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Tenpoundbass
2012 May 16, 6:07am
But an idiot with so much of an ego that he can never learn from others?
Knowing is half the battle Marcus, you'll come around.
Tenpoundbass
2012 May 16, 6:11am
Delicious stews can be made from the cheapest of meats.
Stew meat is $7.00 a pack, that's the problem you and queen clueless can't seem to grasp.
Hey I'm griping because more of my money is going to the food bill, but I know people that feeds their kids $1.00 cans of generic spagetti-o's on a nightly basis, they buy at the dollar store, and not because they think that shit is delicious. And god knows how the stores acquired that, surplus and reclaimed perhaps?
This discussion is all bs. Eating healthy isn't that hard. Eat a little of everything, eat seasonal, don't eat processed foods. It can be done at the same cost or even lower than unhealthy diets. My family does it. Anyone can do it. It's not hard to pick up breakfast cereal with no sugars like shredded wheat, oatmeal, or cheerios (a very tiny amount of sugar) that actually cost less then the ones that are basically all sugar. It's not hard to buy the vegetables that are in season and cheap. Orange veggies like pumpkin, carrots, sweet potatoes are dirt cheap almost all year round. Delicious stews can be made from the cheapest of meats. People just don't bother.
it's complicated because of peoples emotional attachments to their foods. For instance, you suggested a bowl of shredded wheat cereal for breakfast, with i would assume some milk. Shredded wheat has 40g of carb per serving and 8 oz of milk has 12g, so if you have the constraint to eat just the single portion size of cereal with milk, you are at 50g of carbs for your breakfast and you've eaten nothing of nutritional sustenance.
Ever hear of a little thing called GENETICS moron! Sorry, but some people are pre-disposed to have large rears. It's called "body type". Could she slim it down some.. sure, but she will never have the rear of a waif asian model.
And even if she could get that "waif asian model" look you think she should have.. She would have to do 100x the workouts and have some surgery to pump out some ass meat... Then maintaining it would be 100x more difficult than someone pre-disposed to have a small rear.
Once again, genetics... It's tantamount to telling a mentally retarded person that they can be a surgeon if they just put their minds to it!
i think you misread what i posted. i wasn't implying about her figure, rather her as a figure head. The first lady, is the face of the fedgov, especially when she takes it upon herself to speak out against the western diet and our collective poor health. She has the ability to do more for our national health then her husband and his forcing working people to buy insurance products
that would take her speaking out against the science from Harvard school of medicine that led the western diet down this deadly anti fat path for the last four decades+. The science is in, she is correct that people ought drink water, no sugar, and dance/move around more. excellent advice. However, when parlayed with the USDA/FDA food pyramid, they have to admit they were misinforming people and that their suggested diet gives people diabetes
i think you misread what i posted.
Sorry, for the mis-directed vitriol.. It was meant to be directed toward clambo's ignorant and racist statement below...
Taking diet advice from thunderthighs "let them eat paella" queen Michelle is as dumb as voting for her husband.
I'm gonna get up and dance, scream, and set off explosives when Obama is thrown out in November.
When I cash out a few of my AAPL shares in 10 years, I won't be hanging with any haggety women who look like Patrick Ewing in drag either.
no problem, the last thing we need is politicians playing more politics with the health of the citizenry. they don't call diabetes an emidemic for the fun of it, by far the most burdensome cost that 'we' could control as a citizenry in our health care, is our personal nutrition. to blame obesity and diabetes on genetics is being dishonest. it is absolutely a matter of carbohydrate (sugar) intake, that causes insulin resistance, hormones regulate fat storage, the old adage of take in less calories and burn more via exercise is obviously an fail of epic proportions
Tenpoundbass
2012 May 16, 9:27am
Are you guys listening to errc?
This is the truth, but all you dots can do is go in Liberal defense mode and defend the whole damn fallacy.
Get up marcus and let errc sit at the front of the class.
leo707
2012 May 16, 10:07am
The government subsidizes HFCS to high hell, every last aspect of it. The land, the petro fertilizers, tariffs on alternatives, subsidies for ethanol, the list is a mile long.
Yep, the totally do. If you go to open secrets you may notice that the larger the political donations from a food industry the lager the subsidy. Publicly funded elections and removing big money from government would probably go a long way to solve this issue, but that is unlikely to happen.
