patrick.net

Eliminate Obamacare.
I want Free Enterprise health insurance where I don't have any control over premiums or any medical service prices & a 100% guarantee that no one will bankrupt over medical bills.

According to NAR and this guy..

http://loganmohtashami.com/2013/10/24/mortgage-purchase-applications-falling-slope/

33% of RE market is cash buyers.

edvard2 says

I seriously doubt your claims above

Who do you think authored this cumbersome compromise?
Congressmen? Staffers? Consumer advocacy groups?
Shit, they didn't even read it. It was crafted by the existing cartels and their lobby groups.
Do right wing kamikaze demagogues want more?
They want it all.

Everyone has enough money to pay cash for a house (except me), so mortgages are last century.

Mortgages should be eliminated.

bgamall4 says

Bigsby says

The truth about 9/11 does not stand or fall with explosives in the vans of the Dancing Israelis. You are nuts.

Eh? Who said it did?

Then why make such a big deal about it Bigsby? Having trouble seeing the forest because the trees are getting in the way? Don't post about this again or I will delete you.

Er, I wasn't. You were the one who brought up the 'dancing Israelis' in the first place. Why were YOU making such a big deal out of it? And don't threaten me. You delete because you want to mislead others, so do as you like. I will simply point out what you are doing, the incoherent arguments you are making, and the blatant falsehoods you are attempting to pass off as facts.

The government won't care if rents aren't being paid because the property taxes are being paid by the owners, which are, wait, who really owns the house if it's carved into a bunch of securities?

finehoe says

He was referring to employer-provided plans, not individual plans.

Possibly so, but that is not how it was interpreted.

bgamall4 says

Bigsby says

You were the one who brought up the 'dancing Israelis' in the first place. Why were YOU making such a big deal out of it? And don't threaten me.

It is the dancing that was the problem Einstein.

Rather than the non-existent explosives?

The 'dancing' is what you claim and what the actual people involved deny. You of course believe the report they were 'dancing'. What about the one that claimed they were dressed as 'sheiks?' Or the one that they had explosives in their van that the police reported was not the case? Hey, just pick and choose whatever takes your fancy. Don't pay any mind to the more obvious conclusion to draw. No, instead do what you always do and find the most outlandish conspiracy theory that is being peddled on the internet and run with that. Rather like your claim of remote controlled planes being used. You really are so far out there I wonder if even 'The Professor' is beginning to question what you are saying.

Since almost 70% of the population receives their insurance through their employer, and thus are unaffected by this, what is this obession by opponents of the ACA on individual policies? The actual number of people affected is really quite small.

finehoe says

The actual number of people affected is really quite small.

On one side are the low paid, uninsured and able bodied people who only use hospitals if they break a leg, etc.

They will be paying more money into the pool which would seem to have the effect of lowering premiums for all.

On the other are the pre-existing conditions types. They will drain money from the insurance, but they also have raised prices in the past when hospitals serviced them at their cost.

Does it balance out? I am not one to see people suffer.

John Bailo says

Does it balance out? I am not one to see people suffer.

I think the proper question is, "are more people better off than they were pre-ACA?"

Say hey! This was in the Wall Street Journal on March 30, 1999. Note "... how much it will buy."

Holy cow/interesting/compelling ...!

And where is it up to date??? Right here ... see the first chart shown in this thread.
Recent Dow day is Friday, October 25, 2013 __ Level is 99.3

WOW! It is hideous that this is hidden! Is there any such "Homes, Inflation Adjusted"? Yes indeed, go here:
http://patrick.net/?p=1219038&c=999083#comment-999083

finehoe says

Since almost 70% of the population receives their insurance through their employer, and thus are unaffected by this, what is this obession by opponents of the ACA on individual policies? The actual number of people affected is really quite small.

How do you know the number is quite small? What percentage of employer health plans don't come up to ACA standards and will have to be replaced with a more expensive plan? Many of those increases in rates will be passed on to employees.

finehoe says

John Bailo says

Does it balance out? I am not one to see people suffer.

I think the proper question is, "are more people better off than they were pre-ACA?"

I think the proper question is does aca lower the overall spending on health care. The answer is NO according to medicare and the CBO.

From a financial perspective, if you add previously uninsurable people to the insurance pool, premiums must go up. I think the counter argument is valid if we can get people to go see their doc regularly instead of showing up in the emergency rooms for primary care, then premiums can go down.

I really hope this thing works. And if this means everyone gets healthcare that needs it, I'm ok spending more if higher premiums work in tandem with cost controls. We just don't seem to have addressed costs effectively (yet).

