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Housing prices will not go down...


               
2025 Jan 2, 7:23pm   28,336 views  657 comments

by anon5525   follow (0)  

... because immigration will not go down. Housing prices are controlled by supply and demand. There is no space in any urban area to build more housing. None. You can't insert land between two streets. The only way to increase supply is to steal people's homes through eminent domain and tear them down to build higher density apartments

So the only way to decrease real prices is to decrease demand, and the only way to do that is to kick out all illegal immigrants and anchor babies. Will Trump do this? Almost certainly not. Even with control over all three branches of the government, the Republicans are not going to get rid of all the illegals who are driving up housing prices and social welfare costs. I wish that I was wrong about this, but I'm not.

The United States population reached 200 million on November 20, 1967. If there was no net migration, then the U.S. population have stabilized to about 220 million. Instead, the population is 335 million. This is why housing is so expensive. This is why rent is so damn high. This is why the younger generations cannot afford to have children. This is why the only way to keep the population from falling is to import massive numbers of unskilled, uneducated, and often criminal immigrants. Both parties are responsible for this: democrats for importing voters and republicans for importing farm laborers. Both parties want cheap labor.

When you import massive numbers of low-iq, low-skill workers, your per capital GDP declines relative to where it would have been otherwise. Yes, technological advancements mask this because technology increases GDP faster than low-skill immigration decreases it, but most of those gains don't get seen by the middle class.

Since both parties, and their corporate overlords, are benefiting from the current system, immigration will continue and housing prices will also continue to rise. I suppose I shouldn't care since I own and have a 2.25% mortgage that is being eaten away by inflation, but anyone young enough that they having bought already is fucked.

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626   AD   2025 Dec 11, 10:45am  

AD says

• Policy Challenges: Without major reforms in zoning, permitting, and construction incentives, the housing crisis is expected to persist for years.


Housing construction is getting more and more expensive due to building code and other regulations, especially in states like California. Let alone the cost to purchase the land. That is why lower mortgage interest rates mask this.
627   MolotovCocktail   2025 Dec 11, 2:50pm  

AD says

Housing construction is getting more and more expensive due to building code and other regulations, especially in states like California. Let alone the cost to purchase the land. That is why lower mortgage interest rates mask this.


Another untapped supply is simply cracking down on crime. There are bad neighborhoods everywhere that nobody wants to live in. So that restricts supply. If only cities cracked down Rudy Giuliani style and made a serious difference, entire new supply would open up. That is what happened on NYC, East Palo Alto and other crime hell holes in the 90s.

A rehabbing boom would also ensue. Mega gentrification.
628   Glock-n-Load   2025 Dec 11, 8:11pm  

MolotovCocktail says

AD says


Housing construction is getting more and more expensive due to building code and other regulations, especially in states like California. Let alone the cost to purchase the land. That is why lower mortgage interest rates mask this.


Another untapped supply is simply cracking down on crime. There are bad neighborhoods everywhere that nobody wants to live in. So that restricts supply. If only cities cracked down Rudy Giuliani style and made a serious difference, entire new supply would open up. That is what happened on NYC, East Palo Alto and other crime hell holes in the 90s.

A rehabbing boom would also ensue. Mega gentrification.

Where do those displaced people go?
629   Misc   2025 Dec 11, 10:06pm  

Glock-n-Load says

Where do those displaced people go?


Whatever shithole country they came from.
631   mell   2025 Dec 12, 9:16am  

AD says

AD says


• Policy Challenges: Without major reforms in zoning, permitting, and construction incentives, the housing crisis is expected to persist for years.


Housing construction is getting more and more expensive due to building code and other regulations, especially in states like California. Let alone the cost to purchase the land. That is why lower mortgage interest rates mask this.

Right and that's another reason there will be no crash. New construction has been tepid at best. Also many destroyed coastline properties won't get permit to rebuild. The supply is pretty much coming from existing owners selling only
632   MolotovCocktail   2025 Dec 12, 10:42am  

Misc says

Glock-n-Load says


Where do those displaced people go?