However, when parlayed with the USDA/FDA food pyramid, they have to admit they were misinforming people and that their suggested diet gives people diabetes
They no longer suggest that diet, the "pyramid" is obsolete it is now the "plate". You may find it more to your liking.
never saw that plate before. that looks more confusing and equally as unhealthy, glad to see they solved that problem. seriously what the hell is that even supposed to suggest?
what nutritional purpose do grains and dairy serve?
where's the fat?
fat is brain food, we need our fats, fat is good for you
leo707
2012 May 16, 10:48am
never saw that plate before.
seriously what the hell is that even supposed to suggest?
The rough per portions of what one should be eating.
what nutritional purpose do grains
http://www.choosemyplate.gov/food-groups/grains-why.html
and dairy serve?
http://www.choosemyplate.gov/food-groups/dairy-why.html
where's the fat?
fat is brain food, we need our fats, fat is good for you
Myplate.gove agrees with you.
http://www.choosemyplate.gov/food-groups/oils-why.html
CBOEtrader
2012 May 16, 11:22am
Yeah that's why when congress "Threats" to stop speculators the market tanks, as the speculators pull their feet out of the water.
Cause and effect and all that, if it doesn't taste like chilli, then it probably isn't.
Show me the cause and resulting effect.
I assume you are talking about a regulatory agency or exchange changing their margin rules (like the CME after the silver futures went to 50)-- which is manipulation by those powerful enough to capture the regulatory agencies.
There are major issues with the financial business, but the media neither knows nor cares about the real problems. They prefer to blame the "speculators."
Case in point... look at black olympic athletes... football players, sprinters ect... There asses are huge...Would you call them out of shape?
I played football through college. There was a time in high school when I wouldn't touch processed sugar or most fats, worked out daily, etc... My bodyfat % was around 8% (many athletes are better, but thats great compared to general public), I weighed 230 and measured 6'2''.
I went to get a routine physical, was told that I was borderline obese by the silly height/weight scale doctors still use. The doctor almost laughed when he told me, then explained why those numbers were nonsense, and explained that most pro football players would be considered fat on this scale.
Would've been nice to hear that understanding tone as a husky child. Every doctor I ever went to told me I was fat.
Tenpoundbass
2012 May 16, 11:56pm
Let's see you got your collard greens with bacon, corn rice and mashed potatos, Pork Ribs, chicken and sausage, apple cobbler and a bigass glass of Milk, which comes in handy to pour the milk out then pour the contents of your 40 into it.
And it doesn't say how many trips to the shindig buffet you can make.
Yup its the ghettomyriad.
Let's see you got your collard greens with bacon, corn rice and mashed potatos, Pork Ribs, chicken and sausage, apple cobbler and a bigass glass of Milk, which comes in handy to pour the milk out then pour the contents of your 40 into it.
And it doesn't say how many trips to the shindig buffet you can make.
Yup its the ghettomyriad.
This shit is DELICOUS and how I plan to eat every day once the mothership beams me up.
leo707
2012 May 17, 2:37am
I went to get a routine physical, was told that I was borderline obese by the silly height/weight scale doctors still use. The doctor almost laughed when he told me, then explained why those numbers were nonsense
Yeah, when looking at an individual those BMI numbers don't mean a lot. As you well know there are a lot better ways to determine heath, but none as cheap as just taking height and weight measurements.
it's complicated because of peoples emotional attachments to their foods. For instance, you suggested a bowl of shredded wheat cereal for breakfast, with i would assume some milk. Shredded wheat has 40g of carb per serving and 8 oz of milk has 12g, so if you have the constraint to eat just the single portion size of cereal with milk, you are at 50g of carbs for your breakfast and you've eaten nothing of nutritional sustenance.
I didn't just suggest it, I eat it as well as corn flakes, cheerios, oatmeal, or just a bowl of cut up fruit. Ham and eggs or pancakes dripping with maple syrup and butter sometimes too. Did you miss the part where I said eat a little of everything?
What's with the fixation on carbs? Are you an atkins fanatic? Milk has no nutritional sustenance? That's news. What about Proteins? Dietary fibre? Amino acids? Vitamins, Minerals. There is more to eating than carbs. One portion is two biscuts which is a pretty good sized chunk of food that shouldn't present any kind of constraint to anyone not used to supersize mcd's portions.
