patrick.net

Why are you so concerned with hope and change?

Go start a business, work hard like other American have done and do well in life.

Stop your obsessing over something that really won't effect you in any way. You don't need to worry about others, you're sarcastic remarks about welfare, and government intervention show that you're not interested in their health, you're only obsessed about trying to get little scraps like them.

Employees and welfare recipiets aren't where you find the American dream. You find a basic existence. Go show us you're hardworking and capable, start a business and stop complaining. You can't even stop obsessing over getting things for free, you want a business idea as well!

I get the impression that you are completely incompetent, barely making more than people receiving welfare. Well, go find something better to do, and make the American dream come true. It won't start with "Give me free ideas and business training! I need it all for free!"

You're sweet, facts just don't matter do they?

PS: Dear Leader, thank you for taking so many vacations

Obama vacation days
http://www.factcheck.org/2010/01/president-obamas-vacation-days/

and

Reagan insider: 'GOP destroyed U.S. economy'
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/reagan-insider-gop-destroyed-us-economy-2010-08-10

and

The vast majority of small-business owners would see no change, and many would get a cut.
http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/mccains_small-business_bunk.html

and

Report shows bailouts, stimulus helped economy
http://www.istockanalyst.com/article/viewiStockNews/articleid/4369009

and

Gallup poll is that 60 percent of Americans "favor additional government spending to create jobs and stimulate the economy."
http://voices.washingtonpost.com/ezra-klein/2010/06/gallup_poll_americans_favor_mo.html

All that took me three minutes to source. Honestly, why do you even bother? Does it make you feel good? Possibly even make you giggle to post nonsense?

And I'm still waiting to hear a response to your nonsense points on the Flippers post...

pkennedy says

You’re sitting in a country that has the most potential for an entrepreneur and yet all you do is find issues why you can’t do it.

Your statement is debateable. If the entrepreneur is starting from nothing, you might be right--mostly due to the vastness of our economy. If the proprietor has capital, I can guarantee you that the US is far from the best place to start a business. Regradless, the overwhelming majority of entrepreneurs go broke...in any country. You are obviously badgering, for no other reason that to be a jerk.

RayAmerica says

OK … let’s say I should start a business. Any suggestions? Can I get some Obama Money for my new business?

Yes. Working government loopholes has become the American business-person's focus, above most other issues. It is an unfortuante fact, that running a business has become more about working the hodge podge regulatory, legal, and subsidy systems rather than creating real value.

More people with problems results in more government involvement results in more value being siphoned off by the well-connected results in more people with problems results in more government involvement... Our economy is doomed if we don't get out of this positive feedback loop.

Hardly. The number of business not related to the government is massive. There are of course lots that rely on the government for business.

Look at every clothing store, restaurants, car dealership, muffler shop, gas station, etc. There are probably 100-200 businesses for every one that relies on the government.

It's possible to moan and complain about the government and the state of business, but it's also very realistic to start your own business and do very well.

Business can be started with little to no working capital if you're willing to work your ass off and make it happen.

He might fail at running a business even if he works hard, but I guarantee if he does nothing he will fail.

If the loan is repaid, then the asset value will never truly matter, it only comes into play if they need to take back the asset and sell it off.

If the person repays the loan for another 12-15 years, chances are the principal repayment + house value will more than make up the outstanding loan amount.

The ability of many of these people to pay isn't the problem, it's the wisdom of people continuing to pay, that is the problem. The solution above isn't great but it helps the banks and helps the home owner. It keeps the bank solvent while creating a solution for the home owner which is fairly favorable. In essence they're taking a 200K write down.

I'm telling you, folks, Japan for the next 20 years is just what hardworking, diligent, competent, thrifty Americans need, particularly the under-40 generation. Slightly higher unemployment (no make-work jobs for incompetents), lower real estate prices (everything becomes affordable), mild deflation (allows the young to save their money to buy that RE). This is infinitely better than the semi-hyper inflation that Bernanke and his cronies seem determined to destroy US savers with.

"Lost Icosade: USA" -- bring it on!

pkennedy says

Look at every clothing store, restaurants, car dealership, muffler shop, gas station, etc. There are probably 100-200 businesses for every one that relies on the government.

Not every business relies on subsidies, sure. However, the revenues of every business is beholden to US taxcode and US regulations--even foreign corporations. These just so happen to be enormous limitations, and often serve as barriers to entry allowing the established to entrench themselves in power and profits.