For the skeptic of my earlier post about premiums doubling:
My insurance before ACA is probably particularly low because we received the lowest prices available due to our excellent health when we applied. I think the healthiest people in the individual markets will see the largest increases.

d503 says

For the skeptic of my earlier post about premiums doubling:
My insurance
before ACA is probably particularly low because we received the lowest prices
available due to our excellent health when we applied. I think the healthiest
people in the individual markets will see the largest increases.

Fair enough--I think that's true as well.

finehoe says

I think the proper question is, "are more people better off than they were pre-ACA?"

Nah, I think the proper question is does this do anything to address our real issue, and that is the fact that our corrupted sick care system bleeds off 5-7% more of our GDP than most other industrialized nations.
Much of that is, and will continue to be, sucked up by the insurance industry, to no ones benefit but their own fat asses
It is a broken system, top to bottom, at least according to everyone I have ever talked to who is employed by it. This just modestly readjusts who gets squeezed to feed it.

I feel fortunate in a sense that I am very happy with my employer provided healthcare in terms of coverage for cost. My option is far far superior to even the platinum plan not to mention the so called bronze "coverage." Now to be fair I acknowledge fully that peeps with pre-existing condition issue will benefit, medical will be expanded to singles, one will be able to get coverage on the "exchange" without having a job althought it's not gonna be fun paying for "coverage" without having a job even with a "subsidy." However, it appears to me that compared to decent plans at reputable fortune 500 companies ACA still falls far short on the barometer.

my 29yo healthy buddy works as a busser/food runner making 8.00/hr plus tips with no bennies, which means he'll qualify for subsidies or possibly get obamacare for free.

if he has to pay even the meager amount of $81 USD a month, he might just forego it since $972/year is a fair bit steep for him.

he is exactly the type of person obamacare needs to have pay into the system to make it all work. without healthy people like him paying into the system, it fit will hit the shan in the not-too-distant-future.

I found another, better Hitler video on this subject:

http://www.youtube.com/embed/e3-RKS0_NKk

zzyzzx says

I found another, better Hitler video on this subject:

The one guy from Delaware who subscribed must be Joe "Shotgun" Biden. =))

You people do realize the great thing "ObamaCare" does.. It's CAPS health insurance company profits! AND if the health insurance company makes more profit than they are allowed.. They have to return the money back to the insured member. I received a notice this year that I would be getting a refund of part of my premium... Of course since my work pays my insurance premium... They get the refund. But it was about $250 refund... not too bad.

The Obamacare rebate checks are part of a provision in the health care law that requires insurance companies to use 80 percent of collected premiums on medical services. If they don’t, they have to send rebates to policyholders for the difference.

Obamacare support may rise when health insurance rebate checks arrive.
****

Personally I think 90% of collected premiums should go to medical services. Car Insurance companies for instance consider 4% profit after premiums EXCELLENT.

Quigley says

It certainly goes far enough to give the insurance companies extra money! The medical industrial complex can now become twice as bloated and provide half the service! Isn't socialism great?

Well, social medicine would get rid of the need for insurance companies for a start. Apparently that would make you happy, so presumably you are a fan of some aspects of what socialism might entail.

I'm still waiting on my wife and child's paperwork though.. I'll reserved judgement on ACA until I actually have the paperwork signed in front of me. Right now it looks like decent deal compared to my work's plan. My work only covers me and has horrifically high monthly payments for dependents. I'm talking $1000 a month for a perfectly healthy newborn and my perfectly healthy, albeit child-bearing years, wife.

bgamall4 says

Bigsby says

The 'dancing' is what you claim and what the actual people involved deny. You of course believe the report they were 'dancing'

Witnesses saw them dancing and celebrating. So yes, I believe the witnesses. Why wouldn't I? You seem to have a problem with eyewitnesses. You can't even see with your own damn eyes that WTC7 fell from the bottom and the top and in the middle at the same damn rate, making pancaking impossible. You are the dumbest cretin the world has ever known, Bigsby.

Witnesses? Which witnesses were those? The person who phoned in the report was called Maria, was she not? Care to share what she said about what she saw. I'll help. She doesn't mention dancing. She doesn't say that they arrived and set up cameras BEFORE the attack. She specifically states in an ABC interview that the van parked up AFTER she'd already started looking at the WTC towers. She says that she saw them sitting on top of a van watching the events unfold snapping pics. She didn't like their reaction, but people posing for photos in front of what was happening is hardly that unusual and the reactions of groups of men watching such an event (without really knowing what was going on at that point) could obviously be extremely diverse. That women was also at a distance, so it's not as if she was standing right next to them and could clearly see everything let alone hear them.

