patrick.net

IDDQD says

Thedaytoday says

Infact Obama wanted to take it out of the bill, it was FORCED ON HIM BY THESE FOOLS!

The only way to force something on President is to overturn his veto. Which didn't happen in this case. So let's not kid ourselves: he is completely on board with this shite.

That's not what happened. He could not veto the defense spending bill!

NDAA was added by WHOM? Not Obama, it was the Repukes, McCain and Graham. It eventually was rammed down Obama's throat part of the defense spending bill.

So go read your history , it was not that long ago.

Thedaytoday says

Regardless of whether it's stories are true of false, accurate or inaccurate it is propaganda against the West.

Then it is unimportant whether or not it's propaganda. All that is important is if the stories are true and accurate.

Dan8267 says

Then it is unimportant whether or not it's propaganda. All that is important is if the stories are true and accurate.

I disagree, I am not interested in consuming Russian made propaganda targeted at the West, they have their own agenda.
It's your personal opinion that it does not matter and your welcome to it.

I will not consume RT (Russian State Owned Media), it's obviously propaganda.

Dan8267 says

Thedaytoday says

Regardless of whether it's stories are true of false, accurate or inaccurate it is propaganda against the West.

Then it is unimportant whether or not it's propaganda. All that is important is if the stories are true and accurate.

Being that I don't watch RT I can't speak to whether or not I feel it is propaganda.

I do however believe that it is important if something is propaganda. Something can be truthful, yet not tell the whole story and/or be presented, subtly or not, in a way to sway people away from the truth--true yet intellectually dishonest.

Take for instance the issue in this thread of whether or not Obama has kept his promises. Say one had created some hypothetical news network that had a mission to misinform people and turn them against democrats. Let's say that 100% of there extensive coverage on Obama was discussing the 22% of promises he broke. While truthful this would not be an "honest" representation of Obama's record on keeping promises. I am sure that no American would have the moral depravity to take part in such a deceptive news organization like that. However, such an organization would breed ignorance, spread hate, and be harmful to public discourse in America.

leo707 says

Let's say that 100% of [their] extensive coverage on Obama was discussing the 22% of promises he broke. While truthful this would not be an "honest" representation of Obama's record on keeping promises. I am sure that no American would have the moral depravity to take part in such a deceptive news organization like that.

LOL ;) Alas, due to the dynamic you described, American perception of reality is bifurcating to such a degree that people live in polar opposite worlds. Even seemingly objective numbers, like % of promises kept or broken, are distorted by different lenses. Politifact spins promises broken into promises kept, while Faux News spins promises kept into promises broken. Perhaps it was always like that and we didn't see it before the WWW, which has enabled some people to see more broadly while others have dug deeper into their own silos.

I do watch RT occasionally and it can be interesting to see Putin's relentless critique of America. I wouldn't call it more objective necessarily but it comes from a different perspective and shows the elephant from a different angle. For example, they reported Romney's apparent voter fraud at a time when most American news outlets were shouting their usual binary narrative (Republicans saying voter fraud is committed by Democrats vs Democrats saying voter fraud doesn't happen).

Geez, I thought you were talking about Fox News.

Russia has television now? Is it in color?

IDDQD says

Thedaytoday says

He could not veto the defense spending bill!

Of course he could if it contained attachments he couldn't agree with.

Yeah, Obama could totally not approve paying for the military. What's the worst that could happen?

In regards to propaganda......

If you want to speak in a very strict sense, where propaganda is defined as an attempt to influence someones opinion with selective facts, than almost everything is propaganda. News programs, talk radio, periodicals, books, art...even entire subjects like history and sociology are ingrained and shaped with biases. Even this very forum and the premise of this forum can be considered propaganda. Is RT news really that different than CNN? Is Glenn Beck and Sean Hannity really any different than Chris Matthews and Soledad O'brien? They are just opposite sides of the same coin.

I believe a truly intelligent person can take an idea or opinion, analyze and dissect it in their own mind, and accept it or reject it based on its own merits.

