patrick.net

socal2 says

Obviously batteries are still massively expensive, but EV's have way less moving parts and components to wear out. No transmissions, oil changes, brake jobs etc....

Engine and transmission can last 1/4 million miles and 20+ years, especially without government mpg regulation forcing manufacturers into small displacement turbos. No lithium battery can last 20+ years. Brake jobs are necessary on BEV's every year due to rust/sticking thanks to lack of use. "Less moving" is not a good thing when it comes to brakes. The heavy weight of massive battery wears out tires and suspension components faster, and especially wears out public roads fast, which requires asphalt and concrete to repave, both of which generate enormous amount of CO2 in production. What the heck are the refineries supposed to do with gasoline as byproduct in the production of asphalt, synthetic rubber and plastic? Making Molotov Cocktails?

Reality says

No lithium battery can last 20+ years.

We will see. The original Model S's on the road now are about 10 years old and I am not seeing a bunch of reports of major battery degradation yet.

True about the weight of the car and impact on infrastructure. That will get better over time with less batteries/weight as they improve drive train efficiency and energy density. Tesla already uses less batteries than most other EV's in the market and gets better range.

DeficitHawk says

I think people who own a home and have a garage where they can charge, and who also own more than one car for the family (so the other car can be a gas car) can make good use of electric cars.

This is spot on. I appreciate your thoughtful post. You are 100% correct that electric vehicles can make an excellent 2nd vehicle in a large number of households. They can make a great vehicle in a bunch of other circumstances, too.

Unfortunately, electric cars have become a yet another political hot topic. The over-eager government (and certain types of people) pushing electrics are actually creating stubborn resistance. Jumpstarting an industry to get above a point of sufficient quantity can be a useful strategy, but I don't think electric cars need so much push that a whole bunch of people have a bad experience.

https://igorchudov.substack.com/p/europe-abandons-all-electric-car

Europe Abandons All-Electric Car Mandate
Stupidity of "switch to electric" while killing power generation

Igor Chudov
1 hr ago

France24 and the Wall Street Journal (paywall-free link) report that the EU abandoned its much-ballyhooed transition to electric cars, which was supposed to culminate with a total ban on gasoline cars in 2035. ...

The transition was supposed to go on for 13 years after its announcement in 2022 but was abandoned only a year after its adoption. What happened?

Prodded by climate activists, the EU was pressured to ban fossil fuel vehicles and replace them with battery-powered vehicles. The problem is that such a transition is impossible:

Transitioning to electric passenger vehicles will increase electricity demand by 25%.

Transitioning to electric trucks will further raise electricity demand to a total of 40% increase.

EU is phasing out fossil fuel generation and replacing it with unreliable solar and wind generation - thus decreasing power availability instead of increasing it to meet greater demand.

As cars and especially trucks are charged at night, solar and wind power cannot contribute to charging.

Are electric cars more efficient?
Running a gasoline car involves:

Burning gas in the internal combustion engine and converting thermal energy to mechanical energy. That’s it.

Charging an electric car’s battery from the grid and driving the car involves:

Burning gas at the power station and converting thermal energy of gas to mechanical energy of the gas turbine. This is only moderately more efficient in a power station than gasoline cars.

Then, losses begin:

Converting the mechanical energy of the turbine into electrical energy in the generator involves generator losses

Converting medium voltage from the generator into high transmission voltage involves transformer losses

Transmitting the power along the high voltage lines involves transmission losses

Stepping down the voltage in several substations involves transformer losses again

In a home charging station, converting 220v power into DC for car charging again involves conversion losses

A chemical process in the battery being charged heats the battery, involving charging losses

Running the car’s electrical motors from the battery requires inverter losses to generate electricity for traction motors and motor losses.

Take a look at what happens when a driver needs heat in the cab:

Heating a gasoline car in winter involves redirecting waste heat (hot antifreeze) from the engine into the cab heater, thus not requiring additional fuel.

Heating an electric car requires a resistance heater or a heat pump, needing to eventually consume more energy from the grid - with all the above conversion losses included.

Which process (gasoline car vs. electric) is more efficient at converting fuel, burnt directly in the car engine or at distant power stations, into usable energy to propel a car traveling on a highway? The gas engines win outright. ...

The climate change field is full of crooks and is directed by those who recently gave us a non-working and dangerous Covid vaccine.

I do not believe them or their paid scientists any more than I believe the dishonest “Covid science.” ...

Patrick says

https://igorchudov.substack.com/p/europe-abandons-all-electric-car

Europe Abandons All-Electric Car Mandate
Stupidity of "switch to electric" while killing power generation

Igor Chudov
1 hr ago

France24 and the Wall Street Journal (paywall-free link) report that the EU abandoned its much-ballyhooed transition to electric cars, which was supposed to culminate with a total ban on gasoline cars in 2035. ...

The transition was supposed to go on for 13 years after its announcement in 2022 but was abandoned only a year after its adoption. What happened?

Prodded by climate activists, the EU was pressured to ban fossil fuel vehicles and replace them with battery-powered vehicles. The problem is that such a transition is impossible:

Transitioning to electric passenger vehicles will increase electricity d...