Fit day considers shredded wheat just fine as well as cornflakes which have a little sugar.
So what is your daily breakfast with nutritional sustenance, low calories, low sugar, low fat?
leo707
2012 May 17, 9:22am
errc, what is racist in my post?
Your vitriol has been misdirected, I believe that BoomAndBust called your comment racist.
bob2356 says
Delicious stews can be made from the cheapest of meats.
Stew meat is $7.00 a pack, that's the problem you and queen clueless can't seem to grasp.
Hey I'm griping because more of my money is going to the food bill
So don't buy it in the pack. Buy a cheap roast on sale and cut it up. This isn't rocket science. Last time I was in the states in Feb I bought a 3 lb roast for $2.75 a pound, about $5.00 worth of veggies made stew over noodles and fed 6 people twice with some still left over. Buy with the season.
If you really want to gripe come visit me in NZ. Food is at least twice (or more, sometimes a lot more depending on the item) as expensive as the US, variety is limited, and you really have to eat seasonal. If it's out of season you just don't get it, period. To add insult to injury I can buy NZ lamb cheaper in the US and Europe than at my local supermarket in NZ.
KILLERJANE
2012 May 17, 11:07pm
I don't eat breakfast. I am not a farmer. I eat when I get hungry, usually by 2pm. Breakfast pushing is for farmers.
Get up at 5 am or sunrise and work the crops while it's cool out, come back to house a couple hours later with an appetite and eat a hearty meal, go back to work the crops.
Bob, I'm not certain the details of atkins, I think that diet zeros out carbs and then slowly reintroduces them back into the diet, so now, I am not a fanatic of what that dead man was selling. The "fixation" is on sugars, because as we've all always known, sugar has adverse effects on the human body.
I frequent with a "ketogenic" type of 'diet', however, I eat to live and will eat whatever I darn well please, on occasion. My usuual breakfast consists of a large glass of water, 3 eggs and a heavy 1/3lb of bacon. Sometimes I make omelettes with veggies, sometimes eat ham steak or beef steak or sausage with my eggs. Today, I had to be out the door by 530 so I picked a quart of strawberries from the garden and ate them
Grains and carbs make people sick. Some show it by bloating up with fat. Because we know fat storage is regulated by hormones (insulin), regular carbohydrate consumption makes the body insulin resistant, and the screws with the bodys fat storage mechanisms. Men get beer guts, tits and love handles, women get a fat ass, hips and thighs. Some people don't show the sickness by getting fat, however studies have shown that skinny fat people, suffer just as bad, if not worse from the carb intake. It manifests in hypertension and any type of heart disease, among other illness
This is why I am critical of the first ladys efforts. What she says is true and sage advice, however we have generations of good little statist sheeple that were brought up in the public instruction system, and they were taught to be good little obedient citizens, to eat according to the old food pyramid, whichc is toxic. She should lead the discussion on burying that old hat and usher in the new, more honest science
Of course, this means laying fault and criticism on harvard school of medicine and the government. I doubt she has the balls,,,
leo707
2012 May 18, 4:33am
more honest science
Could you please cite some of this honest science that shows:
Grains and carbs make people sick.
I have heard a few theories in this regard, but I have never seen convincing evidence that this is the case. I don't think that the first lady is intentionally trying to mislead people to eat unhealthy.
I frequent with a "ketogenic" type of 'diet'
Are you epileptic? Having no idea what it was a quick search indicates that this diet is a treatment for epilepsy.
Studies do seem to show that it does in fact reduce seizures, but it is also not a "healthy" diet. There are side effects.
errc says
I frequent with a "ketogenic" type of 'diet'
Are you epileptic? Having no idea what it was a quick search indicates that this diet is a treatment for epilepsy.
Studies do seem to show that it does in fact reduce seizures, but it is also not a "healthy" diet. There are side effects.
Ketogenic diet is very close to Atkins. A modified Atkins has also been used for treating epileptics with success. I don't think it's a very healthy diet. People that use it for epilepsy are monitored carefully because of possible side effects. But everyone to their own. You can certainly get fat on any diet if you overeat. The only thing that matters is calories.
errc says
Grains and carbs make people sick.