Well they posted pictorials you can't argue with Photoshop.
I guess your argument is kaput.

Thedaytoday says

Scagnetti says

NDAA didn't happen?

John McCain & Lindsey Graham Justifying The NDAA Bill

Infact Obama wanted to take it out of the bill, it was FORCED ON HIM BY THESE FOOLS!

IDDQD says

Thedaytoday says

He could not veto the defense spending bill!

Of course he could if it contained attachments he couldn't agree with.

Unfortunately for you 121212, a court had struck down the provision pertaining to indefinite detention contained in the NDAA. The court decided it was unconstitutional. The Obama administration immediately appealed that decision to reinstate the provision! Obama is for it! Don't listen to what Obama says, watch what he does damn it!

http://rt.com/usa/news/appeals-ndaa-detention-public-536/

http://www.infowars.com/federal-court-rules-in-favour-of-indefinite-detention-of-us-citizens/

Thedaytoday says

U.S. Congress Continues To Block Guantanamo Closure

(not OBAMA)

I see....so you blow your whistle on RT news being propaganda, but you post a video by one of biggest liberals on TV??? Hypocritical much?

http://www.forbes.com/2009/01/22/influential-media-obama-oped-cx_tv_ee_hra_0122liberal_slide_20.html

Thedaytoday says

U.S. Congress Continues To Block Guantanamo Closure

(not OBAMA)

"Civil rights advocates still hope Obama stays true to his word. By his own power, he could take significant steps to close the prison, or he could issue a so-called signing statement that supersedes the law preventing federal money from being used to transfer prisoners.

Zachary Katznelson, a senior attorney at the American Civil Liberties Union, said Obama can release 87 Guantanamo prisoners who have been cleared, and start proceedings for trials for the other 169 detainees.

"President Obama has enough control and power that he can get these men out today if he has the political will to do so," Katznelson said. "It is a political decision."

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/OTUS/guantanamo-bay-open-promises/story?id=16698768

Here's a news clip updating the current situation of Obama's (and others) support of indefinite detention for civilians defined in NDAA.

http://www.youtube.com/embed/jNI2hRtN4c4

Thedaytoday says

Scagnetti says

The patriot act extension didn't happen?

and which party had the majority in the house and passed it?

And your point is? Who had the majority in the senate? Who's president? Who cares? Democrats are as bad as republicans. In fact, in many ways they aren't different at all, but the same.

leo707 says

Scagnetti says

35% of promises kept seems low to me! Especially since many of his broken promises could have been kept by a simple order from him. Not legislation in many cases, just an order.

Yeah, that does seem low. Let me help you with an updated chart (I pulled it today):

If you are pissed at Obama you must be livid with the GOP:

Thanks for updating it! I am not politically affiliated...I don't like politicians in general, regardless of party.

Scagnetti says

Thedaytoday says

U.S. Congress Continues To Block Guantanamo Closure

(not OBAMA)

I see....so you blow your whistle on RT news being propaganda, but you post a video by one of biggest liberals on TV??? Hypocritical much?

http://www.forbes.com/2009/01/22/influential-media-obama-oped-cx_tv_ee_hra_0122liberal_slide_20.html

Move to Russia and shut up you fool.

Scagnetti says

Thedaytoday says

Scagnetti says

The patriot act extension didn't happen?

and which party had the majority in the house and passed it?

And your point is? Who had the majority in the senate? Who's president? Who cares? Democrats are as bad as republicans. In fact, in many ways they aren't different at all, but the same.

That is my point, fool!

Scagnetti says

Unfortunately for you 121212,

Call me TheDayToday, Spagetti

Scagnetti says

In regards to propaganda......

If you want to speak in a very strict sense, where propaganda is defined as an attempt to influence someones opinion with selective facts, than almost everything is propaganda. News programs, talk radio, periodicals, books, art...even entire subjects like history and sociology are ingrained and shaped with biases. Even this very forum and the premise of this forum can be considered propaganda. Is RT news really that different than CNN? Is Glenn Beck and Sean Hannity really any different than Chris Matthews and Soledad O'brien? They are just opposite sides of the same coin.

