patrick.net

Yeah, problem is that the first thing a Trump supporter mentions is the deliberate, DC-Chamber of Commerce driven outsourcing of jobs, massive immigration in the face of declining living wage jobs, etc.

The anti-SJW is just icing on the cake.

thunderlips11 says

Yeah, problem is that the first thing a Trump supporter mentions is the deliberate, DC-Chamber of Commerce driven outsourcing of jobs, massive immigration in the face of declining living wage jobs, etc.

That voter profile, if it's simply about economics should be voting for bernie sanders. They should at least pick someone with legit progressive cred instead of "you're fired."

dublin hillz says

It’s a point in favor of those who see politics as being governed by cultural identity — a matter of seeking out one’s “tribe” and fitting in with it — as opposed to carefully calibrating one’s position on a left-right spectrum."

Humanity is entirely based on tribes. The country is a tribe. Religions are tribes. Political parties are tribes. Even a family or a company can act as "tribes".
People want to think they are rational, that they act out of reason. But we are all ruled by our "tribes". This defines who we are, what is our vision of the world, who are our leaders, and what we try to achieve in life. If you were born in Saudi Arabia, you might well be a muslim devout bending over 5 times a day because it would be your tribe. This what human beings are.

Except in the west we have a mainstream view that we should all just reject that. That any immigrant is exactly the same as us. That any attempt to oppose immigration is intrinsically racist and to be rejected as evil. That any acknowledgement of the slightest difference is a hidden attempt to divide people, and therefore an act of atrocious bigotry.

I think such views can only imposed from the top and will be eventually lead to massive revulsion at a very basic human level.
You see the start of this with Trump and others in Europe.

Heraclitusstudent says

I think such views can only imposed from the top and will be eventually lead to massive revulsion at a very basic human level.

Reconstruction led to lynchings and Jim Crow laws. The Civil Rights Act led to the KKK and most southern whites jumping to the GOP thanks to Nixon's Southern Strategy.

Similarly, the first black president must be paid off, due to pent-up white resentment at perceived loss of tribal face.

Trump understood this. Whether or not he wins, the score must be settled at some point; if not through a Trump presidency, then by other means later on.

HydroCabron says

Reconstruction led to lynchings and Jim Crow laws. The Civil Rights Act led to the KKK and most southern whites jumping to the GOP thanks to Nixon's Southern Strategy.

Similarly, the first black president must be paid off, due to pent-up white resentment at perceived loss of tribal face.

[shrug]
Liberal democracy has not existed for very long and may well remain in history as brief exception, both enabled my massive technological and economic explosion, and required by the necessities of commerce.

The Roman empire had it too and look what happened to it.

As we move out of the growth phase, the intrusion of massive immigration, foreign trade, and the fragmentation of society all become unbearable. The thirst for a consistent tribal surrounding becomes too big, and can only be quenched by a surge of self-centered nationalism i.e. a focus on the national "tribe".

Race, religion and resources. I believe this the is way people see (race), think (religion, morality discerns how we live) and meet their needs (go after resources).

Ironman says

Nate Silver hasn't been too accurate lately.

Been dead wrong on Trump for certain. He doubted Trump could get 1237 not many days ago. Now it's all but inevitable.

I see Andrew Sullivan came out from Cape Cod to write a piece bashing Trump, not surprised a Leo Strauss follower would do so. No Optimate likes a Populare..

Heraclitusstudent says

The Roman empire had it too and look what happened to it.

Talk about historical revisionism. The Roman empire was a liberal democracy? LOL

finehoe says

The Roman empire was a liberal democracy?

No, but it had technological and economic growth requiring labor import (slaves), trade, and a fragmented society. Their sense of a unified nation decreased. They relied on mercenaries because most roman citizens were not willing to fight for their 'tribe'. Christianity, which could be see as a foreign 'tribe', took over their own native religious tradition, making things worse. And ultimately they were overtaken by more basic but more unified actual tribes.

Heraclitusstudent says

And ultimately they were overtaken by more basic but more unified actual tribes.

Yeah, and it only took a five-hundred years for it to happen.

My point is more about the importance of 'tribalism' for human beings, and how this enlightens what is happening in politics and religion, in the US and the world.

There is a paradox for people on the left. Indeed the only way immigrants become integrated in this nation (and in Europe) is if they adopt this national 'tribe' as their own. This is particularly true for Muslims as they have a strong competing and non-overlapping tribe. In fact it would be fair to say the strategy of the US against Muslims extremism in the US is based on a "Don't confront them. Just assimilate them." mantra. Confrontation indeed would cause the other tribe to coalesce and become defensive. But this strategy supposes the existence of a vibrant national identity that attracts people. However leftists are often denying and diluting the very existence of anything that resembles a national identity that would go beyond what kids learn in elementary school.

HS said: Indeed the only way immigrants become integrated in this nation (and in Europe) is if they adopt this national 'tribe' as their own.

I thought one reaction to the Trump phenomena was interesting. In spite of the fact that Trump rails against illegal immigration only, some long time greencard holders are getting nervous and becoming US citizens to: 1) Vote and 2) Ensure that they can never be asked to leave. Talk about coalescing a national identity...

Anybody wanna take a bet that the next James Bond is cast as a Pakistani Muslim?

"No Martini, Shaken or Stirred. It's Haram, Q."