I have been a small business owner for 6 years. The largest chunk of our revenues by a factor of ten, goes to some government organization. Eliminating the employment tax alone would allow my company to have 5 times as many employees.

The government, the feel-good egaliatarianism legislation, and the command/control regulations stand squarely in the way of our economy (and in turn our working class citizens) prospering.

The super-rich and governing classes will be fine regardless.

@CBOtrader

The only real statement I take issue with is the one regarding Michelle Obama. The number of people required when any president goes anywhere is massive. It's just the way it goes. Perhaps there were more than necessary here? I'm not sure what she was doing and haven't looked this information up, but anything to help restore the name of America to the world is something good. It's a minor cost in the over all view of things and just something to nit pick about.

The difference between voters in the US and 3rd world countries is that the US population is by and large very educated and has enough of an educated base to help the uneducated. It might not seem like it when we watch jerry springer, or watch people dig themselves into debt but the average American is so far above the educational levels of 3rd world countries that it isn't funny. In those countries village elders and/or religious personal have 100% control as seen in the last Pakistan elections. The religious leaders in all those little villages and tribes pushed the current "taliban" party into power over there. It wasn't angry people in Karachi voting them in, they were voting for parties that would make their lives better, while the religous zealots pushed for what is little more than a taliban extension into power. They had no way to stop it either. This was back in 2002, while I was visiting friends I got to watch it happen first hand. That by the way is why Musraff(sp) didn't turn over power like he had promised, because the taliban WERE voted into power. He saw where that was going.

So when people think we're one step away from a 3rd world country, I ignore it. We have plenty of room to stop ourselves, and we will. It's just that the time hasn't come. We need to be pushed to the brink before we take real strong action, and that is a typical human nature found everywhere.

Bap33 says

His biggest haters dont watch the show ...

I've watched the show. I'm not a hater. I pity him because he's truly insane, imho. His arguments don't make any sense. They are worthy of the tinfoil hat crowd. The arguments go in circles and diverge on tangents that make me wonder if he has had a psychotic break recently.

The fact that there are a few thousand loyal Fox viewers who consider him to be a genius and worthy of following makes me question their sanity.

But, do I hate him? No. Pity is more the feeling that I experience whenever I've watched Beck on Fox without the lens of MSNBC commentators. It's painful watching him and I'll never understand why he is still on the air.

Oh, and we agree on Stern. I've never understood that man's appeal.

Oh and oh, we also agree on Big Bird, Mr. Rogers, and School House Rock. My favorite School House Rock was "Interplanet Janet." She's a Galaxy girl.

kentm .... I honestly don't know what point you were attempting to make. I'm sure there is one, but I couldn't find it.

Michinaga says

I’m telling you, folks, Japan for the next 20 years is just what hardworking, diligent, competent, thrifty Americans need, particularly the under-40 generation. Slightly higher unemployment (no make-work jobs for incompetents), lower real estate prices (everything becomes affordable), mild deflation (allows the young to save their money to buy that RE). This is infinitely better than the semi-hyper inflation that Bernanke and his cronies seem determined to destroy US savers with.
“Lost Icosade: USA” — bring it on!

Preach on.

Rayray is just throwing out chum here folks. There's nothing to see here. Move along...

pkennedy says

The only real statement I take issue with is the one regarding Michelle Obama. The number of people required when any president goes anywhere is massive.

Michelle Obama went to Spain with 750 people, at a cost to taxpayers of $3.5 million per day. This is exactly the type of wasteful, egotistical behavior that people of the world have learned to expect in their disgust of the US. Ask yourself this: Do you think Nelson Mandela would allow a member of the South African government, or even a leader of the UN to travel with such an entourage? I would say this is exactlt the type of waste which we should "nit pick" about. This is a $50 million microcosm of government waste.

The million dollar question: Is this a Wells or Wachovia originated mortgage?

CBOEtrader says

Michelle Obama went to Spain with 750 people, at a cost to taxpayers of $3.5 million per day

Source please ?

This is from the NY Times.

Officials said some reports of the trip had been exaggerated. Mrs. Obama is not traveling with 40 friends, one official said, but with two friends and four of their daughters, as well as a couple of aides and a couple of advance staff members. The staff is with her because she will pay a courtesy call on King Juan Carlos and Queen Sofía on the island of Majorca on Sunday before flying home to Washington.

You must be kidding CBOETrader. And it's impossible to estimate the PR value, or the value to her, given the pressures of their lives.