Whatever shithole country they came from.


Waaaahhhh!

@Patrick this Pathole just stole my line that I was going to use! I had it all ready and then his comment shows up!

There should be a draconian PatNet rule against that! To protect losers too damn slow on the draw, etc.


633   Ceffer   2025 Dec 12, 11:21am  

MolotovCocktail says


Patrick this Pathole just stole my line that I was going to use! I had it all ready and then his comment shows up!

There should be a draconian PatNet rule against that! To protect losers too damn slow on the draw, etc.

Maybe an exclusive Patnet copyright. P©. Anybody violating the copyright will be fined a bitcoin.

Memes don't count, since they are inherently birthed and spread by plagiarism to seed mind viruses.
Of course, first dibs on memes go to the local meme lords, who can claim 'exigency meme priority right' as a royal entitlement, no matter who published them first. We need to keep our local cluster meme lords fat, sassy, and full of piss and vinegar.
634   AD   2025 Dec 12, 12:07pm  

https://www.cnbc.com/2025/12/12/homeowners-losing-equity-weakening-prices.html

• Borrower equity fell 2.1% in Q3 2025 compared with a year earlier, translating to an average loss of $13,400 per homeowner.

• Collectively, U.S. homeowners lost $373.8 billion in equity, though overall mortgage‑backed housing equity still stands at $17.1 trillion.

• The number of homes in negative equity (worth less than the mortgage) rose 21% year‑over‑year to 1.2 million, especially among recent buyers with high rates and minimal down payments.

• Markets like Boston, Chicago, and New York City still saw equity gains, while Los Angeles, San Francisco, Washington D.C., Miami, and Houston posted the steepest losses.

• Analysts warn that the future performance of highly leveraged loans depends on economic and labor market strength, as affordability challenges continue to pressure housing.
635   MolotovCocktail   2025 Dec 12, 12:16pm  

AD says


Collectively, U.S. homeowners lost $373.8 billion in equity, though overall mortgage‑backed housing equity still stands at $17.1 trillion.


Sure. Because the first stat is mark-market and the second is not, I bet.
636   MolotovCocktail   2025 Dec 12, 12:19pm  

AD says

Analysts warn that the future performance of highly leveraged loans depends on economic and labor market strength, as affordability challenges continue to pressure housing.


Hahaha...that's the closest they will come to saying, "Bitch, house prices HAVE to fall."


638   MolotovCocktail   2025 Dec 23, 9:41am  

Booger says






Which our elites won't allow to happen.
640   MolotovCocktail   2025 Dec 28, 10:44pm  

AD says

https://denverite.com/2025/12/26/denver-condo-market-recession/


Yup.

Condos are starting homes. Starting homes that are becoming forever homes.
641   MolotovCocktail   2025 Dec 29, 10:51am  


The housing market is dead because the social contract behind it broke, and everyone involved knows it even if they refuse to say it.

Homeownership used to be a ladder. Now it is a gate.

Prices are not supported by utility, shelter need, or family formation anymore. They are supported by path dependence. People who already own cannot move without downgrading their future. People who do not own cannot enter without sacrificing their present. That traps both sides.

Buyers are not waiting. They are giving up.

Sellers are not holding firm. They are frozen by fear.

The market is no longer a place where rational agents meet. It is a standoff between generations with incompatible balance sheets.

Under the surface, three things are true at the same time:

1. Prices are too high relative to incomes in a way that cannot be fixed by optimism.

2. Rates cannot fall enough without breaking something else in the system.

3. Wage growth cannot close the gap without inflation re-accelerating.

So the system stalls.

The reason this feels uncanny is because housing stopped being a market and became a memory. Sellers are pricing yesterday. Buyers are living tomorrow. There is no present where trades make sense.

Nothing resolves until ownership changes hands under pressure, not preference. That pressure comes from job loss, divorce, death, taxes, insurance costs, or policy shifts. Time does more damage here than headlines.