I believe a truly intelligent person can take an idea or opinion, analyze and dissect it in their own mind, and accept it or reject it based on its own merits.

RT IS RUSSIAN STATE OWNED & OPERATED DEAR COMMRAD SPAGETTI

The mere fact that it is in English should tell you something!

You think Russians get their news from RT!

Thedaytoday says

RT news really that different than CNN? Is

Unless the Russian State own CNN, no it is not the same.

You make a stupid conclusion.

Thedaytoday says

Democrats are as bad as republicans

Your insane! Did you watch the elections and post election destruction of the GOP. The Repukes have gone off the mental cliff. They have no leaders left.

Do you know what the Republic Party platform?

Scagnetti says

In regards to propaganda......

If you want to speak in a very strict sense, where propaganda is defined as an attempt to influence someones opinion with selective facts, than almost everything is propaganda. News programs, talk radio, periodicals, books, art...even entire subjects like history and sociology are ingrained and shaped with biases. Even this very forum and the premise of this forum can be considered propaganda.

Sure, just about everything has bias, but that does not make it all propaganda. We live in a world of grey, no just black and white. Propaganda is an extreme bias where you are literal getting only one side of the story with the intent of influencing someone to support an idea, cause, etc.

Scagnetti says

In regards to propaganda......

Is RT news really that different than CNN? Is Glenn Beck and Sean Hannity really any different than Chris Matthews and Soledad O'brien? They are just opposite sides of the same coin.

Yes, they are different not quite "just opposite sides of the same coin."

I am not familiar enough with RT, but sure CNN has a bias however I would not call CNN propaganda per se.

Beck and Hannity do only tell one side of the story. Often with their selective facts are heaps of out right lies. Viewers of FOX "news" are worse informed on world and US events than people who watch no news. Beck and Hannity's depravity and shameless propaganda knows no bounds. If you are interested in the subject it was discussed at length in this thread:
http://patrick.net/?p=1219028&page=3#comments

Is MSNBC (Chris Matthews) propaganda? Yeah, it seems so, but not nearly to the degree that FOX "news" is. People who watch MSNBC are better informed than those who watch no news on domestic issues, but not international.

If you are looking for a news source with very low bias try NPR.

leo707 says

I am not familiar enough with RT

RT is state owned media

RT is what i call a "whine" network because that's all they do all day.

"they beat us in the cold war and now we going to spend a lot of money on this BS news network called RT to endlessly whine about it."

Thedaytoday says

leo707 says

I am not familiar enough with RT

RT is state owned media

Yes, while this give me pause I am not sure how much it actually matters. FOX "news" is privately held yet it would be hard to rival FOX for output of effective propaganda.

This video explains Obama's behavior as opposed to what actually happens. It's a roadshow hoax.

http://www.youtube.com/embed/V7GE5fRXdqg&feature=youtu.be

leo707 says

Thedaytoday says

leo707 says

I am not familiar enough with RT

RT is state owned media

Yes, while this give me pause I am not sure how much it actually matters. FOX "news" is privately held yet it would be hard to rival FOX for output of effective propaganda.

Think about it. Fox is the news arm of the GOP.

RT is STATE RUN !!! Meaning........... it is the English news propaganda arm of Russia.

Similar to BBC World or BBC International but in the hosts language.

I've been researching all day & guess what I discovered. The POTUS can "VETO" any bill that comes to his desk. I'm simply amazed. LMAO

Mark D says

RT is what i call a "whine" network because that's all they do all day.

"they beat us in the cold war and now we going to spend a lot of money on this BS news network called RT to endlessly whine about it."

I don't find them anti-american or whiny at all. Very informative and they have all kinds of Americans on with all kinds of political views and their interview style is fair but they don't take bs instead they politely try to get to the core of the issue past the bs. Also the notion of Russia being the eternal enemy of the US in a globalized world doesn't hold much water.

Thedaytoday says

Thedaytoday says

RT news really that different than CNN? Is

Unless the Russian State own CNN, no it is not the same.