I have heard a few theories in this regard, but I have never seen convincing evidence that this is the case. I don't think that the first lady is intentionally trying to mislead people to eat unhealthy.
There has never been any creditable research that says carbs in moderate amounts or even some occasional sugar makes anyone sick. You can have allergies to foods containing carbs, but you can have allergies to foods that don't. You get diabetes from being overweight, no matter what you ate to get that way.
I personally like the chocolate diet. I'm concerned, however, that dietary expert, Michelle oBAm A will soon call for a ban on all chocolate manufacturing in Ameicia.
That, of course, will kill jobs in America and drive more American companies offshore. Don't you just HATE those greedy capitalists?
more honest science
Could you please cite some of this honest science that shows:
Grains and carbs make people sick.
I have heard a few theories in this regard, but I have never seen convincing evidence that this is the case. I don't think that the first lady is intentionally trying to mislead people to eat unhealthy.
I frequent with a "ketogenic" type of 'diet'
Are you epileptic? Having no idea what it was a quick search indicates that this diet is a treatment for epilepsy.
Studies do seem to show that it does in fact reduce seizures, but it is also not a "healthy" diet. There are side effects.
the web is filled with information. try google.com, if you are truly interested. Gary Taubes wrote two books that contain a nice summary of much of the research
[url]http://www.preventdisease.com/news/12/030112_World-Renown-Heart-Surgeon-Speaks-Out-On-What-Really-Causes-Heart-Disease.shtml[/url]
The long-established dietary recommendations have created epidemics of obesity and diabetes, the consequences of which dwarf any historical plague in terms of mortality, human suffering and dire economic consequences.
The rest of us have simply followed the recommended mainstream dietthat is low in fat and high in polyunsaturated fats and carbohydrates, not knowing we were causing repeated injury to our blood vessels. Thisrepeated injury creates chronic inflammation leading to heart disease, stroke, diabetes and obesity.
Let me repeat that: The injury and inflammation in our blood vessels is caused by the low fat diet recommended for years by mainstream medicine.
What are the biggest culprits of chronic inflammation? Quite simply, they are the overload of simple, highly processed carbohydrates (sugar, flour and all the products made from them) and the excess consumption of omega-6 vegetable oils like soybean, corn and sunflower that are found in many processed foods.
Take a moment to visualize rubbing a stiff brush repeatedly over soft skin until it becomes quite red and nearly bleeding. you kept this up several times a day, every day for five years. If you could tolerate this painful brushing, you would have a bleeding, swollen infected area that became worse with each repeated injury. This is a good way to visualize the inflammatory process that could be going on in your body right now.
Ketogenic diet is very close to Atkins. A modified Atkins has also been used for treating epileptics with success. I don't think it's a very healthy diet. People that use it for epilepsy are monitored carefully because of possible side effects. But everyone to their own. You can certainly get fat on any diet if you overeat. The only thing that matters is calories.
calories don't really matter much if at all, from a quantity stand point. As to the quality of those calories, that is all that matters, in that so long as they are carbs, you can eat as many as your heart desires
as to a 'ketogenic' diet being dangerous, not sure where you guys are getting your information.
The brain gets its energy from ketone bodies when insufficient glucose is available. After blood glucose is lowered for 3 days, the brain gets 30% of its energy from ketone bodies. After 40 days, this goes up to 70% (during the initial stages the brain does not burn ketones, since they are an important substrate for lipid synthesis in the brain). In time the brain reduces its glucose requirements from 120g to 40g per day.
Ketones have been described as "magic" in their ability to increase metabolic efficiency, while decreasing production of free radicals, the damaging byproducts of normal metabolism. The heart and brain operate 25% more efficiently using ketones as a source of energy
ever wonder why human brain size has shrunk along side the advent of the western diet? because a diet rich in carbs is anathema to brain health.