This is my problem with what you do. You get your info direct from the conspiracy websites that have already created a story distinct from the actual facts. You and other 'truthers' then create a hugely expanded conspiracy based on the thinnest (and demonstrably misreported) information that has no basis in actual evidence. It is a fiction. Go to the source (Maria) and you will find that what you are basing your claims on is simply untrue.

The same applies to much of what you post.

bgamall4 says

You can't even see with your own damn eyes that WTC7 fell from the bottom and the top and in the middle at the same damn rate, making pancaking impossible.

You're right, I can't see that. How is it that you can? The videos I've seen clearly show that part of the internal structure collapsed before the rest of the building, demonstrated by the fact that the penthouse collapsed downwards before the outer part of the building. Based just on that, how can you make your claim?

tatupu70 says

d503 says

I've had a plan for four years for a family of four. Two children and two

healthy adults in our forties. We received a termination notice because our plan

doesn't meet the Obamacare guidelines. With all incentives our premium will more

than double. I support the goal of Obamacare, but I was counting on keeping my

plan as promised by my president. If I didn't keep my plan I thought I was going

to get cheaper insurance. Both didn't happen. As a supporter of the plan I feel

betrayed.

Forgive me if I'm a bit skeptical of this story...

Well he left out the part about Obama stepping on his puppy.

zzyzzx says

Even if that's true, how many 27 year old have a spare $972 to spend each year?

Well it's not "spare", it's their budget for health insurance. And yes, if you make over $45K and you are only supporting yourself, then you can afford $972 a year for health insurance.

zzyzzx says

Article clearly states that the pricing is for unsubsidized people. I don't know why you are complaining about that.

I'm not complaining. YOU guys are complaining; but you're complaining about a situation that doesn't exist. The article implies that every 27 year old will be responsible for $3,200 in health insurance premiums. That, simply put, is a crock of shit.

zzyzzx says

I don't like the way the article is written, but if you read further down, they do make a lot of good points about how medical cost structure in the US is way too high, and of course nothing is done about that in Obamacare.

It's hard to find any motivation to read that far down when at least the first 10 paragraphs are complete horseshit and lies. If there are any gems at the bottom of the page, they are buried in feces.

I agree that price caps for medical services would have been nice. I also think the law would never have seen the light of day if it had price caps in it. At least we have our foot in the door now, and maybe something like that can get added later. You know who tried to pass healthcare reform with price caps? Bill Clinton. How far did THAT get?

Funny, I had you pegged as a "goes too far" person. Are you saying ACA doesn't go far ENOUGH?

I bet she was in Benghazi too.

I call bullshit.

Obama has never set foot in the United States - he can't even get an entry visa. All his appearances are by Skype.

No way Michelle went to Princeton, unless they have a satellite campus in Kenya. More like "Princeton Technical Institute of Nairobi" I'll bet.

APOCALYPSEFUCK is Comptroller says

Someone sniff Michelle's face ...

You are obsessed with food lately.

Here is a case where if this is true, the left should weigh in against it
Instead we will hear excuses and be provided with examples of how bush did the same or worse
This is a common tactic of democrats and republicans who have their followers trained well

ThreeBays says

But, you don't have to pick an expensive plan.

No, you can pick a cheap plan
78% of people who declare bankruptcy for medical costs have some cheap don't-pay-shit, high deductible-high co-pay, low lifetime payout plan and thought they were "insured".
Insurance companies peddle many products that people pay real money (month after month) for only to find out they don't have real insurance.
http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/06/05/bankruptcy.medical.bills/index.html?_s=PM:HEALTH

So what you're saying is, you hate successful people?

Toni Townes-Whitley '85.
Michelle Obama '83.

The only linkage the article makes is they "are both members of the Association of Black Princeton Alumni". You'd need a stronger case than this.

Can you Photoshop them sitting next to each other at an alumni dinner? Then they sneak off to the coat closet and start making out, we want pictures of that too.

My Dad went to the same school but a couple years apart from Arnold Palmer. Surprisingly they are not best buds.

Hey moron! Humans procrastinate! Of course no healthy 20-somethings have rushed out to buy obamacare. They probably all planned on doing it at the last minute.... But the website problems will actually be good in that it might get people off their asses and signing up earlier.

I signed up early because my work plan is raping me with dependent premiums... But most young people are not in a rush to sign up for something they won't get until Jan 1st and don't have to sign up for until March.

How many people file their taxes on April 15th... You are calling something a failure because people aren't doing their taxes 6 months in advance!? Really!??!?

Of course people expecting "refunds" would do their taxes early... But if you owe the govt money... Of course you wait til the drop dead deadline... Its freaking human nature!