From what I've read, Glen Beck is a recovering alcoholic and substance abuser who suffers from Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder.
Also, he has a 50/50 chance of losing his eyesight due to an inherited genetic condition. To top it off, he's a former stand up comic or possible still is. (no offense to my right ring peeps)
His audience seems to be people who are interested in purchasing gold, according to what I've seen.
He doesn't annoy me, but neither does Rosie O'Donnell.
If they want to rant, let them rant. It's cheap medicine for their conditions.

marcus says

CBOEtrader says

Michelle Obama went to Spain with 750 people, at a cost to taxpayers of $3.5 million per day

Source please ?

Every source qualifies its numbers as "estimates". From what I can tell this one is coming in at the high end of the range. I will concede that point, and agree that 750 people is an exaggeration.

You know, this Wells Fargo deal is what they are doing with commercial real estate too. But Japan R Us.

Question about this: What if the lady has to sell before the house bounces back to be able to pay off the defered money? Is she a prisoner of her house? Jingle it and move on.

Nomograph says

succesful

Nomograph says

climates in then entire world

I just came up with a great idea for a business and I won't even need much in the way of start up capital. I'm offering a spell check service for Patrick.net and am hoping to sign up my first client. Care to guess who that might be? LOL

I have no source for this, but I think Michelle "Marie Antoinette" Obama might have said, at one time or another (but probably when she was on vacation in Spain) "Let them eat cake." Please don't ask for a source. At this point, it's only a rumor.

RayAmerica says

I just came up with a great idea for a business and I won’t even need much in the way of start up capital. I’m offering a spell check service for Patrick.net and am hoping to sign up my first client

Will it include grammar too? If so, here's my suggestion:

RayAmerica says

You sound prejudice,

RayAmerica says

I can tell you’ve tried to get a Guvment job and was turned down

RayAmerica says

Is that too much to aks for?

simchaland says

Rayray is just throwing out chum here folks. There’s nothing to see here. Move along…

Never had it. Never will.

RayAmerica says

“Let them eat cake.” Please don’t ask for a source. At this point, it’s only a rumor.

Either i am f*cked up, or Ray is actually becoming funny.

I must surmise that very very few people do not heart mikey. Scream it in your mind. "I heart mikey!"

thunderlips11 says

Beck is just another Dry Drunk who has lost the ability to see the Grey area in between Black and White.

Sounds right on. Amazing the following though,...right ?

Yo, Ray-Ray , I vote for this thread for being the lamest waste of bits in a long time. And that's saying a lot.

I love Glen Beck because he's like a real life version of Howard Beale.

Without people like him, they could probably only air The Daily Show twice a week.

mikey says

He doesn’t annoy me, but neither does Rosie O’Donnell.

I think this will be on a T-shirt one day

marcus says

Either i am f*cked up, or Ray is actually becoming funny.

It's a moment of clarity (on your part) but it'll pass.

lyoungblood says

Yeah I can see why the banks are doing this - they will avoid principal write-down as much as possible because of the bank failures it would cause.
I wonder how many years they can continue to keep the beach ball in the air before the entire system collapses? Or will the banks just keep the bad assets on their books for decades and we’ll see Japan all over again for the next 20 years?

Banks are in denial just like home owners and Govt. USA have fun for another 10-15 years.

I think the term "follower" is not correct for most right-wingers, such as myself. That term and philos is more of a left-winger application of life, in my experience. A right-minded person is less likely to "follow" a public talking head blindly, where as the left is full of examples of exactly that. I'm not saying there are not examples of both personality types on both sides of the isle, I'm suggesting that the majority of the follower types are of the left-minded sort. This results in the left looking like there is more unity on most issues, but the truth is there is is not really more unity, there is just less value placed on individual thought vs the group-think. Since group-think really is a type of unity, the perception is a more unified group.

On the right there is a much greater value placed on the "individual" aspect of life IMHO. The aspect could be about rights, duties, thoughts, ect. And the end result of this right-mined thought is a group that tends to gel best against a threat to the individual aspect of any matter. The right also realizes the liberties that allow the individual aspect to survive is also the birth place to most freedom damaging aspects, aspects that can only be fostered or countered by individuals at a private level. Some history items may suggest that the left wants to effect these aspects by forced behavior through threat, IE liberty removal and thought police ex: Hate Crime, Social Justice, PC, ect. It could be said that these left-minded actions and atitiudes are trying to effect the individual aspect of American life. If you feel the right wants to effect this aspect too, and not just work for it's survival, please share an example (just an example or two would be cool with me). Thanks.

I think this basically sums up my feelings...

Good riddance...

