patrick.net

Rew says

The US Government has been repeatedly saying we are being attacked by information warfare with the intent to disrupt and sway elections. It is of Russian origin. It is the Russian state itself, as the organization responsible is the GRU. This is factually declared. It is being said by Trump appointees. It is being said by all branches of our intelligence services.

Yes, the Russians spent very little money on Facebook and got a Free Tumblr account giving away Pokechoo or whatever anime crap for a contest supporting BLM-type stuff.

Most of it was spent after the election, and most of it was spent on BLM-style rhetoric. RT was pushing all that crap 2015-2016, so yeah, it was a (very minor) thing.

I'm sure you've realized, if you drew a Venn Diagram of BLM supporters and Trump supporters, the overlap would be damned small.

Of course the Russians exploit differences in America to destablize the country.

Maybe you should direct some treason accusations to BLM, since they were inspired by a convicted cop killer and Russia loves them so much. BLM issues were heavily promoted by the media.

But the idea Russia won the election because of 6 figures spent over the course of a year on this shit promoting RT/Sputnik, is laughable.

That would make the GRU vastly superior in using money to promote a campaign then every Master Dem or Republican Campaign Manager in US History.

TwoScoopsOfWompWomp says

That would make the GRU vastly superior in using money to promote a campaign then every Master Dem or Republican Campaign Manager in US History.

There is no equivalence between the opinion and vote shaping power of a political campaign run, by Dem or Repub, within the US. That's a straw-man equivalence of your own creation.

But the GRU can muddy the waters and "point the boat" some. Couple their cyber ops with on the ground agents and financing fringe extremism, and what do you get: a potent country destabilizing mix. Look at the democracies they have attacked: Poland, Hungry, Italy, Georgia, Ukraine, UK, France, Germany, the USA. Russia knows exactly how effective what it has been doing is. It's a minimal cost for a huge gain and they have been practicing and getting better every year. They are about 1/10th our economic and military might, yet on this asymmetrical tac, they are winning big!

NATO is reeling. Russia has grabbed more territory in the past 5 years than the past 20 (big bite marks our of Georgia borders most recently). And Russia has lined up to fill trade and power vacuums the US is willingly causing by isolationism/tariffs/stupidity.

You can tell me Russia is exploiting natural cracks and trends it can readily find in these democracies already. Many are caused by economic stress, and frankly older governmental systems that may be beyond their current era/usefulness. Sure. I agree. But pretending that what Russia is doing is somehow "no big deal", "just the way the game is played" or even in US interest, is so beyond the understanding of our foreign policy and national defense concerns it renders any point you want to make to be null.

Russia is out for Russia, and specifically Putin is out to punish the US for knocking him out of superpower standing.

Don't you get it? They don't have to "win" an election or put in some Manchurian candidate. All they have to do is weaken alliances against them and hit Democracy in the gut. They are doing it, and our President isn't reacting. So far, it's only our defense, intelligence, and congressional efforts punching back. POTUS is silent, or tweeting the obscene.

So, Trump is either dangerously negligent or he is compromised. Which will it be?

(Edit: I'll accept "both" as a very strong, and likely correct answer, too.)

Obama attempted to rig Israels election - with taxpayer money. Thank God he failed or the Israelis probably would have given land for no peace.

He also tried to interfere with Brexit, even though an Economically DIS-united Europe (only united in NATO) is to our every economic advantage since we will make bespoke deals with several smaller countries instead of a German-guided powerhouse with more leverage (of course internationalist Atlanticists WANT the EU to weaken the nation state replaced by Corporate Dominated Superstates and Corporate Run "Comprehensive Multinational Trade Agreements" where they are judge and jury and legislator and cop)

Military Spending is way up. Russian mercenaries fighting with Assad's Army were literally obliterated aerially by the USAF.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/us-army-kill-russians-syria-civil-war-mercenaries-deir-ezzor-isis-a8268691.html