You make a stupid conclusion.

Hahahahaha

Did you realize you quoted yourself, then called yourself stupid! Way to go 3x12!

Scagnetti says

Poll: Has Obama kept his promises?

Vote for me and I will do for you ....(insert here)

Demands Gov't 'Bacon' in Return for Supporting Obama

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yS30up_rTIM

http://www.youtube.com/embed/xzvHpWCMAnU

List of lobbyists appointed by Obama...

"Eric Holder, attorney general nominee, was registered to lobby until 2004 on behalf of clients including Global Crossing, a bankrupt telecommunications firm [now confirmed].
-Tom Vilsack, secretary of agriculture nominee, was registered to lobby as recently as last year on behalf of the National Education Association.
-William Lynn, deputy defense secretary nominee, was registered to lobby as recently as last year for defense contractor Raytheon, where he was a top executive.
-William Corr, deputy health and human services secretary nominee, was registered to lobby until last year for the Campaign for Tobacco-Free Kids, a non-profit that pushes to limit tobacco use.
-David Hayes, deputy interior secretary nominee, was registered to lobby until 2006 for clients, including the regional utility San Diego Gas & Electric.
-Mark Patterson, chief of staff to Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner, was registered to lobby as recently as last year for financial giant Goldman Sachs.
-Ron Klain, chief of staff to Vice President Joe Biden, was registered to lobby until 2005 for clients, including the Coalition for Asbestos Resolution, U.S. Airways, Airborne Express and drug-maker ImClone.
-Mona Sutphen, deputy White House chief of staff, was registered to lobby for clients, including Angliss International in 2003.
-Melody Barnes, domestic policy council director, lobbied in 2003 and 2004 for liberal advocacy groups, including the American Civil Liberties Union, the Leadership Conference on Civil Rights, the American Constitution Society and the Center for Reproductive Rights.
-Cecilia Munoz, White House director of intergovernmental affairs, was a lobbyist as recently as last year for the National Council of La Raza, a Hispanic advocacy group.
-Patrick Gaspard, White House political affairs director, was a lobbyist for the Service Employees International Union.
-Michael Strautmanis, chief of staff to the president’s assistant for intergovernmental relations, lobbied for the American Association of Justice from 2001 until 2005."

http://hotair.com/archives/2009/02/03/the-list-of-lobbyists-in-the-obama-administration/

Looks like the Monsanto guy is missing who was put into the FDA by Obummer.

Scagnetti says

Hahahahaha

Did you realize you quoted yourself, then called yourself stupid! Way to go 3x12!

Hahha no, that's no what happened. Dumb ass.

LEO says

Yes, while this give me pause I am not sure how much it actually matters. FOX "news" is privately held yet it would be hard to rival FOX for output of effective propaganda.

I was responding to this, fukwit Spagnetti

Thedaytoday says

Scagnetti says

Hahahahaha

Did you realize you quoted yourself, then called yourself stupid! Way to go 3x12!

Hahha no, that's no what happened. Dumb ass.

Thedaytoday says

LEO says

Yes, while this give me pause I am not sure how much it actually matters. FOX "news" is privately held yet it would be hard to rival FOX for output of effective propaganda.

I was responding to this, fukwit Spagnetti

First off, it's ok to make a mistake 121212, which you obviously did. We are all imperfect and prone to making them. You have to learn to admit those mistakes and move on. I think you don't want to seem stupid or uninformed, but you're approach is wrong. Being able to admit mistakes can garner respect and is a sign of intelligence and maturity, whereas the inability to admit mistakes, fosters disrespect and shows immaturity and ignorance.

Secondly, I'm tired of your incessant name calling directed towards others and myself. I already ignored your alter ego 121212 for the very same reason. I won't delete your posts or ignore your new identity.....yet. Go ahead and post on this thread, but keep it clean! If you can't control yourself, don't post.

Scagnetti says

Secondly, I'm tired of your incessant name calling directed towards others and myself. I already ignored your alter ego 121212 for the very same reason.

I've had pimples on my asscrack more endearing than him.