This is really about credibility.

People no longer believe that buying a house improves their life trajectory.

Once that belief breaks, volume collapses first, then narratives, then prices.

What you are looking at is a legitimacy crisis in the largest asset class in the country.

And it stays frozen until reality forces a reset.


https://x.com/_The_Prophet__/status/2005385807754858548
642   PeopleUnited   2025 Dec 29, 8:14pm  

There are so many people just waiting for housing prices to fall.

Reality is, that if homes become less expensive, the wealthy would have to reduce their share of overall wealth. This is not going to happen. The wealthy will get wealthier, and less and less poor and middle class will have houses or other valuable assets. That is the trajectory we are on and it is only accelerating in the past 5 years.
643   Patrick   2025 Dec 29, 9:37pm  

Yes, it's politically impossible for Trump or any other politician to openly advocate what we really need: lower house prices.

Instead, we get bullshit like the 50-year mortgage.



644   FortWayneHatesRealtors   2025 Dec 29, 10:14pm  

Trump made it clear, prices not going down. He’s pushing hard for mass inflation.

Prices going down means INVESTORS lose money, and that’s unacceptable. He is even trying to push 401ks into private equity so their bad debt could be bailed out when it crashes. Private equity is all bad debt.
645   AD   2025 Dec 30, 3:16am  

MolotovCocktail says

The housing market is dead because the social contract behind it broke, and everyone involved knows it even if they refuse to say it.

Homeownership used to be a ladder. Now it is a gate.


Housing has been treated more like a speculative asset like stocks. I see it in Panama City Beach and even our local Republican party chair has criticized the proliferation of single family homes becoming vacation rentals.

But I'm not sure reverse mortgages are that bad of a concept, as it has helped a family member to remain in their home as long as they want by providing the funds for repairs, property taxes, and property insurance.
646   AD   2025 Dec 30, 3:20am  

FortWayneHatesRealtors says

Trump made it clear, prices not going down. He’s pushing hard for mass inflation.

Prices going down means INVESTORS lose money, and that’s unacceptable. He is even trying to push 401ks into private equity so their bad debt could be bailed out when it crashes. Private equity is all bad debt.


I believe someone posted that Trump said he did not want housing prices to drop because it could harm baby boomers who own their homes without a mortgage.

I think the best is that housing goes down 10% from the all time high and then remains flat for the next 5 years while household income increases 3% a year and the 30 year mortgage rate remains around 6.1% (and 5.6% or VA and FHA).
647   Glock-n-Load   2025 Dec 30, 4:57am  

Anyone here a believer in TPTB managing the housing market?
648   GreaterNYCDude   2025 Dec 30, 6:37am  

Glock-n-Load says

Anyone here a believer in TPTB managing the housing market?

Indirectly through both interest rates and large companies which bought up real estate to get into the rental game when rates were low.
649   GreaterNYCDude   2025 Dec 30, 6:42am  

It's a tug of war in a way. Inflation leads to higher building costs which leads to higher prices. Add in government regulation and it's just not profitable (enough) to build starter homes. The rise of short term rentals further reduces housing stock.

But the price levels are not sustainable long term. Either prices need to fall, wages need to go up, or (more probably) a combination of the two. Absent market intervention, equilibrium will be reached in time but right now it's a bit of a standoff. Add to that the many of those with sub 4% rates who are under no obligation to sell. The market, at least in my area, is at an impasse. More homes sitting for longer and not moving.

Hence "innovations" such as a 50 year mortgage. Reducing rates will only close the gap so far.



Source: https://www.zerohedge.com/personal-finance/visualizing-growing-gap-between-us-home-size-and-price
651   AD   2025 Dec 30, 3:48pm  

Blue says

There won’t be any relief from rising inflation that still pushes home values!


Yes, housing construction costs as far as labor and material go up, but the home builders may still need to lower prices and incur lower profit margins.
652   GNL   2025 Dec 30, 4:29pm  

AD says

Blue says


There won’t be any relief from rising inflation that still pushes home values!