Hallelujah, they are finally seeing the light, although they've been covering their eyes for the last 10 years. Electric vehicles are a grift, a scam. Invest in a failed technology, pump it up through propaganda for years, sell, let the bagholders take a bath. Looks like it's bath time..

https://notthebee.com/article/one-tiny-little-detail-they-forgot-to-tell-you-about-those-electric-vehicles

Patrick says

https://notthebee.com/article/one-tiny-little-detail-they-forgot-to-tell-you-about-those-electric-vehicles

That's why insurance for Model 3 is 2x of a similarly priced vehicle. At least it was for me when I priced it against a Jeep.

It's 2x because there is still high demand for ALL Tesla Products.
https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-market-share-q1-2023-cox-automotive/
They made a price reduction recently to get M3 and MY below the Federal Rebate limit. Now is the time to buy. I've been saving about 2/3 of my gas costs using electric fuel. I'm in NorCal, and I pay the highest gas and electricity costs nationwide, I believe.
Also, I had a rear-ender and didn't have to replace my battery. It's the usual, nonsense hype. Also the hype about "You'll have to replace your battery and it'll cost you a fortune!!" is overblown.
https://www.recurrentauto.com/research/how-long-do-ev-batteries-last

rocketjoe79 says

It's 2x because there is still high demand for ALL Tesla Products.

I can see why high demand would increase the price of the Tesla, but why would high demand double the insurance cost?

HeadSet says

rocketjoe79 says

It's 2x because there is still high demand for ALL Tesla Products.

I can see why high demand would increase the price of the Tesla, but why would high demand double the insurance cost?

Insurance Companies have trouble evaluating Cost-of-repair for new tech vehicles. Also, you have very few Aftermarket parts available for Tesla. This is one of the reasons Tesla Insurance was started (along with making money, of course.) Tesla gets data on each collision, and they know the cost of repairs. This should drive down costs and allow them to make future vehicles safer, cheaper and quicker to repair.

Wait till states start charging disposal fees for EVs. That'll freak the Greenies out.

Clearly, automobiles for personal use will be banned, replaced by a state Uber service. You will own nothing….

Al_Sharpton_for_President says

Clearly, automobiles for personal use will be banned, replaced by a state Uber service. You will own nothing….

Yeah wait until your drop off at the mall or place of employment takes over 20 minutes at peak times. Because there's a queue of cars that stretch all the way back out to the highway, creating congesting even for the EVs still on the highway.
If every ride is a point to point only. Then you wont get to your destination and park in a parking spot. You will be dropped off at the door.
What a fucking pain in the ass. I imagine you will be ticketed for being impatient and jumping out before the designated drop off. That's if the EV will have the doors unlocked so you can.

With facial recognition, imagine getting in a car. Then if there's a warrant out for your arrest, the car locks you in, and notifies the police.

The fucking Commies that be, really want the world to be a very bad 90's SciFi dystopic movie.

Al_Sharpton_for_President says

Clearly, automobiles for personal use will be banned, replaced by a state Uber service. You will own nothing….

But travel will only be allowed if you are “up to date “ on your jabs and haven’t mispronouned anyone or hurt their feelz.

Could be fake, but funny anyway.

Patrick says

Fat chance: if the popo didn't first witness the act of speeding and then didn't measure the speed using a certified device he can go and fly a kite, pound sand or fuck himself (his choice).

But Tesla will punish you for speeding by increasing your rate if you buy insurance from them.

Patrick says

More likely the car will not allow you to speed in the first place. But then again, tickets are a source of revenue.

RWSGFY says

Fat chance: if the popo didn't first witness the act of speeding and then didn't measure the speed using a certified device he can go and fly a kite, pound sand or fuck himself (his choice).

The precedence has already been set with red light cameras and speed cameras.

HeadSet says

RWSGFY says

Fat chance: if the popo didn't first witness the act of speeding and then didn't measure the speed using a certified device he can go and fly a kite, pound sand or fuck himself (his choice).

The precedence has already been set with red light cameras and speed cameras.

Yes, it was: red light cameras have been deemed illegal and ordered to be removed in CA.

https://www.globalresearch.ca/europe-abandons-all-electric-car-mandate/5814038

Europe Abandons All-Electric Car Mandate.

RWSGFY says

Patrick says

Fat chance: if the popo didn't first witness the act of speeding and then didn't measure the speed using a certified device he can go and fly a kite, pound sand or fuck himself (his choice).

But Tesla will punish you for speeding by increasing your rate if you buy insurance from them.

some places have license plate readers and cameras… auto tickets

Patrick says

Well, i hear there are still 20,000 Model A Fords still on the road.

HeadSet says

More likely the car will not allow you to speed in the first place. But then again, tickets are a source of revenue.

I don't think cops want to deal with people anymore honestly. A traffic stop is a pain in the ass for everyone. So I think they are enforcing less, at least around me. Plus why get in a situation over something minor and potentially have a gun pulled on you as a cop AND you shoot the perp and YOU go to jail.

This why I keep saying get out of cities. They don't want to patrol. I know 2 Chicago cops well. I think at 45 they can get their pension and work for another police department. They want out. Bad. Cities will become more lawless. No doubt.