And one final send off note, I've been waiting for relevant moment to post it, but its probably not coming so here it is anyway, too good to let go...

http://www.humanistsofutah.org/2002/WhyCantIOwnACanadian_10-02.html

Dr. Laura Schlessinger is a radio personality who dispenses advice to people who call in to her radio show. Recently, she said that, as an observant Orthodox Jew, homosexuality is an abomination according to Leviticus 18:22 and cannot be condoned under any circumstance. The following is an open letter to Dr. Laura penned by a east coast resident, which was posted on the Internet. It's funny, as well as informative:

Dear Dr. Laura:

Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law. I have learned a great deal from your show, and try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination. End of debate. I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some of the other specific laws and how to follow them:

When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord - Lev.1:9. The problem is my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?

I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?

I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanliness - Lev.15:19- 24. The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.

Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?

I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself?

A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination - Lev. 11:10, it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this?

Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here?

Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev. 19:27. How should they die?

I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?

My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev. 19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? - Lev.24:10-16. Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family affair like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)

I know you have studied these things extensively, so I am confident you can help. Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal and unchanging.

Your devoted fan,
Jim

I, for one, feel that it's about time that we all owned a Canadian. I'd choose Jim Carrey, because I'd sit around all day long laughing my ass off.

thunderlips11 says

Didn’t Bush spend every other week in his Texas Ranch? I believe he holds the all-time record for vacations

I don't think that any president really stops working, even Bush.

Nomograph says

Sitting around on the Internet all day complaining about welfare is a losing proposition.

Are you accusing someone of wasting their time on the interenet? Isn't that what all of us are doing here? Besides, you have posted only 10% less than Ray.

kentm says

http://www.humanistsofutah.org/2002/WhyCantIOwnACanadian_10-02.html

This letter was fantastic!

Question for the more bible/torah inclined folks here: Is Leviticus the only place that says homosexuality is wrong in the new/old testament? I suppose there is the suspect interpretation of God smiting the Sodomites becasue of their gay sex--a very self-serving interpretation if you read the passages.

Bap33 says

I think the term “follower” is not correct for most right-wingers, such as myself. That term and philos is more of a left-winger application of life, in my experience. A right-minded person is less likely to “follow” a public talking head blindly, where as the left is full of examples of exactly that. I’m not saying there are not examples of both personality types on both sides of the isle, I’m suggesting that the majority of the follower types are of the left-minded sort. This results in the left looking like there is more unity on most issues, but the truth is there is is not really more unity, there is just less value placed on individual thought vs the group-think. Since group-think really is a type of unity, the perception is a more unified group.
On the right there is a much greater value placed on the “individual” aspect of life IMHO. The aspect could be about rights, duties, thoughts, ect. And the end result of this right-mined thought is a group that tends to gel best against a threat to the individual aspect of any matter. The right also realizes the liberties that allow the individual aspect to survive is also the birth place to most freedom damaging aspects, aspects that can only be fostered or countered by individuals at a private level. Some history items may suggest that the left wants to effect these aspects by forced behavior through threat, IE liberty removal and thought police ex: Hate Crime, Social Justice, PC, ect. It could be said that these left-minded actions and atitiudes are trying to effect the individual aspect of American life. If you feel the right wants to effect this aspect too, and not just work for it’s survival, please share an example (just an example or two would be cool with me). Thanks.

Hi Bap33, I'm Kent. I live on earth, what planet do you hail from and how long have you been traveling?

Actually please start a new thread with this note rather than tuck it away under Dr. Laura. I'm trying to parse it but have to admit I'm a bit lost and I'm curious to see where it might go if its granted the dignity of its own thread. My main interest is "is there any possibility of common ground between left and right if its viewed from this point of view", "what is left and right and do the terms actually have any relevance" and "what place do facts play in the formulation of personal philosophies"?

geeeze Kent. Just disagree bro, don't go postal. It's all good. I'm not intellectual enough to defend my personal gut feelings much more than that. Sorry for that.

Not postal, just playing around, though I guess somewhat aggressively so... because I basically I have no way to relate what you've written to what I think is the generally accepted thread of politics and history, ie reality.

So I'm serious about following your note with its own thread because I'm I'm honestly curious about these notions you've laid out - its a pretty central issue, perception, and its important to me where this comes from, what the basis of saying such things are. I could learn something.

So lets let Dr. Laura rest and if you can please break down line by line in its own thread what you wrote and give examples. But I do want to say again one of my fav quotes: "you can have your own opinions but you can't have your own facts"...