Yes, housing construction costs as far as labor and material go up, but the home builders may still need to lower prices and incur lower profit margins.

What are their profit margins?
653   Patrick   2025 Dec 30, 5:18pm  

Patrick says

Yes, it's politically impossible for Trump or any other politician to openly advocate what we really need: lower house prices.

Instead, we get bullshit like the 50-year mortgage.






The government is also beholden to powerful medical lobbyists and donors: the AMA, Hospital association, Pfizer, etc. So government doesn't want medical costs to go down. That would anger those lobbyists and donors.

The problem in both cases is fundamentally one of corruption, where a wealthy slice of the populace uses unwarranted profits to influence government policy to keep those profits going, and to expand them every year.

The solution has to be a good democratic "immune system" which recognizes and rejects such corruption as harmful. The difficulty is that so many people are in on the housing and medical scams that no one can get elected without supporting the scams.

Maybe the pain of housing and medical costs has to get truly overwhelming and crush the real economy before there can be any structural change.
654   Glock-n-Load   2025 Dec 30, 7:33pm  

Patrick says

“Maybe the pain of housing and medical costs has to get truly overwhelming and crush the real economy before there can be any structural change.”

I think what will happen is fewer and fewer will feed at the trough of fraud (if that’s the right word) as well as fewer and fewer who will be able to afford to feed the fraud.

You see in 3rd world countries where a few have access to anything they want or need while most everyone else eats shit.
655   AD   2025 Dec 30, 10:01pm  

Glock-n-Load says

You see in 3rd world countries where a few have access to anything they want or need while most everyone else eats shit.


True, as it's not sustainable so you get "increasing entropy", which means more and more undergo a decrease in standard of living.

I just hope that there is enough productivity gains and innovation to offset all what is wrong such as widespread fraud and Federal Reserve inflationary policies.
656   Blue   2025 Dec 31, 12:13am  

Sounded like AI generated video!

https://youtu.be/Anfs8Nq9ooU
Kevin O'Leary : 5 States Where Real Estate Will Crash in 2026
@samuelhenery
1:49 (1) California
4:24 (2) New York City metro area
6:39 (3) Illinois specifically, Chicago
8:51 (4) New Jersey
10:55 (5) Massachusetts specifically Boston
@paulgh2560
We strongly believe that Most States that will Collapse are The Democrat States such as California since the idiot Governors are the Corrupt Governors!
@citizenjustice-el9pe
I absolutely agree with this. Not from listening to him. But because I have watched Californians being treated like garbage. I think Oleary is right, but I think AI is part of this video.
@neebinmakwah349
Left Illinois in 2021, super high taxes... Crime ridden and corrupt politicians
657   Misc   2025 Dec 31, 12:20am  

Case/Shiller came out today. Residential home values increased month over month and year over year. They were puny increases on a percentage basis. They are down from the all-time high hit this summer, but the decrease is less than 1%.

For folks just starting out that 1.4% increase year over year would wipe out a good portion of the funds they'd be trying to save up to buy a house. It's about $500 per month increase every month for an average priced house.

The forecasters like Fannie/Freddie. Zillow. Wells Fargo, etc., have price increases pegged at 1.5-2.0% for next year. Sure, it's less than the rate of inflation, but since a house is about 5 times household income, younger folks would need to save about 7-10% of their income just to break even.

.GreaterNYCDude says


But the price levels are not sustainable long term


Based on price to rent models, for California houses, it has always been cheaper to rent than to own since I started visiting this site in 2007...even in the depths of the Housing Crash. I dunno, 18 years seems like a long term to me. Seems like the rest of the country is simply joining in on not being affordable.

Glock-n-Load says


You see in 3rd world countries where a few have access to anything they want or need while most everyone else eats shit.


Homeownership is increasingly hard for those starting out, and next year's forecasts are for no real improvement.

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CSUSHPISA

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