Climate Expert: Gas Car Cancellation Is Intended to End Private Transport

https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/catherinesalgado/2023/07/15/climate-expert-gas-car-cancellation-is-intended-to-end-private-transport-n1710930

Booger says

Gas Car Cancellation Is Intended to End Private Transport

I called that long ago. Private cars will be for the very rich and the politicians as the rest of us will be on shared right style buses and vans. Also, I notice we do not hear much anymore about self-drive and aerial taxis.

HeadSet says

Patrick says

Well, i hear there are still 20,000 Model A Fords still on the road.

you can’t. government mandates a lot of it

https://www.coffeeandcovid.com/p/indigenous-american-giving-monday/comment/22337511

tritorch
Writes Out Here On the Perimeter
7 hrs ago
Regarding E-Cars, here is why they want everyone in one:

Electric cars have kill switches and real time tracking of everything you do in them and they record everywhere you go. They can also be hijacked remotely by a lender or government, and programmed to keep you within your fifteen minute city.

Want to drive your car today? I'm sorry your social credit score isn't high enough, your carbon footprint has exceeded your daily limit, and your vaccination status is not up to date. Check back next week.

Patrick says

Electric cars have kill switches and real time tracking of everything you do in them and they record everywhere you go

No need for it to be electric for all that crap to be in it.

FortwayeAsFuckJoeBiden says

HeadSet says

Patrick says

Well, i hear there are still 20,000 Model A Fords still on the road.

you can’t. government mandates a lot of it

You can build a Model A from spare parts (all of which are readily avaiable) as an individual and register it as a kit car even in CA.

True. I've read that most new cars have GPS tracking whether you want it or not.

https://www.techwalla.com/articles/how-to-disable-the-gps-locator-in-a-car

https://notthebee.com/article/a-huge-percentage-of-electric-vehicle-owners-are-defecting-and-going-back-to-internal-combustion-cars

Is our honeymoon with the electric vehicle finally over? A study found that one in five early adopters of EV cars and trucks are returning to gas-powered vehicles. As a result, used EV prices are freefalling.

The Journal Nature published a study revealing that of the folks who were early adopters of EVs in California (between 2012 and 2018), 20% of [plug-in hybrid] drivers have returned to fully gas-powered vehicles and 18% of full EV drivers returned to gas-powered - with their subsequent vehicle purchase. ...

Dude got into a fender-bender in his Rivian. Insurance offered $1,600. The repair bill was $42,000.

I've said it before and I'll say it again: I just feel like there's some stuff they're not telling us about these electric cars...

And just last weekend, my wife's cousin was saying how hard it was to use her EV to get from Los Gatos to Half Moon Bay, because there is a big hill in the way, and how expensive repairs are on it. Can't remember what car it was, not a Tesla.

Patrick says

As a result, used EV prices are freefalling.

Don't buy one!!!!

The battery pack has a limited lifespan, and that's like 1/2 the cost of the vehicle.

Patrick says

Dude got into a fender-bender in his Rivian. Insurance offered $1,600. The repair bill was $42,000.

If you get into a minor accident in an EV, you MAY have damaged the battery pack, and if you have, it's basically a bomb. Even minor accidents, for safety reasons, need the entire battery pack to be replaced.

EV's kind of remind me of thin clients. They try to bring that back every few years too. I think we're on the verge of abandoning all this Green Energy nonsense as people are starting to recognize that although PERHAPS IN THE FUTURE, it might be viable, we're not there yet.

richwicks says

The battery pack has a limited lifespan

Interesting. There is a cab company in AZ that runs a fleet of 200 Prius cabs and has done so for more than 15 years. They put over 300,000 miles on them before removing them but have kept a few around for 10 years with much more mileage. The Prius is a hybrid, but the battery is still constantly charged and discharged. It seems the all electric car's battery would hold up as well.

HeadSet says

Interesting. There is a cab company in AZ that runs a fleet of 200 Prius cabs and has done so for more than 15 years. They put over 300,000 miles on them before removing them but have kept a few around for 10 years with much more mileage. The Prius is a hybrid, but the battery is still constantly charged and discharged. It seems the all electric car's battery would hold up as well.

It's not quite the same. A hybrid only activates the battery for acceleration and breaking.

Batteries have a limited lifespan because of dendrites. As you recharge a battery, you end up with little tendrils of metal from the cathode, when it touches the anode, the battery is dead, or at least that cell of the battery is dead. It's a short.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EWsR44dmbBs

That does a pretty good explanation of it.

I have no idea how big the Prius battery is or if it's replaceable. 1/2 the cost of an EV is just the battery pack.

Electric cars are the bomb. Doesn't everybody feel clean and green driving around in a remote controlled bomb?

All green measures are designed to fail. They are the Globalist Satanic Inversion Lie of sustainablity, they are the exact opposite. They don't want us sustained, they want us dead or enslaved to their crumbs.

Get rid of the shit that works, get corruptocrats to impose green measures, dismantle the infrastructure that could be relied upon, bake and wait for the desperate, helpless population.