Science, shmience, we can debate this all day, doesn't matter. Since most are emotionally invested in having someone tell them that eating their western diet is ok, they don't want to hear the truth. The best science experiment you can conduct, is one you do on yourself. Do an elimination diet. Enjoy ketosis for yourself for a couple months, your brain and body will thank you and you'll never argue on behalf of the western diet again.
understand that the government and their institutions are the reason you think the way you do, about nutrition. The info has always been there, however Harvard wanted to be the spokesperson on diet/obesity/nutrition for the past sixty years, they have led the disinformation campaign, and the government followed suit, and look around you, at where that has led us. Fat, Sick, and nearly dead.
carbs make you sick
your government forces your hand to the carb plate
not sure why the hyperlink didn't work, but it's a good read
as is this
leo707
2012 May 22, 2:46am
as to a 'ketogenic' diet being dangerous, not sure where you guys are getting your information
The web is filled with information, try google.com.
carbs make you sick
Doing quick searches on Gary Taubes, etc. it is refined carbs that he seems to take issue with, complex carbs are a different story.
I remember a few year back during that Atkins fad doing some research into the no-carb diet. At that time I chose to greatly reduce the refined carbs in my diet, and replace them with whole grains.
The long-established dietary recommendations have created epidemics of obesity and diabetes, the consequences of which dwarf any historical plague in terms of mortality, human suffering and dire economic consequences.
Yep, it has, but the long-established dietary recommendations have changed quite a bit from what I grew up with.
Science, shmience, we can debate this all day, doesn't matter.
Thanks for the links. I will look into it more when I have time.
Thank you errc!
As someone that lost 30lbs and feels way better going Keto - you're spot on.
calories don't really matter much if at all, from a quantity stand point. As to the quality of those calories, that is all that matters, in that so long as they are carbs, you can eat as many as your heart desires
I think you meant aren't carbs. If you take in more calories that you burn then you will gain weight no matter where the calories come from. That's a simple fact. The biggest reason people lose weight when going to a low carb regime is that they got fat from eating totally randomly and are actually checking portions and eating in a regulated fashion to follow the low carb regime.
I don't think Atkins is dangerous, I just think it's much healthier to eat a balance of all different types of foods. I agree with leo, it's refined sugar and carbs that are the problem.
If you take in more calories that you burn then you will gain weight no matter where the calories come from. That's a simple fact.
That says nothing as to WHY you take in more calories than you burn. The problem is that carbohydrates are UNIQUELY fattening. It is in their very makeup and the response they cause your body to have, which causes the intake of more calories (for many people - not all).
It is actually VERY difficult to take in too many calories of fat/protein alone, in the absence of carbohydrates. This effect is even more pronounced in people that are already overweight - without carbohydrates stimulating the appetite, fat and protein leads to faster feelings of "fullness". I can attest to the fact that when you're in ketosis, it is very, very hard to overeat. You don't need to check portions at all. In fact, you often have to force yourself to eat, because you are often NOT hungry when your body is deriving most of it's fuel from stored body fat.
leo707
2012 May 22, 6:35am
The problem is that carbohydrates are UNIQUELY fattening. It is in their very makeup and the response they cause your body to have, which causes the intake of more calories (for many people - not all).
This is true only for refined carbs and yes it is a health issue that we do not take seriously enough in the US.
Yes, thank you bob. I meant that the quantity of calories doesn't matter so long as they aren't carby.
Now as to your assertion, that people get fat because of a caloric glut, you are wrong. But you're not alone!, we were all taught that it was simple physics. If/when you take in more calories then you burn off, you pack on fat. That's not how the body works
The body regulates fat storage via hormones (insulin). Carbohydrates distort the feedback loop between the liver and the pancreas (insulin resistance). This causes systemic dysfunction, and the body cannot properly regulate fat storage, because the carb eater is improperly fueling their body, and we end up with the obesity/diabetes/hypertension/heart disease etc epidemic we find ourselves in today.
Your eat less exercise more means of weight loss is a failure. I tell people that want to lose (fat) weight, to eat MORE and exercise LESS. Just make sure they are zero'ing out their carbs. Eat animal proteins high in fats, and other healthy fatty foods (salmon, avacado), because fat consumption is very satiating, healthy, and carb-less. It keeps people from feeling hungry. Exercising isn't a succesful means of losing fat, because it makes us hungry.
