme guess, you're white, and if you're gay, you keep it to yourself.

That said though, just because Bay Area Hipsters aren't bigots does not mean they're not obnoxious.

Superficial "niceness" doesn't mean people are actually nicer. In gun cultures, people learn to appear "nicer" in person, in order to avoid getting shot, then they express their concealed obnoxiousness at the polls. The obnoxious behavior in SFBA is merely uninhibited, the people aren't necessarily more obnoxious inside.

Sometimes, you need to peel back the layers of superficial obnoxiousness to get the to true, deep obnoxiousness inside.

Who said they were nice?

Not me. I wouldn't know as the only Texans I know are cousins. They're almost always nice. To me and my family.

But I hafta disagree with you about the obnoxious Hipsters, and obnoxious elites who came here from afar. At least they are consistent: obnoxious inside and out.

Born and raised in Los Angeles suburbs.

My job is here, girlfriend is here, lifetime family and friends are here. In short, I'm bound to LA as my entire life is here.

If I didn't live here, sans winning the lottery, I'd choose San Diego second, Las Vegas third, Texas a distant fourth, and southern Atlantic states a very distant fifth(can you tell I don't like the cold?)

I've been to Texas before and it doesn't bother me except for the humidity...but that often come with warmer weather. I like San Antonio and Austin quite a bit and presume I'd like Dallas too.

But California is where I'm from and who I am. I suppose if the politics became as hateful as some of the posters on Pat.net are, maybe I'd change my mind. But with a Latino dominant population, you don't really have to worry about that. Most are pretty moderate, even if they always vote for democrats. Just have to avoid places like Santa Monica which is really no issue as Santa Monica is easily the worst beach in LA or OC(other than Cabrillo which doesn't really count).

curious2 says

Superficial "niceness" doesn't mean people are actually nicer.

Sorry, I can't bite my tongue any longer.

This is not 'In my opinion', this is 'In my experience'.

It is what it is and may differ from your experiences there.

First, of course there are nice people in Texas. In fact, I met more 'extreme' leaning people than in California, such as athiests, gun enthusiasts, and anti government views.
Also, I found them more sexually active.

Oh yes, I got lots of toothy smiles. And called a California bimbo behind my back. They don't seem to like Californians.

No matter how much contract experience I got in other states in my time there, it was never good enough for Dallas. In fact, the agencies would have their 'trainee recruiter' call me.

Negative? Yes, it was.

dodgerfanjohn says

Santa Monica is easily the worst beach in LA or OC(other than Cabrillo which doesn't really count).

Yeah, Santa Monica, and Huntington Beach are just so dirty now. Laguna Beach is getting like this too, but at least the community manages to clean it up nicely.

zesta says

lakermania says

Have you been to Texas? You do know that California has over 4 1/2 times the hate crimes per 100k ppl versus Texas right, despite TX having over 50% more agencies reporting to the FBI a hate crime occurred .

http://www.businessinsider.com/fbi-2011-hate-crime-statistics-2012-12

I can't believe you're using that study to prove that TX is more tolerant than CA. According to your data, among the 10 states with the LEAST amount of hate crimes reported, 7 are in the Bible Belt: OK, FL, TX, AR, LA, GA, MS

And how about that, in 2011, the entire state of Mississippi had 1 hate crime reported.

I'd say it says more about the tolerance of hate than the tolerance of people.

Look at how many reporting agencies they got
info from MS on...50 compared to 700 in Cali and over a 1000 in TX

lakermania says

Look at how many reporting agencies they got

info from MS on...50 compared to 700 in Cali and over a 1000 in TX

The number of reporting agencies is irrelevant IF the agencies themselves discourage reporting or choose not to classify crimes as hate crimes.

You can look at the numbers and believe that out of 1000 TX agencies, only 5% of them had a hate crimes in that year and that's a sign that the people commit fewer hate crimes. My common sense and experience tells me that while Austin, San Antonio, Dallas, and perhaps Houston may be tolerant, that's only 20% of Texas.

The state of Texas has no law preventing workers from being fired due to sexual orientation.

It's not just sexual orientation, it's religious intolerance. How about this gem from the Texas Constitution:

Sec. 4. RELIGIOUS TESTS. No religious test shall ever be required as a qualification to any office, or public trust, in this State; nor shall any one be excluded from holding office on account of his religious sentiments, provided he acknowledge the existence of a Supreme Being.

As a foreigner who doesn't live in the US but has a home in Monterey, who has worked in a number of different countries, and who has travelled extensively, I can safely say much of CA is very nice indeed.

Weather. Redwood trees. Ocean. Mountains. Mexicans (hard working, super nice - someone's gotta get shit done around here).

The San Francisco Smug Alert! http://www.southparkstudios.com/full-episodes/s10e02-smug-alert

Caution:Some intolerant language.

I stay because it's relatively easy to find work here. The weather is not extremely hot or cold. You have everything nearby like great restaurants, public transportation, hiking, biking, beaches, basically lots of outdoor activities. Lake Tahoe is near if you want to go skiing during winter. Lots of beautiful women everywhere. Vegas, Hawaii, Disney Land....all within a few hours from SF by plane. To me, it is centrally located and easy to get to places. Housing prices are ridiculous but then again, you don't have to drive far to get anything. Did I mention, you can get just about anything here.....

smaulgld says

There are only three major reasons NOT to live in many parts of California -cost of living, taxes and earthquakes.

You forget yearly wildfires and annual rains that make homes slide down the hillsides.

mmmarvel:"You forget yearly wildfires and annual rains that make homes slide down the hillsides."
Oh yeah, that too!

RichieRich says

I stay because it's relatively easy to find work here

California's reputation for high unemployment suggests otherwise.

B.A.C.A.H. says

Lemme guess, you're white, and if you're gay, you keep it to yourself.

That said though, just because Bay Area Hipsters aren't bigots does not mean they're not obnoxious. The Bay Area is one of the most obnoxious places in the world. And nearly all of the obnoxious ones came here from somewhere else.

Not sure what any of that has to do with anything. My comments weren't meant to be some sort of trick. I've been to Dallas, Houston, Austin, and San Antonio. Repeatedly I would go to bars, eating joints, or even to the store and met people at sheer random who were super outgoing and friendly to me. A far cry from the two other places I've lived in: The East Coast, where people were seemingly simply cold and sometimes rude to California where the coastal areas are a bit more laud back but still somewhat obnoxious.

Let me put it this way: I was born and raised in the Rural South. I have then as mentioned lived on both coasts. I have seen the full gamut of what these two distinct regions are like. Most people have never lived in both places and thus why so many like that make really generalized statements about either place: aka- "California is full of liberal!" or- "The South is nothing but slack-jawed rednecks!"

Neither comment is true. The reality is you'll find most people are similar in their treatment of others.