The Economy is booming. Employment is way down. Ukraine is being armed with lethal weapons, including ATGMs, something that Obama didn't dare do.
https://www.janes.com/article/79717/ukraine-receives-javelins

Europe pledged to buy increasing amounts of US LNG which is a direct blow to Russian Nordstream. Here is Sputnik's grouchy take on it:
https://sputniknews.com/analysis/201808011066867641-europe-us-lng-tariffs/

Russia LOVED the Iran Deal and Lavrov was visibly pissed when it was cancelled.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/politics/iran-nuclear-deal-trump-russia-reaction-doomed-fail-aggressive-a7999636.html

Trump is pushing for increasing NATO Contributions among the wealthy West Europeans. Most are grudgingly complying. This is not to Russia's benefit.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-03-15/nato-members-post-new-defense-spending-rise-amid-trump-pressure

The Germans, who not 30 years ago fielded armored divisions plural, couldn't find a dozen functional tanks in a week to fly the flag on a NATO combined nation exercise in Eastern Europe. Pathetic!

Trump fired cruise missiles into Syria, pissing Russia the hell off who claimed a ridiculously high intercept ratio
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/apr/14/russia-claims-syria-air-defences-shot-down-majority-missiles

Putin is not winning; the idea of this is absurd.

In Syria, in Ukraine, in Europe - Putin is not getting anything of what he wants. Instead, ordinary diplomacy - the mere meeting of a rival which was routine in the Cold War (WH and Kremlin officials communicated DAILY and POTUS and Premiers talked very often, both phone and in person) is cast as Treason.

None of this makes any sense. All of this is a Machiavellian fabrication to excuse away the Democrats failure and to try to immobilize a pro-American Reformer and keep the Corporate Status Quo. If the Russians are such an Existential threat - although they are a fraction of their size in the Cold War, their Navy is a fraction of the size, their Army a fraction of size - why are the Democrats weakening a National Security President who is doing everything except sinking Russian Navy vessels?

Again, just like the Democrats refuse to turn over their "Hacked" Server to the FBI/NSA for forensic analysis.

It's pure political BS and dangerous to National Security.

What substantial thing did Putin Get? More Sanctions? Better Armed Ukrainian Army? Getting a Russian "Blackwater" unit obliterated when it failed to obey US commands to stay away?

Rew says

It is also pro-Trump

I think we found where CNN has implanted their fakenews.

The rest of your statement seems like agreed upon fact, this part about these foreign agents supporting trump however is pure speculation. No official has suggested there is any evidence that the manipulators are pro trump. Nor has anyone suggested the agents effected the campaign for trump.

Also, how would you explain the anti-trump Russian propaganda if you think they support trump?

#fakenews

Rew says

All they have to do is weaken alliances against them and hit Democracy in the gut

I’m glad you realize this. That is exactly what they’ve done so far. They’ve worked to promote strife, lack of faith in elections, and they’ve worked to promote the idea that a violent revolution may be necessary to secure a “correct” government in the United States.
To that end they’ve sewn hatred between classes and races and ideologies. They’ve organied riots and uprisings and freeway shut-downs. They’ve worked to entrench Leftists in their positions, and drag those positions from ideological to the kind of batshit crazy that conservatives view with horror.

The Russians want you to #resist
The Russians want civil disorder.
The Russians want you to reject the leadership of your President and your government.
Their ultimate victory would be the USA going into Civil War II.

Why are you helping the Russians?

Rew says

What will Trump do in 2018?

Let's see:

Keep growing jobs, wages and income for ALL Americans.

Keep fighting corruption in the swamp.

Keep increasing GDP.

Keep negotiating and fixing crappy trade agreements.

Keep negotiating and trying to get peace with our enemies.

Keep trying to make America safe.

Keep trying to improve the lives of ALL Americans (not just Republicans).

Oh, and lastly....

Making your TDS rise OFF the charts...

How's that?