If you want to lose a couple extra pounds for the summer, give it a try. Eat a half lb of bacon with eggs for bfast,,,spinach salad with chicken and blue cheese for lunch, and a fatty 20oz ribeye with some solid marbeling and some veggies for supper. Drink only water. The first thing that happens is you lose about 8lbs in 48 hours, as your body realizes its not getting anymore carbs, so it purges the unnecessary gallon of water that carb eaters carry around with them. Makes you feel good to relieve yourself of that lifetime of bloat! Within 15 days of eating like that, you could expect to lose 15lbs, half being that water weight, the other half being fat burn off as your body enters ketosis and utilizes those fat stores for energy. Most people report instantly better eye sight as well, once detoxing from sugar, along with constantly higher levels of energy
This is true only for refined carbs
Depends on the person. For some people, the insulin spike from ALL carbohydrates cause excess fat storage and inflammation.
If you want to lose a couple extra pounds for the summer, give it a try. Eat a half lb of bacon with eggs for bfast,,,spinach salad with chicken and blue cheese for lunch, and a fatty 20oz ribeye with some solid marbeling and some veggies for supper. Drink only water. The first thing that happens is you lose about 8lbs in 48 hours, as your body realizes its not getting anymore carbs, so it purges the unnecessary gallon of water that carb eaters carry around with them. Makes you feel good to relieve yourself of that lifetime of bloat! Within 15 days of eating like that, you could expect to lose 15lbs, half being that water weight, the other half being fat burn off as your body enters ketosis and utilizes those fat stores for energy. Most people report instantly better eye sight as well, once detoxing from sugar, along with constantly higher levels of energy
I had the exact results. It really works. It is pretty crazy, but it works.
Gary taubes has written a couple books that compile all the studies and sort the shit science (think what the usfedgov and elitist ivy league schools sell you on) from the good science.
Good Calories, Bad Calories was the earlier version, it is lengthy and filled with the technical jargon, if that's more your cup of tea (about 500 pages)
Why We Get Fat and What to Do About it is the most recent book. Reads so easy you can (and should) share it with your 2nd grader. Less then 200pgs, straight and to the point. Can read it in 8 hours and debunk a lifetime of bad science and misinformation
Be warned, you will rightfully be (even more) mad at the gubmint for sticking their stupid nose into your personal life and causing more damage to the citizenry then 1000 al quedas ever could dream. If you think that is bad, wait until you find out about marijuanas health benefits,,,as an anti-inflammatory, and as a stand alone super food.
Now as to your assertion, that people get fat because of a caloric glut, you are wrong.
Of course you can get fat without carbs. Consume enough calories and you will get fat. BTW spinach and blue cheese both contain carbs. All plants, fruits, and vegetables contain carbs except mushrooms I believe. Some more, some less. Some veggies have as much carbs as some whole grain breads. Same deal with sugar. The only thing you can eat that totally lacks carbs are eggs, unprocessed meat, and natural unprocessed oils. If Gary Taubes says otherwise then I would stop using his material.
I think the words you are desperately searching for is processed carbs and processed sugars. Large quantities of these are not good I fully agree.
Seems to me that the logical question for this debate is how asians manage to eat a very high carb diet (but almost no processed carbs) and somehow manage to avoid the "obesity/diabetes/hypertension/heart disease etc epidemic we find ourselves in today.". Any explanation?
how does your body differentiate between sugars? A sugar, is a sugar, is a sugar, once you put it in your mouth.
i know full well the difference between simple and complex carbohydrates. Spinach and blue cheese don't really contain carbs, they both contain 1g or less of carbohydrate per serving, so they contain carb (no s) :).
Carbs that come from fiber soluble foods, are usually not problematic, like the ones we get from vegetables like spinach, thats why people that understand how the body works look for NET carbs in foods.
As to your loaded with assumptions logical question, there are many reasons. First, millet has been more a staple to the asian diet than rice over the course of modern history. Millet glycemic index is 25 while rice is 65. However, rice is still much less unhealthy then wheat for the sake of comparing the asian diet to the western diet. western diet is based on wheat which brings in gluten, which white rice doesn't have. Asians also eat plenty of seafood, vegetables, and fatty oils. Not to mention, asians are inherently more insulin sensitive because they move around more then western dieters, even if it's just walking
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The first lady says to those moms that are on a budget...
"There's a lot of healthy choices, eliminate sugar in those drinks. Drink water, and get up and dance. Dance to Beonce."
I'm still waiting for those healthy edible choices. We've got sugar covered, no one can afford it chief, we've been doing with out sugar for a while. And fresh produce and meats too. I guess we're not dancing hard enough.