That's BS that it's becoming harder to get a new mortgage. I just got a new mortgage in Coastal Southern CA and from the time I filled out the paperwork to the time the loan was approved and ready to fund was about 20 days for 4.25% 30 fixed with 2K rebate. I guess it does help that I put 25% down and have over 800 on my FICO. Loans are not harder to get if you're well qualified. I have secured 3 loans in the past 5 years for different properties and they were all just as easy.

smaulgld says

Here is a case where if this is true, the left should weigh in against it

Instead we will hear excuses and be provided with examples of how bush did the same or worse

This is a common tactic of democrats and republicans who have their followers trained well

Yes, because anyone must condemn the actions of all those with whom they have ever shared any opinions who have done anything corrupt or evil.

I have never heard you condemn Timothy McVeigh's actions in Oklahoma City. Why not?

My take: Obama should be in jail for Gitmo and the NSA. If you feel the same because of closed war memorials and wasteful and corrupt contractors, then fine. I have no idea about Michelle. I am also certain that this contract, and many others, was awarded based on personal ties and back-scratching, just as in government and the private sector since 4004 BC.

I also have no idea why anyone not currently suffering from a head injury would be surprised that two people from the same class in Princeton are currently both well-connected in Washington. In 2004, we had an election where both of the tickets had two Yale graduates, and the last election without a Yale man on either the presidential or VP slot in a ticket was in 1976.

The Democrats have a shitbag fuck of a murdering cunt to look forward to dealing with in the 2016 primaries, because she has the same surname as a previous president - we have Americans' weird fetish with family entitlement to thank for this, as well as for Charlie Sheen, Joaquin Phoenix, Jim Belushi, and the snarling inbred chipmunk-faced degenerates of Hyannisport. And, of course, there's the long record of public service of the Bush family.

Quiz: when was the last time the GOP won a presidential election without someone named Richard Nixon or George Bush on it (P or VP slot)? (Answer below*)

I have heard that Halliburton and KBR had a former CEO high up in the Bush administration. Any info on this? And there are rumours that former and future employees of Goldman Sachs have repeatedly served at Treasury. I believe there to be multiple Ivy-League graduates serving on the Supreme Court, at the Fed, in Congress, and at Treasury, as well as in management at many huge private federal contractors: if we could get more details, we could break this conspiracy wide open!

Finally, I have to ask: Smaulgld, have you given any consideration to the role illegal aliens and minorities played in this contract? They are apparently the key beneficiaries of all state and federal legislation, and the cause of all economic downturns and collapses. I suspect that there are cases where two black people knew one another in the past - an activity white people are far less likely to engage in. Minorities are always doing one another favors, it seems, as they can't get by talent like normal people.

Now be a good boy and repudiate and apologize for the Oklahoma City bombing.

*1928

ThreeBays says

Insurance is about pooling money from those who don't need to use it right now with those who do need it right now.

Correction: Socialism is about pooling money from those who don't need to use it right now with those who do need it right now.

Why should I pay $200/mo. to repair the cars of ne'er-do-wells who can't drive as well as I can? Why should I pay to fix the tumors and broken hips of irresponsible old people? Why should I, who am alive, pay life insurance to the irresponsible families of some idiot who didn't know better than to die?

What happened to responsibility and self-reliance?

Why can't I drive on different roads, breathe different air, shit in a different sewer system, get rained on by different clouds, eat different species, and fuck different vaginas from everyone else?

I want everything custom. I refuse to interact or correspond with other human beings, and will engage in no financial transaction with them. I will not acknowledge them in any way.

Why can't I just live in my nice house and talk only to my mommy, like when I was little?!

ThreeBays says

According to Kaiser's calculator, the average cost for a Silver plan is ~$834/mo with ~$2,500 deductible. How amazing... it actually is what you should pay.

Given that this price is what I'd expect an insurer to charge you, it is hard to believe you would have had a plan that cost half that much before.

My premium now is $406 for a family of four. I mentioned in another post that we got the uber low rate for a couple reasons. Excellent health at application time, and since it is an individual policy we excluded some coverage that is not relevant to us. I do have a higher deductible currently that the Kaiser plan you quoted for around $800. In order to keep my doctors I have to go to a more expensive silver plan that average. Let's say I get an average plan of $800 with silver, I will be double, but I will get a lower deductible and have broader (unnecessary) coverage. I already have no lifetime payouts thanks to ACA (excellent from a consumer perspective).

I do get a huge benefit that I don't have to worry about getting dropped someday because they have to cover me now.

As I said earlier I just felt betrayed when they said I keep my doctor, plan, and I would save. Otherwise I was a huge supporter of the reform.

If they meant only for the 70% for company sponsored plans, then I'll admit I missed that. I thought the statement was for everyone.